Eckhart Tolle

Curious what you all think about Eckhart Tolle and his two books the Power of Now and A New Earth.

I think his message is relavent to western minds and modern readers, his books are accessable to the average person, and point us to what mystics have been saying for thousands of years. The core message is that all we have is NOW there is nothing other than now. And if you are totally present, and absorbed in the now then you find a deep peace, love and contentment that supercedes the thinking mind/ and bodily gratifications. He says that what we are beyond our individual separate "egos" and its a field of aware stillness that can be accessed whenever we rise above thought and access this field of deep peace.

Do you like eckhart tolle?
Why or why not?
What do you disagree with?
Is there something beyond our individual sense of identity?

my take - psychobabble ! no gurus allowed in the realm of logic because they are wigs with huge emo baggage .

I read a few chapters out of A New Earth, which I had borrowed from my cousin and read during a fairly long drive. My take on it is that a lot of the ideas brought forth have some merit to them, but Tolle, to me at least, seems to have missed the mark.

He speaks of the Ego as something to be suppressed, to be diminished wherever possible. This I don't entirely agree with, since my Ego was only a threat to self-actualisation when I was unaware of it (all it wants is some attention and it plays nice )

I also find the idea of one's pain-body to be unnecessarily encapsulating and personifying. While it's an easy term to speak of casually, it implies that the pain-body is an agent, with its own desires and agenda, that one must defy viciously. Our internal negativity is not only much more subtle than that, but is a part of ourselves.

Is there something beyond our individual sense of identity?

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For sure. Beyond your identity, there is your emotions, your ideas, your own personal reality, right down to the specific configuration of the brain-matter through which you observe the world. These concepts are much harder to define, as they were not often things that early humans needed to communicate (thus, our languages have not evolved around such concepts - yet)

my granpa has insisted that i read the power of now. its next on my list after i finish fight club. he glamourized it as a compilation of pretty much everything he believes in and i look up to my granpa, so... what is there to be said against it? he also told me that meditation is very important. i've never heard anyone argue against my papa's ideas so this would be very interesting for me to hear

I'm reading 'The power of Now' right now (too many nows in that sentence), and I think some of the ideas are quite valid... If we can quiet our minds, and focus on the present moment we can become happier (and thus more compassionate, effective, 'better' people.
The problem with it, is it has all these great suggestions, but very little in the way of how to achieve any of them, unless one is already quite familiar with things like meditation. It could almost be summed up in one page by saying...The answer is inside you, good luck finding it...
Along the lines of Eckhart Tolle, (but much better for living in the now) are books by Thich Nat Hanh, a pretty zen Buddhist monk. It's sort of the same message, but it actually has instructions and exercises to help one start to learn about 'the inner them'. He taught me how to meditate, when my mind was racing and super ill, Which Tolles' book certainly wouldn't have helped with, at the times in my life when those lessons were the most important to learn.

Meh.

I'm a big fan of Eckhart Tolle. Loved Power of Now, New Earth was OK but `PoN` was better, IMO.

For me, that's exactly what I need to learn to do: control my mind instead of it running rampant wherever it wants, and not letting myself think obsessively about what I did (or didn't) do in the past, or the `what am I going to do when...` You brain is a powerful tool, but you need to control it, instead of it controlling you.

Compassion is something you cannot overdose on - more is always better.

good book but ive read better in that regard, a bit simplistic (which isnt necessarily bad)

It seems like he just repackages certain buddhist and hindu concepts into semi-academic vernacular, and throws in some made-up concepts (pain-body). I don't really think that much of him, I'd rather delve into Zen masters or the writings of the Lamas of Tibet when I'm in the mood to read about spirituality.
He's good for an introduction into the wider world of spirituality and human relationships, but I wouldn't consider him a total guru or anything. He's worth a quick read, but I wouldn't spend too much time on him, or anyone on Oprah's book club for that matter.

stonerfromohio said:

The core message is that all we have is NOW there is nothing other than now.

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Sounds like it might be an interesting book. I will read it LATER.

Raw Evil said:

He speaks of the Ego as something to be suppressed, to be diminished wherever possible. This I don't entirely agree with,

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This has always annoyed me slightly in regards to meditation and similar philosophies and is kind of the point i was trying to make above. They seem to look down on the ego as something to be repressed, but without my ego planning away and thinking of the future and the past and all sorts of things that are not 'NOW' i'd never get round to reading books on meditation and learning stuff about this kind of thing.

I've considered writing: The Power of Later

A book for and by procrastinators!

MrM said:

This has always annoyed me slightly in regards to meditation and similar philosophies and is kind of the point i was trying to make above. They seem to look down on the ego as something to be repressed, but without my ego planning away and thinking of the future and the past and all sorts of things that are not 'NOW' i'd never get round to reading books on meditation and learning stuff about this kind of thing.

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You hit it right on the head. These philosophies are trying to undo the very evolutionary advantages that allows us to be successful primates. Specific parts of your brain evolved to maximize your ability to remember the past and plan for the future. The fact that it takes monks a lifetime of suppression to even gain brief periods of ego death suggests that an ego is something to be valued. Our limbic system has evolved to respond to goals and accomplishments, it is a basic source of pleasure. Of course there needs to be a balance, but trying to completely shut off such a basic system seems counter productive and will never have any appeal to the masses. Human behavior is generally modeled around our biological dispositions, I can't see fundamental biological changes occurring on a mass scale because of our behavior happening any time soon, if ever. It is the exact opposite of how things generally work. Can't fight statistics.

Eckhart's teachings are definitely truthful. He teaches the true meaning of enlightenment. However if everyone followed his teachings not much would get done. People would be too content sitting on their asses to go to work and society would crash.

Enlitx said:

You hit it right on the head. These philosophies are trying to undo the very evolutionary advantages that allows us to be successful primates.

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Interesting, i'd not thought of it like that but you could be right.

The impression i get is that there are many situations where living exactly in the moment is the best possible thing to do, and learning meditation techniques could be really useful to help accomplish this.

There are also many situations where living in the past, present and future and planning things out is the best possible thing to do.

One is not better than the other, both are useful.

As a side note i'm planning to head up a local hill and meditate at some point in the next week or so. Unfortunately i can't do this NOW but i plan on doing it latter, which i know from experience will eventually become now.

Is there something beyond our individual sense of identity?

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Yes, the external universe.

OP, I've taken the liberty of changing your thread title, since your question is really about the author, not just one title of his.

I've never read Tolle, but I hear, well, he is what he is. Just like you don't compare a 1 hit wonder pop R&B artist to a classical composer, I wouldn't put a pop spiritual writer in the same category as great spiritual writers and thinkers throughout history. His message is essentially the same as theirs. The difference is in the delivery, and the details. He's some people's cup o joe, but not mine.

Enlitx said:

You hit it right on the head. These philosophies are trying to undo the very evolutionary advantages that allows us to be successful primates. Specific parts of your brain evolved to maximize your ability to remember the past and plan for the future. The fact that it takes monks a lifetime of suppression to even gain brief periods of ego death suggests that an ego is something to be valued. Our limbic system has evolved to respond to goals and accomplishments, it is a basic source of pleasure. Of course there needs to be a balance, but trying to completely shut off such a basic system seems counter productive and will never have any appeal to the masses. Human behavior is generally modeled around our biological dispositions, I can't see fundamental biological changes occurring on a mass scale because of our behavior happening any time soon, if ever. It is the exact opposite of how things generally work. Can't fight statistics.

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I think you are taking his words a bit too literally. Now does not mean ignoring the past and future--instead, I'm inclined to believe it requires one not to be attatched (to use a Buddhist term) to those moments in time which you do not have direct influence over at in the present.

Would you define basic system? Does that mean something necessary to survive?

Going with your theme of evolution, can you not be sure that the ego is not holding us back from moving forward? Yes, parts of our brains have developed to facilitate our mneonic capacities. But who is to say we can only channel those abilities through our ego? It's effectively impossible to reduce the ego to a specific neurochemical or biological function of the brain. Even if you did, it would only explain 'what' was happening, not 'why' or 'how.' Perhaps the ego is a characteristic of our species that is serving a purpose in the short term, but we may not need it moving forward.

I am also a bit confused by your declaration of the ego as a source of basic pleasure. I'm inclined to posit that more intense pleasure can be ascertained without the limitations of the ego. subjectively speaking, that is.

I think you are taking his words a bit too literally. Now does not mean ignoring the past and future--instead, I'm inclined to believe it requires one not to be attatched (to use a Buddhist term) to those moments in time which you do not have direct influence over at in the present.

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The past influences the present and the present will influence the future. I am not all powerful - i cannot ensure the future works out exactly as i want it to, but i do have direct influence over certain aspects of how the future will work out.

For example - because now i have decided to go to the park later, i have directly influenced my future later this afternoon.

You're missing the point. I'm fully aware you can directly influence the future....otherwise you wouldn't be alive

Think about the unnecessary stress and negativity surrounding regret and avoidable apprehension. By minimizing the thought patterns that create stress your potential to be present and engaging at all times increases tenfold.

Like I said, not too literally.

What I gathered from a power of now and a new earth is what all the mystics and saints have been saying for ages.

We are something deeper than the body or mind not that the body or mind is not a part of what we are or that it is not essential for living on this planet but that at our deepest level we are all the same, we each have an indestructable, untouchable, timeless space of being which is our true nature. It can be called by many names and has throughout history for example awareness, consciousness, true nature, basic goodness, spaciousness, stillness, love, peace that surpasses all understanding, god but as his teaching points out these are all words. None of these words are actually our true nature, they are merely "pointers" or symbols speaking of something which can not be encapsulated by words.

He says that the mind lives on words, and concepts... it labels, judges, plans, projects all kinds of illusions onto the true nature of reality. Which clouds our seeing things as they really are which is actually one beingness clothed as the billions of beings and phenomenon on this planet.

Our mind is completely based on time the past or the future, the reason the power of now is so significant is to really be 100% absorbed into the now means to exit time ie. the mind and see your true nature. But most people are addicted to the mind, and its projections and believe them to be 100% true. Even the fact that I am the body is a concept, even your name is a concept, even the word existance is a concept... when all concepts are cleared your left with the timeless present undilted by time or concepts. So his teaching is really to stop believing all of the minds projections and stop believing your false identity as something sepearate from the all of existance. When these illusions are seen through your mind starts to go quiet, and you start to be totally present and at peace, eventually realizing there is no you who is getting quiet or more present but that what you are has been present all along watching the entire play of existance, but you were caught up in all of the minds projections.

Your true nature is formless, and is not a form, experience, concept, its beyond any of these. All things appear in it and it is untouched.

He quotes the bible, "Be still and know that I am God". He quotes buddha and many others, its the same message of every non-dual religion. He really makes it accessable for the modern reader, and spells it out for the western mind. And when you listen to him speak you can tell that he is definitely submerged in stillness and peace. Great guy, great book!

Think about the unnecessary stress and negativity surrounding regret and avoidable apprehension. By minimizing the thought patterns that create stress your potential to be present and engaging at all times increases tenfold.

Like I said, not too literally.

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I think the important point is to not worry about stuff you can't influence, instead put your energy into planning out the stuff you can. I don't see this as living in the now, rather directing your thoughts more usefully.