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shamone
03-05-2012, 15:16
Hi, Just a quick one. My mate has a little bit of MPA that we were gonna test at the weekend. From what we have read, smoking (or vaporising) it is the best method. Now since neither of us have a vape or a crack pipe, we were gonna smoke it on foil, but I have always heard you should definitely have the foil one way up as opposed to the other. Is it shiny side up (ie. the side the product is on) or shiny side down (the side the flame touches).

Cheers guys
x

endlessnameless
03-05-2012, 15:29
Shiny-side down.

Also, before you use the foil - be sure to run the flame from a lighter over both sides of the foil to burn away any chemicals that may have been used to lubricate it. Run the lighter over each side once or twice, not too much as this will weaken the sheet which will eventually develop holes from wear and tear. Not all brands of foil have this lubrication, but it can do no harm to ensure there's definitely nothing other than the desired chemical being ingested.

shamone
03-05-2012, 15:32
Sweet, thanks mate.

FlippingTop
03-05-2012, 15:32
when I tried MPA via this method I nearly threw up, it tasted SOO bad.

Many other people do not report this however so my batch may have been cut / something else completely. Just have a bin nearby :)

endlessnameless
03-05-2012, 15:33
Stay safe and enjoy.

Albion
03-05-2012, 15:39
Shiny-side down.

Also, before you use the foil - be sure to run the flame from a lighter over both sides of the foil to burn away any chemicals that may have been used to lubricate it. Not all brands of foil have this lubrication, but it can do no harm to ensure there's definitely nothing other than the desired chemical being ingested.

Perfect advice!

Shiny side has all sorts of shite in it that you wouldn't wish for your worst enemy to be breathing in.

33Hz
03-05-2012, 16:02
Perfect advice!

Shiny side has all sorts of shite in it that you wouldn't wish for your worst enemy to be breathing in.

um, no...

Albion
03-05-2012, 16:04
Wait is it the other way around?

endlessnameless
03-05-2012, 16:10
Depends on how much hatred you harbor for your worst enemy really; personally I wouldn't wish any ilk of poisoning on anyone.

Just to avoid confusion - shiny side down.

33Hz
03-05-2012, 16:19
Depends on how much hatred you harbor for your worst enemy really; personally I wouldn't wish any ilk of poisoning on anyone.

Just to avoid confusion - shiny side down.

Are you sure this isn't an urban myth?

People used to always go on about this when we'd do buckets as teenagers but I was later told that it has nothing to do with with any chemicals being present, and is actually because two sheets are pressed together because it's easier to work with a larger thickness. When they are separated the inside surface is dull while the outside is shiny. I could be wrong though...

endlessnameless
03-05-2012, 16:32
No, I'm not at all sure if this isn't an urban myth; I tend to apply Murphys' Law when it comes to anything equally or as serious as drug use.
Hell I'll apply it to anything that involves any hint of a risk at all; what harm can it do? None. How many potential deaths could it prevent? Countless.

33Hz
03-05-2012, 16:46
what harm can it do?

No harm, just seems a bit unnecessary.


How many potential deaths could it prevent?

None. ;)

effie
03-05-2012, 16:49
Thanks man, was just writing a guide on UK heroin for the Other Drugs forum and was explaining how to chase - I forgot to say shiny side down, trying to make it idiot-proof so want to include all the info I can :)

I've done some research into the burning off thing (will try to dig up sources later if I can) and UK aluminium foil (food grade) is often coated with vegetable oil on the shiny side. Heating it with a flame would indeed burn it off but I can't find any evidence that inhaling the small amount of fumes from the burnt veg oil it is dangerous and the govt report on promoting foil as a safer ROA makes no mention of it, although it does mention the risk of ingesting harmful levels of aluminium (and concludes that the evidence shows this does not occur). Full report here: http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/publications/drugs/acmd1/foil-report

I personally don't usually burn the foil off but many do and it's not going to do any harm, certainly :)

botfly
03-05-2012, 17:30
there is no coating or anything else on household alu foil afaik. one side is shiny because when it's rolled they put two sheets together to stop them tearing and the rollers make the outer sides smooth and shiny while the layers of foil facing eachother come out with a matte finish.
I watched how they make it on how it's made they basically get a big fuck off block of aluminium then roll it for miles until it becomes paper thin.
But personally I'd use the shiny side because shiny things reflect heat better no?
The only thing I'd worry about is Alzheimers but taking drugs is probably worse than anything foil can do anyway.

effie
03-05-2012, 17:54
^ the Alzheimers thing is likely a myth, the evidence is circumstantial at best.. http://alzheimers.org.uk/site/scripts/documents_info.php?documentID=99

Can't find the sources about aluminium foil - it definitely did have a thin coating of oil at one point but that might be in the past.

At least part of the smoke etc you see coming off foil when you burn it off is soot from the flame. I'm unconvinced it serves any helpful purpose I have to say, but I guess without hard evidence it is hard to say for definite.

Totally agree that taking drugs is probably a bigger concern haha, plus all the cuts that are in heroin.. and unresearched RCs (wonderful misnomer) like MPA. Most peeps here happily take those, so I don't think worrying over a possibly oily coating on the foil is logical really..

monstanoodle
03-05-2012, 22:31
there is no coating or anything else on household alu foil afaik. one side is shiny because when it's rolled they put two sheets together to stop them tearing and the rollers make the outer sides smooth and shiny while the layers of foil facing eachother come out with a matte finish.
I watched how they make it on how it's made they basically get a big fuck off block of aluminium then roll it for miles until it becomes paper thin.
But personally I'd use the shiny side because shiny things reflect heat better no?
The only thing I'd worry about is Alzheimers but taking drugs is probably worse than anything foil can do anyway.

That! But the Alzheimers stuff is just silliness created by who-knows-who for who-knows-what-reason.
Likely an Anti-Drugs person.
Plus - "Shiny side" has obviously less influence when it comes to friction on a substance.

All the "Shiny side is evil / has evil sprayed upon it / will make you want to hump your sister" stuff is urban legend ;)

effie
04-05-2012, 02:49
I have always used non-shiny side except once when I used shiny and it burnt my gear haha.. may have just been that I am used to doing it the other way (or was in a daze..)

You're probably right and it doesn't make a difference but eh, non shiny side up works well and I'm sticking to that. Not burning the foil off though.

Anyway, my guide for OD says non-shiny and mentions this debate in some detail now so thank you, this has been a very useful thread ;)

shamone
04-05-2012, 03:14
Glad it was of some help to more people than just myself!

strungout2010
04-05-2012, 06:26
When im out working i often turn the foil over clean it with my t - shirt and put my beetle back on it. Done this for a very very long time , and never noticed any difference.

But I have developed 2 heads , 4 arms, and talk in duck ! Is this normal ?

strungout2010
04-05-2012, 06:29
Quack , quack

blondin
04-05-2012, 15:22
Perfect advice!

Shiny side has all sorts of shite in it that you wouldn't wish for your worst enemy to be breathing in.


Nonsense foil has nothing on it unless it made for that purpose (baco has lube on some of its products)its an urban myth that you should only smoke one side or the other - ive smoked on foil for 30 years on and off and its not effected me,if you manage to heat it up to the melting point of aluminium you might have an issue but i think thats about 1200c.
As this question does the rounds at various boards regularly i got the following info a few years ago but cant remember where but it was a journal of some sort..........

What Is Known About Aluminum Foil

Aluminum foil is very pure- in fact it is 99.9% pure, with the .1% being various residues from the manufacturing process that are burned off at low temperature and other impurities found within the material.

Humans contact aluminum from various sources throughout their everyday routines. Common uses for aluminum are: food (naturally occurring) & food additives, antacids & other pharmaceuticals, cooking utensils, soil, drinking water, air, and electronics.

Aluminum has a shiny and a dull side- there is no difference to the two sides, this is caused by the manufacturing of aluminum. The sheets are too thin to cut one at a time, so they cut two pieces at a time, causing a shiny and dull side.

Average human intake of aluminum is around 3grams (a little higher inCanada because the drinking water is treated with higher concentrations of aluminum).

Aluminum, at temperatures below melting point, does not give off gas or vapor.


What Is Alzheimer’s Disease?

Alzheimer’s Disease is a progressive disease that affects the brain- causing mental deterioration, disorientation, depression, memory lapses.


When studies have been perform on patients with Alzheimer’s Disease scientist have found that patients have high concentration (10-30 times the normal) of Aluminum in their systems.

Studies were conducted in order to find out if people who drink water with high concentrations of aluminum had a higher risk at developing Alzheimer’s Disease. These studies did show there was an increased risk- HOWEVER, studies have been done where individuals drank water without being treated with aluminum and found the same risk of developing Alzheimer’s.

These two test indicate that there may be genetic reasons why some individuals develop Alzheimer’s.

Studies performed on patients have not found a common factor in the development of Alzheimer’s Disease

Scientist do not know if Alzheimer’s Disease causes higher concentrations of aluminum, or if it is caused by high concentrations of aluminum.


Smoking Using Aluminum Foil

Most brands of aluminum foil (Bacofoil Wrap with the anti-stick coating and similar brands being the exception), are untreated and remain 99.9% aluminum (again with the .1% being residues and other agents in the manufacturing process)

In order to inhale aluminum it would have to be changed from a solid to a vapor. This requires a lot of heat. More heat than what it produced by a butane lighter. A butane lighter is not even capable of melting aluminum, if a lighter fails to melt the aluminum, it will not be able to change the aluminum into a vapor.

strungout2010
04-05-2012, 15:32
Well done blondin. That's kind of what I was getting at , but YOU Word it so much better than me.

effie
04-05-2012, 16:25
^ yeah thank you blondin, that was really informative :)

I guess the stuff I found about foil having a coating of oil was referring to bacofoil.

Mr Smokes Blunts.
04-05-2012, 16:35
Logically speaking, how on earth would they get away with putting a coating that becomes dangerous when heated on foil when the primary purpose of foil is for it to touch food while it is being heated? Come on...

effie
04-05-2012, 17:01
^ yeah indeed :D and the fact that a report looking into potential dangers makes no mention of it, plus blondin's info.. yeah. Can't see it being a concern :)

endlessnameless
04-05-2012, 17:06
But personally I'd use the shiny side because shiny things reflect heat better no?


Shiny surfaces might reflect light better, but isnt it lighter coloured areas that reflect heat better?

Acidtek
04-05-2012, 17:17
surely this can be closed!!

SHINY SIDE DOWN



















unless your desperate!

knock
04-05-2012, 17:19
Shiny surfaces might reflect light better, but isnt it lighter coloured areas that reflect heat better?

Light and (radiated) heat are both electromagnetic radiation. Heat is infra-red radiation, i.e. lower frequency/longer wavelength than the dark reds which start the visible spectrum (infra-red:ROYGBIV:ultra-violet)

What reflects light well will tend to reflect heat well too.

Lighter colour does indeed mean more reflected visible-spectrum electromagnetic radiation.

Shiny/mirror-like means the surface is very smooth and the reflected ER is not being "scattered" in the way a rough surface would.

Shininess is probably not that important in terms of returned energy, but it does mean more of it is sent straight back from where it came, so to speak...

Chinup would probably be able to provide a more complete answer!

Acidtek
04-05-2012, 17:28
think you provided the answer perfectly knock! :)

Shambles
04-05-2012, 23:24
I use both sides. Pretty sure it makes nary a fuck of difference. I do, however, burn off the fumes before use. Force of habit urban legend or not. Some brands give off fuckin' loadsa smoke and it tastes of shit so on that basis alone I burn it off. Doubt there are actually any nasties involved really. But it does taste of shit.

Incidentally, I vaguely recall that foil gives off fume when heated cos aluminium oxidises when exposed to... well... oxygen. Dunno how relevant that is but is as close to chemistry knowledge as I get.

PS: As for smoking MPA, I didn't rate it as an ROA at all and I chase everything and anything as a rule. Plugging was the best ROA by far. Possibly not the ideal when indulging with a friend though. Depending on the friend.

effie
05-05-2012, 01:22
^ def agree on plugging, get a bit of warmth and fuzziness that way rather than the cold physical stimulation.. exception being the first hit which, if you do it right, can be pretty fun :)

botfly
05-05-2012, 01:28
^warmth and fuzziness in your ass?;)
I might try plugging next time I next get some meph to get more mileage out of it. i know the dose is supposed to be less and more effective but does it last as long?
I love sniffing though the burn is very reassuring, never tried chasing anything I think i would heave before I got the chance to absorb anything of worth.

Shambles
05-05-2012, 01:33
That would make you just the kinda friend for a plugging party then, Ms Eff =D

Drugplug ftw <3

I genuinely do think many a fella (and probly a few ladygals too) are missing out on Greatness for the sake of a bit of embedded mindfuckery.

Just take the plunge(r) folks - once you plug you never look back. Mainly cos you know where it goes after the first time.

Botfly: Name like that and no bumfun?!? Do eeeet!!! Meph is decent plugged (as far as meph goes) but no real advantage over oral dosing other than the rush. I'd avoid smoking it like the plague though. Unless you like the idea of smoking Toilet Duck combined with the feeling of imminent heart failure.

effie
05-05-2012, 01:36
Haha I am a big advocate of plugging :D No shame in it, it's a great ROA! <3

Botfly, as a general rule if something hits you faster and harder chances are it won't have the same duration (think of a steep peaked curve as opposed to a slow gentle curve) but I've actually not plugged meph so don't know much about that one :D

botfly
05-05-2012, 02:04
m
That would make you just the kinda friend for a plugging party then, Ms Eff =D

Drugplug ftw <3

I genuinely do think many a fella (and probly a few ladygals too) are missing out on Greatness for the sake of a bit of embedded mindfuckery.

Just take the plunge(r) folks - once you plug you never look back. Mainly cos you know where it goes after the first time.

Botfly: Name like that and no bumfun?!? Do eeeet!!! Meph is decent plugged (as far as meph goes) but no real advantage over oral dosing other than the rush. I'd avoid smoking it like the plague though. Unless you like the idea of smoking Toilet Duck combined with the feeling of imminent heart failure.

Apply to bot and fly! I think it's my destiny. The smell and taste of my current DOC is bad enough as it is so a burnt version is out of the question. Always wondered about meph crack though that would be crazy.

Haha I am a big advocate of plugging :D No shame in it, it's a great ROA! <3

Botfly, as a general rule if something hits you faster and harder chances are it won't have the same duration (think of a steep peaked curve as opposed to a slow gentle curve) but I've actually not plugged meph so don't know much about that one :D

Sounds kind of like the sniffing route but with more acrobatics and awkwardness. I'm hoping it won't burn as much or it will be a pain in the ass har har. If it lasts a bit longer than sniffing but with a similar rush and lower dosage then it might be worth a try.

knock
05-05-2012, 02:15
I'm hoping it won't burn as much or it will be a pain in the ass har har.
Since you dissolve your chemical before squirting it up your hole, there's more volume of solution than there would be of powder (powder + water rather than just powder).

So the solution is less concentrated than the powder. So less painful!

effie
05-05-2012, 02:24
^ yeah :D someone raised that point about ethylphenidate too, and I liked it :)

knock
05-05-2012, 02:28
Aye, that's where I remember it from! Ethylphenidate and camfetamine are both quite burny, I caused myself a painful injury trying to dose camfetamine sublingually - especially annoying seeing as it's a very straight stim. But I've plugged loads and my rectum is still in one piece. A ring-piece as we say up here.

effie
05-05-2012, 02:34
Haha :D

What did you think of camfetamine? I did try some but it was ages ago when I was not at my most.. with it haha, and I really don't remember if it was worth bothering with or not..

knock
05-05-2012, 02:37
Not recreational but I've found it very useful for staying alert, like a smoother, longer lasting caffeine. Gets jittery in larger doses though, like over 100mg.

botfly
05-05-2012, 02:38
Since you dissolve your chemical before squirting it up your hole, there's more volume of solution than there would be of powder (powder + water rather than just powder).

So the solution is less concentrated than the powder. So less painful!

I see, so how long does it take to absorb sufficiently or does it depend on how much water you use? I imagine you get a slight diarrohea feeling afterwards?

knock
05-05-2012, 02:47
I see, so how long does it take to absorb sufficiently or does it depend on how much water you use? I imagine you get a slight diarrohea feeling afterwards?

Plugging is normally pretty fucking quick. It depends on the drug though, and perhaps the person. When I was gorging on o-desmethyltramadol, I tried various ROAs (everything except needles). Nothing was as fast or as strong as up the bum. I found sniffing a complete waste of time and drug. Plugged doses were felt in a few minutes and peaked in 30, whereas if I swallowed it, sometimes I waited an hour or two to peak!

When you plug it's going straight into your bloodstream through your arse veins!

Sometimes there is a slight "need a shit" feeling after plugging but it's mild and passes in a few minutes.

Always pays to clear your bowels first.

Shambles
05-05-2012, 02:49
Plugdrugs generally absorb in ~5mins from insquirtion to peak, I'd say. Max. Many are quicker than that. Zero pain either. The nerve-endings tend to be around the entrance rather than an inch or so inside - this is why anal sex only hurts sans lube ;)

As for "meph crack" - tis shite. Tried it meself and was... exactly like vaping straight meph: chemical fumes/borderline heart failure/nary euphoria as even a side bonus. I was never a fan of meph but oral is by far the best ROA overall with anal a close second if ya like a rush. (IV is too icky to be worth the distinctly meh rush)

PS: Ethylphenidate and 6-APB are the only chems so far to cause any significant case of diarrhoea for me.

botfly
05-05-2012, 02:59
Cool should hopefully be experimenting with some anal mephage tomorrow. Will report my analysis tomorrow.

p.s I find the meph euphoria grows character the more you get addicted to it. The first couple times I found it somewhat hollow like you do but after a few weeks of abuse the euphoria became delicious. It's a grower unfortunately. fucking dirty shit though which is hwy I only have 1g around at a time.

effie
05-05-2012, 03:00
I like how a discussion on smoking on foil has turned into one on plugging.. two of my favourite ROAs (often not with the same drug for both though) <3

knock
05-05-2012, 03:04
Plugdrugs generally absorb in ~5mins from insquirtion to peak, I'd say.

I'm sure you'll agree that when you say "peak" you don't mean peak effects but perhaps peak concentration in the bloodstream. For example, alpha-methyltryptamine - when I've plugged, it's been a good couple of hours, more like four, to peak effects, but the drugs would have cleared my rectum within a few minutes.

Shambles
05-05-2012, 04:06
Ya. Techypoint but an accurate one, Knock. Ya clever fuck ya :D

Was meaning that for the "average" first-time plugger they'll be totally twatted within 5 mins generally. Those that plug more esoteric than the "norm" drugs tend to be more familiar with the whole plugged dynamic so I skipped over such things.

Do believe I spotted a thang 'bout plugging on the BL frontpage in the Wiki bit wot I never look at. Guidelines to how each and every substance affects one when analised would be a boon probly. Really do think a great many are missing out on true drugmagictimes. And that many could be proper arseraped by one or two (or three or four) chems if they think all react in precisely the same way as the usual suspects...

As a rule, I tend to suggest that any first-time plugger should expect double the effect from half the dose... rapidly... but that's a very broad generalisation. Opies tend to have most kick when bumrushed. Stims come a close second. Psyches vary wildly but are mostly along the lines of stims... mostly... So say I anyway.

BecomingJulie
05-05-2012, 08:21
I've always run the stuff on the shiny side because that's how my Partner-in-Crime taught me. She used to run the lighter flame across it before melting on but with our favourite brands of foil, nothing obviously burns off so she doesn't anymore, and neither do I.

Might try running on the dull side, just for an experiment.

Shambles
05-05-2012, 08:25
As mentioned, I use both cos it makes more or less fuck all difference. I do tend to favour shiny side up really though. *Substances* just run smoother on the shiny side. Maybe. Or not. Habit innit.

Any of y'all get creative with your trails? Used to know folks who could sign their name in scagtrails on tinny. Britain's Got Talent material and no mistake <3

BecomingJulie
05-05-2012, 08:55
Any of y'all get creative with your trails? Used to know folks who could sign their name in scagtrails on tinny. Britain's Got Talent material and no mistake <3Ah, yes, I went through a phase of trying to draw things with beetle turds. Made some nice pentagrams and even a "Play School"-style house (requiring cracking off the beetle between windows). My PiC thinks my usual (OCD-driven) spiral pattern is somewhat artistic. Compared to her messes, it is :) Not noticed much difference in terms of the high, but the gear around at the time wasn't the most stonacious.