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  • AADD Moderators: swilow | Vagabond696

American soldiers on speed

VooDoo Gurl

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 7, 2001
Messages
191
There was an incident in Afghanistan last year where American pilots killed Canadians in a friendly fire accident. (Ok, I know that I'm posting this in the Australian Drug Forum but I thought people here might be interested in this since I know a lot of people here and I know that Australians and Canadians often have similar views about Americans).
Anyway, here's the story. Ironic that the westerm country with the greatest war on drugs sees it as perfectly ok to give drugs to people with the capacity to use deadly force but spend huge amounts of money convincing the general public that drugs are evil...
U.S. pilots took amphetamines an hour before 'friendly fire' incident
WASHINGTON - ABC News says it has obtained cockpit voice recordings of the U.S. pilots involved in the 'friendly fire' incident in Afghanistan that killed four Canadian soldiers and injured eight others. The report also says drugs may have played a role.
The report says both pilots had taken amphetamines about an hour before the incident.
The drugs, commonly known as 'go-pills,' are standard issue in the U.S. Air Force to help pilots stay awake during long combat missions.
The pilots involved in the 'friendly fire' incident, Maj. Harry Schmidt and Maj. William Umbach, say they were told by their superiors they could be found unfit to fly unless they took the pills.
On the night of April 17, both pilots took the pills before their mission over Afghanistan.
It was then, under the full influence of the amphetamine pills, that the two pilots spotted weapons fired near the Kandahar military base.
"OK, so I've got some men on a road and it looks like a piece of artillery firing at us. I am rolling in in self-defence," Schmidt says on the tape.
Schmidt had been told to hold fire by controllers in an AWAC plane, but he was convinced he and Umbach were under attack. "Bombs away, cranking left, lasers on. Shack," he said as he opened fire.
It was only after Maj. Schmidt dropped the bomb that he was told the target was not the enemy, that there were "friendlies in Kandahar."
Schmidt hit a squad of Canadian soldiers conducting a live-fire exercise. Four died, eight were badly injured.
Schmidt and Umbach are facing four counts each of manslaughter and dereliction of duty. Now their legal teams are questioning whether the amphetamines the pilots took played a part in the deaths.
Eugene Carroll says it's nothing new. He's a former U.S. Navy pilot who was given pills to juice him up for long flights. "It's certainly something that has to be considered: are the drugs enhancing safety or are they creating situations that are dangerous in and of themselves?" he said.
The U.S. military says the drugs are controlled and has ruled out the 'go-pills' as being responsible for the incident.
Preliminary court martial proceedings against the two F-16 pilots begin next month. If convicted they could face up to 64 years in prison.
And the original article is from the Canadian Broadcasting Corporation: American pilots on speed
[ 21 December 2002: Message edited by: VooDoo Gurl ]
 
As much as I don't agree with much of the anti-drug propaganda, I think its a really bad idea for someone flying a fighter jet to be on speed. Considering the whole edginess and aggression factor alone...
 
A different version of the same story was brought up in this thread:
NEWS: CNN.com 26 Oct 01: Report: Caffeine keeps soldiers sharp
It is an interesting issue though. In a war situation to keep jets in the air eventually the situation will arise as to whether or not to send an exhausted pilot back out again. What is worse: A pilot who has slept less than 4 hours in 3 days or a pilot on stimulants?
 
The caffeine story is different from this story. This is about the canadian troops that were bombed by americans in afghanistan. And from the sound of it, they aren't talking about caffeine in this report. And since flying a fighter jet in enemy territory has to be stressful enough, I'm thinking throwing a stimulant into the mix isn't the greatest idea.
I can totally understand how the stimulant could have affected the pilots in this situation - speed makes you edgy and paranoid, and thought that they were under-fire. They probably couldn't make a calm decision to follow their orders not to attack, and instead let the edginess and paranoia take hold and attacked anyway - killing the canadian troops.
But regardless of whether it is a "good idea" or not, I think voodoo girl makes a great point: the fact that the american military condone the drug use while their own government is the most anti-drugs in the world is incredibly ironic.
 
mort: chill. if you open the caffeine thread, and scroll down to this post you'll see that the story is there. it just happened that this thread was where all my research about speed and the military ended up. this story really shows the hypocrisy of the situation.
 
I would rather fighter pilots on low dose of the meth than on 4 cups of coffee. Meth does not induce aggression after prolonging wakefulness for shorter periods of time. High doses or prolonged have been known to produce aggressive and delusional behaviour, but this is usually an extreme. I think its more to do with a bad time bad place scenario.
http://www.airpower.maxwell.af.mil/airchronicles/apj/spr97/cornum.html
http://www.gene.ucl.ac.uk/bioethics/abstracts.html
http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0809/p01s04-usmi.html
http://www.thememoryhole.org/mil/pilot-speed.htm
Cheers,
 
JB: <chilled> I should've read a bit further down I guess ;)
 
From http://www.cbc.ca/stories/2002/12/21/clooney_021221
Grieving Canadians stunned U.S. pilots took drugs
Last Updated Sat, 21 Dec 2002 23:27:01
TORONTO - The family of a Canadian soldier killed in a U.S. bomb attack is dumbfounded by reports that American commanders let their pilots fly warplanes while on drugs.
INDEPTH: Canada's Casualties
Lawyers defending the two pilots say both men had been given amphetamines before climbing into their cockpits and killing a group of Canadian soldiers on a training exercise in Afghanistan in April.
Joyce Clooney
"I was surprised to hear that the military would allow people to be on narcotics," said Joyce Clooney, the grandmother of Pte. Richard Green, one of the four soldiers who died. Eight other Canadians were injured.
"You know, they tell people not to drink and drive, and then they give someone a pill like that and send them off in an airplane," she told CBC News on Saturday.
Word of the drug use surfaced Friday, when the lawyers were interviewed on the ABC News program 20/20.
Now look at how wrong many of the 'facts' in the various stories are, and have a good long laugh at the irony... the US Government it it's own victim in a war on drugs consisting largely of misinformation and scare tactics.
[ 22 December 2002: Message edited by: Jakoz ]
 
Dexedrine I think...
Can you imagine an amphetamine psychosis where you are convinced that everybody is out to kill you, and they actually are?
That said, I think that amphets for pilots would work if applied properly. While I have only a flimsy understanding of this issue, it seems that to shift blame to the drugs is legal scapegoating in this instance. It seems more like a foolish miscalculation and breifing failure than an action taken without mental culpability.
 
Originally posted by VooDoo Gurl:
The U.S. Military says the drugs are controlled and has ruled out the go-pills as being responsible for the incident.
this makes me want to bash someone. not only do they tell us that no drug is controllable (otherwise they'd legalise it and tax it?), but i'd like to see some poor bugger who'd been at fault in a car accident that killed someone pull that off.
"nah mate, it wasn't the drugs. i ruled them out." GRRRRRR!!!! this makes me so angry :/
just out of curiosity though.. what is the maximum period of time a pilot with these go-pills is to stay in the air?
i know if i was flying an f-16 for say 18 hours or something like that, i'd want some small pick-me-up, although i'm not saying i'd switch on the autopilot and snort a fullweight of wizz :)
ed: didn't have time to read other version of this story, so i may be parroting something from it..
the version of this story was basically identical only one interesting aspect of it was that it mentioned the pilots took a number of these pills up with them, and were allowed to take them at their own discretion.
to me that reads that they take a toolbox of pills up with em, crack it open when they feel like that immelman turn just wasn't fast enough, pop a few pills and go go go! *shrug* silly :)
[ 23 December 2002: Message edited by: Spinsta ]
 
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