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CaseFace
17-12-2010, 09:25
I wonder if kratom would work sublingually? Assuming it wouldn't be disgusting that is.


Anyway, gel caps seem to be the best ROA in my opinion. No brewing multiple times and no gagging on clumps of powder.

darkvein
17-12-2010, 09:36
by a significant tolerance I mean, I do on a daily basis:

If I'm doing 30 mg roxy's, then maybe 7-15 or so, which would be about 210-450 mgs of iv'd oxycodone, usually 2-4 at a time (30mgs each) plus I'd be wearing a 100mcg/h fent patch

if fentanyl, I wear 1 100mcg/h patch AND take 25mcg/h buccal in the morning, plus 25mcg/h buccal at night

keep in mind I am constantly wearing a 100mcg/h patch whether I'm doing fent OR oxycodone and on top of all that I take (swallow) maybe 3-6 percocet 10's a day as well

yeah so what I mean to say was, I have an absolutely horrendous habit and i want to get off of everything before I start my classes back up on January 5th. I'm gonna ask for suboxone I think at my next doc appt but I usually run out of meds a week early which is what just happened and on day 3 (i think) i ordered the kratom, then got it the day after going to the doctor (of course, thats just my luck)

now with that said, any more suggestions for dosage/roa?? please? especially roa cause I don't know what to do with this stuff

and I heard powdered was the best that's why I got it. maeng da was the only kind I saw until AFTER i ordered it

also, how do you store it/how long is it good for?

ps: my saying i got maeng da has nothing to do with the vendor I just was reiterating so experienced users might have an idea of the strength of the product I have, cause I'm asking about dosing.

and I do have sort of a weak stomach

Dankycodone
17-12-2010, 09:37
Grit weed is weed with glass shards on it. If u knew you were getting grit weed which obviously you would notice if you are a regular smoker why the fuck would you smoke it?

CaseFace
17-12-2010, 10:06
^^ Why the fuck would there be glass shards in weed in the first place?

sonicteamaajm
17-12-2010, 10:48
If I bought some bali katom powder, would it be effective if I just literally ate a couple of big spoons full of it? I have a pretty strong stomach and I won't mind the taste even though I have never tasted it before.

Would I get a decent buzz from it that way?

catcalls
17-12-2010, 14:30
Grit weed is weed with glass shards on it. If u knew you were getting grit weed which obviously you would notice if you are a regular smoker why the fuck would you smoke it?

Back then I had never heard of Grit Weed. I knew the weed was harsh, but the city I live in was literally flooded with grit weed, looking back now I realise what I was smoking. It's been a big problem in the UK for many years to date. That is one reason why I don't smoke weed anymore.

I much prefer kratom high anyways. I'm drinking some right now!

NeighborhoodThreat
17-12-2010, 15:51
@sonicteam

I've straight up eaten the powder before, and it did have an effect, but I nearly coughed it all up again and it left a horrible taste in my mouth that was only resolved by chugging water and then a good 20 seconds of Listerine.

Making the tea tastes better and has a better effect, at least in my experiences.

catcalls
17-12-2010, 15:58
@sonicteam

I've straight up eaten the powder before, and it did have an effect, but I nearly coughed it all up again and it left a horrible taste in my mouth that was only resolved by chugging water and then a good 20 seconds of Listerine.

Making the tea tastes better and has a better effect, at least in my experiences.

this

Dankycodone
17-12-2010, 22:53
^^ Why the fuck would there be glass shards in weed in the first place?

To make it look dank and also increase weight somewhat same reason people cut other drugs.

sonicteamaajm
19-12-2010, 04:34
@sonicteam

I've straight up eaten the powder before, and it did have an effect, but I nearly coughed it all up again and it left a horrible taste in my mouth that was only resolved by chugging water and then a good 20 seconds of Listerine.

Making the tea tastes better and has a better effect, at least in my experiences.

Okay, there is some good info here, thanks NT. I will try eating the powder first and then I will try the tea at a later time to compare the effects and will let you guys know what I think.

CaseFace
19-12-2010, 04:45
To make it look dank and also increase weight somewhat same reason people cut other drugs.

Jesus fuck. 8(


Legalize/regulate drugs already so this kind of shit doesn't happen.

NeighborhoodThreat
19-12-2010, 22:13
Yes sir.

I thought I would add this to the thread, I know it's a little off topic, but I, out of the blue, combined kratom and 2C-I (among other things) last night, and it was actually quite fun. The other things were clonazepam (somewhere around 1.5 or 2mg), lots of cannabis and some Jim Beam. The anti-anxiety effects of the clonazepam were enhanced by the kratom, it seemed like, resulting in a very dreamy, sedated but still certainly psychedelic experience.

I also noticed none of the stomach issues I usually get with 2C-I...

catcalls
19-12-2010, 23:19
My Kratom addiction has stabalised around 6 cups of tea a day. I'm really pleased with this. Today was the first day I only took 4 cups. I did not feel any high. I did fall asleep though. It seems, the longer you use Kratom, the more it sends you to sleep.

I hear Methadone users state the same. That is makes them want to sleep all day long.

NeighborhoodThreat
19-12-2010, 23:21
That's good though, how long were you going on six cups of tea a day?

catcalls
19-12-2010, 23:47
That's good though, how long were you going on six cups of tea a day?

Roughly one week. Maybe a couple days under?

Pegasus
19-12-2010, 23:58
Yeah, good point with the sleep and regular opiate use. I definitely agree. Bupe does it to me as well as the two you have listed.

catcalls
20-12-2010, 04:39
Yeah, good point with the sleep and regular opiate use. I definitely agree. Bupe does it to me as well as the two you have listed.

I'm only on 4mg daily of Subutex so I do not get the doped up effects any more. When I was on 8mg I'd throw up daily though roughly 2-4 hours after taking my meds.

darkvein
20-12-2010, 07:55
advice, pretty plz with lots o drugs on top ;)

CaseFace
20-12-2010, 08:02
I'm only on 4mg daily of Subutex so I do not get the doped up effects any more. When I was on 8mg I'd throw up daily though roughly 2-4 hours after taking my meds.
Clearly you were way over prescribed. I doubt if you need even 4mgs. What was your habit before suboxone?


advice, pretty plz with lots o drugs on top ;)

...What?

catcalls
20-12-2010, 08:08
Clearly you were way over prescribed. I doubt if you need even 4mgs. What was your habit before suboxone?



...What?

I was on roughly 6 points of heroin daily.

CaseFace
20-12-2010, 09:14
I'm surprised then. point being a .1 of tar right?

8 mgs was definitely too much but im surprised it made you puke because it's not *that* much over what you would have needed. Assuming tar isn't drastically inferior to north NJ powder though, which i assume that it is actually. So maybe it was way too much bupe.

Cane2theLeft
20-12-2010, 09:23
Please try to keep the discussion here on kratom... there are other areas designed for discussion about buprenorphine and other topics.

Pegasus
20-12-2010, 11:18
@Darkvein, if you start taking kratom with your tolerance where it is, you're just going to have to take as much kratom as you can stomach and hope that it helps. Your habit is large and kratom is a pretty mild opiate... It will still help with withdrawals, but you have to understand that kratom typically gives effects around maybe one 30mg oxycodone at the most... 7-15 oxycodone 30mg plus a fentanyl patch is significantly more opiates than what kratom will be able to substitute for.

My advice would be to taper as much and as quickly as possible until you're around just 30mg oxycodone in one dose, preferably less, then jumping to kratom. Kratom works really well, but with huge tolerances will require a little tapering beforehand to work best.

King Hop Head
20-12-2010, 23:15
I have quite a tolerance, have poppy tea daily. Do find that Kratom kills withdrawals pretty well.

When my tolerance was lower, used to have X15 extract once a week. Was high all day, really good euphoria and nods.

Nib
21-12-2010, 05:22
by a significant tolerance I mean, I do on a daily basis:

If I'm doing 30 mg roxy's, then maybe 7-15 or so, which would be about 210-450 mgs of iv'd oxycodone, usually 2-4 at a time (30mgs each) plus I'd be wearing a 100mcg/h fent patch

if fentanyl, I wear 1 100mcg/h patch AND take 25mcg/h buccal in the morning, plus 25mcg/h buccal at night

keep in mind I am constantly wearing a 100mcg/h patch whether I'm doing fent OR oxycodone and on top of all that I take (swallow) maybe 3-6 percocet 10's a day as well

yeah so what I mean to say was, I have an absolutely horrendous habit and i want to get off of everything before I start my classes back up on January 5th. I'm gonna ask for suboxone I think at my next doc appt but I usually run out of meds a week early which is what just happened and on day 3 (i think) i ordered the kratom, then got it the day after going to the doctor (of course, thats just my luck)

now with that said, any more suggestions for dosage/roa?? please? especially roa cause I don't know what to do with this stuff

and I heard powdered was the best that's why I got it. maeng da was the only kind I saw until AFTER i ordered it

also, how do you store it/how long is it good for?

ps: my saying i got maeng da has nothing to do with the vendor I just was reiterating so experienced users might have an idea of the strength of the product I have, cause I'm asking about dosing.

and I do have sort of a weak stomach

With that kind of tolerance you're gonna probably have to use Suboxone first to get off the oxy and fent, then you can use the Kratom to get off the Suboxone or just to maintain which is what I did.

Best way I find to take large amounts is to tear down a piece of single ply toilet paper to about half its size and you can get 3 or4 grams down at a time. Might take practice and it's nasty if it breaks open, but it's the easiest way when you need large amounts. You could try eating it with a bunch of yogurt to I guess.


If I bought some bali katom powder, would it be effective if I just literally ate a couple of big spoons full of it? I have a pretty strong stomach and I won't mind the taste even though I have never tasted it before.

Would I get a decent buzz from it that way?

That would be fine.

darkvein
21-12-2010, 06:40
thank you, pegasus and nib! a couple of more questions- what's the difference of the stim effect and the downer effect in terms of dosage? Like would taking just a few grams likely give me the stim effect I've heard of in reference to kratom? (I don't want that, lol) Also, what's the best way to store kratom? Should I put it in the fridge or is the preferable, lockable dresser drawer ok? And should I mix it w/ OJ or try a tea? I was thinking a tea would weaken the effect? I throw up easily, so parachuting may not be the best for me. :p

And I have been tapering. :\ Significantly so too... The last few days I haven't even touched one of my 100mcg/h patches! Just half of one 50mcg/h patch twice a day buccal, and a few roxy's on top of that. I don't feel great but I can manage, I think. I'm in ALOT of pain though :!. I do legitamately NEED my pain meds for pain. I'm thinking tomorrow I'll start to cut the 50 patches in thirds instead of halves, and nix the roxy, just try going down to my perc 10s (yuck). But in 3 or 4 days all I'll have is my 100 patches and they're so damn tempting, thats why I haven't even opened the boxes yet.8)

But, I am serious about quitting. I need my head straight for school, this is a big step for me, a lot of responsibility, and I don't want to be on this shit forever. My insurance (the insurance that pays for the visits, not the insurance that pays for the meds) will run out in a few months, and I would rather deal with all the withdrawls now rather than when I have homework to do, and 40 hours a week in a classroom, feeling like a piece of withering dung in the summer heat!!! You know what I mean? Right now, I'm just doing 15 hours of online classes, and an internship (plus taking care of my family) and in January I'll have to do all that PLUS the 40 hours a week of school and homework so I'll need like 36 hours in a day, which is not easy, let alone when your in the bathroom every 5 minutes and throwing your body around at night instead of sleeping, and feeling like you want to bite a bullet.... So I'm trying to be responisble and make the transition easier, so that I can function.

Anyways like I said I wanna start the kratom soon. I'm gonna get my doctor to prescribe me subs next month @ my next visit, but my plan is to have him think I'm still on the high doses of all those opiates, so he'll give me more than I need, and I can stock up before I gotta come up with 8o $200 for doctor visits (which I can't do) so that way I'll have enough to completely taper off before I'm cut off and fucked cause I still gotta play the societal student and continue to be the loving and nurturing parent that I am. I'm scared not to do it this way. I really am. Hell, I'm scared to even do it this way cause I'm so sick, and its by choice cause it aint like I don't have the meds 10 feet away from me right at this very moment...So I just thought I'd try doing this the way that made sense...

Back to the point, if you could PLEASE answer those few more questions that I have, I'd be eternally grateful! Thank you again Pegasus and Nib! Pretty please answer the other Q's if you have the A's!!!!!!!!! <3 miss h

illusionofanaddict
21-12-2010, 20:11
I usually capsule up my Kratom and was wondering what other ethnobotanicals or herbs can be mixed with it for ultimate painkilling & even hallucinogenic / spiritual, thought provoking experience. As well as ethnos/herbs for withdrawls...

I really like the list on page 3 that Amberthefrog put together. (Great list! :) )

Yet, they explain most of those herbs for teas. As I like tea, I also like just capsuling up more. Just seems like there is no waste.

Any ideas or someone with more experience w/ethnos would be greatly appreciated.

I know that if Kratom would be mixed with other powdery substance, it would require more caps to be taken, of course.

Just looking for more insight from a sage. Thanks!

catcalls
22-12-2010, 02:20
I decided to knock the Kratom on the head for a morning. BIG MISTAKE.

Basically, what happened was severe stomach cramps, (PAINFUL!), followed by nausea. I vomited three times, and this is the first time I've vomited from pain since the heroin days. I could not stomach any more Kratom tea, so I had 36 hours of these cramps. Then, after throwing up a lot of juice, I felt well enough to dose again. And the symptoms just faded away.

I'm in a lot of intermittant pain right now, and having to travel 6 miles a day to collect my Subutex is turning into a costly thing with £30 taxi daily. I do not feel fit enough to make the trip on the bus today, so it means another £30 taxi money. My intestines are in shards! Really tender. I keep getting this gurgling noise, and pain when I get that noise as liquid passes thru the system.

This might be related to my pre-existing stomach complaint, but I doubt it. The Subutex alone is strong enough to take care of that complaint, so I'm assuming its Kratom wd. Shit, I never thought it'd be sooo painful!

Damn, now in the past 12 hours I've drank roughly a cup to two cups every 2 hours. Just to take the pain away.

Its helping for sure. I am also severely constipated.

I wish I never dosed Kratom! Buyer beware...

darkvein
22-12-2010, 17:57
I don't have any capsules, or money for capsules

NeighborhoodThreat
22-12-2010, 18:32
You can always make the tea, although capsules make it easier to handle if you can't deal with the taste. I actually added green tea bags to my kratom tea I made last night and lots of honey and it helped a lot. I was also in WD (from a combination of tramadol and kratom!) so it was probably helping that more as well. I also noticed that a fair dose of diphenhydramine (25mg) made it much warmer and closer to feeling like hydrocodone :)

@ catcalls, are you combining the subs and kratom or switching between the two?

darkvein
22-12-2010, 18:51
I don't have any capsules, or money for capsules
ALSO:


thank you, pegasus and nib! a couple of more questions- what's the difference of the stim effect and the downer effect in terms of dosage? Like would taking just a few grams likely give me the stim effect I've heard of in reference to kratom? (I don't want that, lol) Also, what's the best way to store kratom? Should I put it in the fridge or is the preferable, lockable dresser drawer ok? And should I mix it w/ OJ or try a tea? I was thinking a tea would weaken the effect?

CaseFace
22-12-2010, 23:37
If you have about 3 dollars, you can buy a bag of 100 capsules. ;)

robatussin
23-12-2010, 06:06
or parachute with toilet/rolling/any paper if you dont have $3 If you have one dollar you can use that paper for a parachute ;)......oh wait harm reduction says dont do that

burn out
23-12-2010, 06:51
i am confused about the dosage of kratom. i went to the kratom forum and i saw some experienced users (some of which had former opiate habits) talking about dosing tiny amounts like 1 or 2 teaspoons (which works out to about 2-4 grams). howver, on sagewisdom or erowid they recommend dosages quite a lot higher than this. i have tried 7.5 grams in the form of tea with the powder strained out and i did not get much affect from this. some people have told me kratom is supposed to be mild but i find it hard to believe people would actually shell out money for this plant if it was really as mild as i experienced it.

HdoubleODeezy
23-12-2010, 07:05
back in the day i would need to take(not make tea, actually swallow all the powder down w/ water) 10 grams of some good red vein thai.. unfortunately i can't get that strain anymore and to replace it is a lower grade green vein bali or something.
I donno, i haven't used kratom in a while (years) so i forget all the different kinds. I always wonder if i can use it with bupe tho.

EDIT: forgot to say that, that dose would fuck me up decently with a tolerance of 80-120mg OC/day

MistaSmokalot
23-12-2010, 07:08
Easiest way to take kratom if you dont have a pill filler machine, or if you dont have time to stuff 7 grams of it into capsuls repeatedly (which is a waste of time) is to grind it with a coffee grinder on full speed for a while till its a powder. Get a spoon and with a weighed dose, mash the powder into the spoon (hopefully your kratom powder is in a zip loc bag) so its compacted powder. Put spoon on your mouth and eat the kratom like peanut butter, making sure you dont taste it, have juice, pop or anything other than water and Chase that plant matter shit down.

If you grew up drinking you know how to down something without tasting it...its the same with kratom. Just spoon it in, Drink, Swish it around in your mouth so you dont swallow a huge kratom powder juice ball, and repeat if necessary.

kratom isnt an opiate, how people in thailand are addicted to it beats me, I guess the fresh leaf is more potent chewed than the dry shit here...it dosent really help an urge to want to do an actual drug....and yeah, really its just something to do when there is nothing else To do.

I got it cheap, I jus bought leaf, I get effects from it, but I dont see how any other kratom would be different, I understand the high...and yeah its not anything great, it dosent suck though.

CaseFace
23-12-2010, 08:08
i am confused about the dosage of kratom. i went to the kratom forum and i saw some experienced users (some of which had former opiate habits) talking about dosing tiny amounts like 1 or 2 teaspoons (which works out to about 2-4 grams). howver, on sagewisdom or erowid they recommend dosages quite a lot higher than this. i have tried 7.5 grams in the form of tea with the powder strained out and i did not get much affect from this. some people have told me kratom is supposed to be mild but i find it hard to believe people would actually shell out money for this plant if it was really as mild as i experienced it.


Those people may have been taking 1-2 teaspoons of an extract not powdered leaf, and also in my experience tea is way less strong than putting the powder in capsules or parachuting it.

_mistresspoppy_
23-12-2010, 08:42
I enjoy an occasional hydrocodone, but I'm not a regular user. I do cold water extraction (to get the liver-killers out) on 2-3 pills of 7.5 mg hydrocodone every few weeks. I probably don't need to for such a small dose, but I'm cautious. This means I have to drink a cup of nasty, bitter liquid. The first time I started to get a nauseous and feverish, motion-sick feeling while playing a video game, but eating a hand full of chocolate helped alot. I'd like to try kratom for a legal, (safer?) alternative, but I don't know which kind to get. I want a chill, relaxed, melt-into-the-floor and its-all-good type of high. I don't claim to have an iron stomach, but I can handle nausea. What is the best way of ingesting kratom to get the strongest effects? And is there a difference between buying the pre-made capsules and making your own? Is kratom pretty much safe/non addictive for weekly/occasional use?

Pegasus
23-12-2010, 08:44
kratom isnt an opiate, how people in thailand are addicted to it beats me, I

Kratom is an opioid, that's why it gives much of its effects/ addiction.

darkvein
23-12-2010, 09:15
ok. so does it matter how I store it/for how long? and what about the stimulative effect, how do I avoid that like what typically is the doasage at that you get a stim effect instead of an opiod-like effect? sorry if my repeated questions are getting redundant, just trying to get answers , ya know

and no I can't get capsules, I have no money for that, I'm late on my mortgage, and its christmas season plus 2 weeks later is my kids birthday-my money is tied up i barely skimped by getting the kratom at all, as my regular meds are paid 4 by insurance

catcalls
23-12-2010, 11:19
I enjoy an occasional hydrocodone, but I'm not a regular user. I do cold water extraction (to get the liver-killers out) on 2-3 pills of 7.5 mg hydrocodone every few weeks. I probably don't need to for such a small dose, but I'm cautious. This means I have to drink a cup of nasty, bitter liquid. The first time I started to get a nauseous and feverish, motion-sick feeling while playing a video game, but eating a hand full of chocolate helped alot. I'd like to try kratom for a legal, (safer?) alternative, but I don't know which kind to get. I want a chill, relaxed, melt-into-the-floor and its-all-good type of high. I don't claim to have an iron stomach, but I can handle nausea. What is the best way of ingesting kratom to get the strongest effects? And is there a difference between buying the pre-made capsules and making your own? Is kratom pretty much safe/non addictive for weekly/occasional use?

Hi Poppy,

Kratom is very addictive In My Experience. This is because of the psychological effect of getting high legally! It's got a nice mellow opiate buzz to it. Not as strong as heroin, similar to 80mg Codeine I'd say. Then, you reach a plateau, and feel nausea.

That said, it is a bloody marvellous pain-killer! So, I'm always going to keep some in the house from now on and take it for my stomach pains.

_mistresspoppy_
24-12-2010, 07:26
Thanks for the warning, I've found that hydrocodone is pretty addicting- psychologically at least. I just want more, even though I dont physically need it. I follow a strict one day on, at least three days off rule, though, and its usually even longer than that.
also, is kratom bad for your liver?

King Hop Head
24-12-2010, 15:33
Those people may have been taking 1-2 teaspoons of an extract not powdered leaf, and also in my experience tea is way less strong than putting the powder in capsules or parachuting it.

Personally I find using capsules is ineffective, I get far more of a buzz from making a Kratom tea or mixing with friut juice.

catcalls
24-12-2010, 15:38
Personally I find using capsules is ineffective, I get far more of a buzz from making a Kratom tea or mixing with friut juice.

Hey, I'm from UK. Where in EM are you? I'm just south of you.

King Hop Head
24-12-2010, 18:05
Hey, I'm from UK. Where in EM are you? I'm just south of you.

I live in a small town in Leicetershire.

cocoabud
25-12-2010, 00:35
it is good in applesauce with some cinnamon sugar. about 4 grams.

burn out
25-12-2010, 23:55
so i took 7 grams of kratom powder last night and had a good experience. i have some more questions i would like to ask.

1) does anyone else experience far less nausea with kratom than traditional opiates? kratom gives me nausea, but it is tolerable for me, unlike the incapacitating, unrelenting nausea ive gotten from hydrocodone.

2) how do you get to sleep on kratom? i didn't sleep a wink all night. i didn't mind because i was high and i don't have anything to do today but i can see this being a problem in the future. i dont want to take it in the morning either, because i need to lie or sit down the whole time on kratom or i get nausea.

3) does tolerance to the nausea develop with more frequent usage?

4) how long do the effects last? i still have the inability to reach orgasm typical with opiates 16 hours after taking it.

pr0d1gy
30-12-2010, 01:59
The inability to orgasm should go away, when I first started kratom it was totally impossible for me as well but once your tolerance builds a bit its not a problem.

Taking kratom to close to when you want to goto bed can sometimes keep me up also, I take a dose about 4 hours before I want to sleep and it helps me, if I take a dose any sooner then that I have trouble sleeping, kinda weird.

Tolerance to nausea can develop as you get experienced with kratom, I am surprised you got any from only 7 grams though, what strain were you using?

NeighborhoodThreat
30-12-2010, 03:43
I noticed quite a bit of nausea when I first started using kratom, like, the first and second time...but that's how it was when I first did opiates.

Tolerance to nausea will come quick.

catcalls
30-12-2010, 05:44
Finally did it. I tapered down the last few days the Kratom tea. Basically, used the same tea bag full of Kratom daily, until the water turned transparent. Then, a couple of days discomfort. And boom! I'm clean.

Started taking the Kratom to help with WD from Subutex in the mornings. But, it turned into a habit.

So, just had to quit!