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etardedadam
11-10-2007, 23:19
I have been taking kratom for about 2 or 3 months twice a day, a small dose before work and usually a pretty large dose or two after work. But for the last week and a half I have tried to cut out the morning dose. After I eat lunch I get a huge stomach ache until I take more kratom. Im not in a bad mood or anything just strong stomach pain. Ive tried to wait the stomach pain out too, ill give it a few hours and it doesnt go away. But 15 mins after I eat some kratom im fine. Could this be from withdrawal or something else?

BodhiSvaha33
11-10-2007, 23:36
Given this:

But 15 mins after I eat some kratom im fine.

... it is almost certainly withdrawal. I have not had stomach pains myself but diarrhea is a frequent w/d element. If you are wanting to kick the kratom habit I recommend phenibut, an OTC GABA-ergic that is sold through health food stores and bodybuilding supplement outlets. I went through kratom w/d (albeit for a far less serious habit) and found that a gram or so of phenibut a day worked wonders on the anxiety, sweats, chills, mood swings etc. Not sure about the stomach pain; maybe some Pepto or milk of magnesia?

Oh, and phenibut actually is far more effective rectally than orally, for whatever reason. I assume the bioavailability is higher when plugged but I haven't been able to find any hard pharmacokinetic data to back this up.

Paralogic
12-10-2007, 00:59
Just cut your doses in half then take a short break, kratom is way more forgiving than opiates IMHO. For the stomach thing, I would reccomend just watching what you eat a little. Greasy food during my kratom use usually gives me some bad nausea but not the strong stomach pain you are describing.

Xorkoth
12-10-2007, 16:11
I have withdrawn from kratom several times, the first time from a habit the size of yours. I never got stomach pain, but you will probably notice a pretty severe case of anxiety and a feeling of depression, and even worse (IMO), a tremendous restlessness and soreness of the limbs, especially when trying to sleep. I find sleep impossible during kratom withdrawal.

But fear not. Not only is kratom withdrawal more forgiving than real opiates, but it only lasts 4-5 days. And as a poster above mentioned, phenibut, a legal supplement, helps the withdrawals tremendously for some reason. I just withdrew again over the past week or two, but I barely even noticed because of a daily phenibut dose.

etardedadam
12-10-2007, 16:15
cool good thanks good info. im not ready to totaly stop taking it yet, but im going to slow down a bit... i hope

TheLoveBandit
17-06-2009, 19:58
w/d save bump

DiRtYjErZ
10-06-2010, 21:33
So I ran out of my subs last week and I spent 10 days dodging withdrawal with some Bali powder to great effect. I ran out and decided I'd buy the red veined indo powder this time. Well I've taken little doses and high ones up to 10-12 teaspoons at a time and have not noticed a single effect from it. My vendor is good always good product of other strains and always tosses in an extra few grams. Any ideas?

weekend addiction
11-06-2010, 01:41
So I ran out of my subs last week and I spent 10 days dodging withdrawal with some Bali powder to great effect. I ran out and decided I'd buy the red veined indo powder this time. Well I've taken little doses and high ones up to 10-12 teaspoons at a time and have not noticed a single effect from it. My vendor is good always good product of other strains and always tosses in an extra few grams. Any ideas?

Don't know. But last night I took 3 tablespoons of powder extracted into a tea (strained). My highest dose so far by a tablespoon. And I didn't feel much at all. But today 2 tablespoons was pretty effective. Weird.

bpayne
11-06-2010, 07:11
I'm a sn- sn - snawten on a sub sun

Pegasus
11-06-2010, 19:32
I'd just keep going with the bali. I have tried a few other kinds but the bali is by far the most consistently effective IMO. The price is great as well...

weekend addiction
13-06-2010, 01:17
I'd just keep going with the bali. I have tried a few other kinds but the bali is by far the most consistently effective IMO. The price is great as well...

Bali is were its at.

DiRtYjErZ
27-06-2010, 07:52
Agreed. Most bang for ur buck I think. Anyone know bout kratom being effective while on suboxone?

RaggaRagga
11-01-2011, 19:31
I've read a bit about red vein Kratom from anywhere being a weak strain though I've also heard good things, too. I have good experience with Indo and Bali they are very similar but Bali definitely feels more clear headed somehow. I've had four experiences with yellow vein Malaysian and it is bit different, less euphoric but still active in an odd way. I imagine it's a bit like growing grapes for wine, each countries climate effects the growth of the plant and it's active contents. Just like with any naturally occurring substance the plant source has a whole collection of things inside it and in varying levels.

I'm a n00b to forums of any sort so forgive me for any ignorance I might have.

attempt4
12-01-2011, 12:55
I've read a bit about red vein Kratom from anywhere being a weak strain though I've also heard good things, too. I have good experience with Indo and Bali they are very similar but Bali definitely feels more clear headed somehow. I've had four experiences with yellow vein Malaysian and it is bit different, less euphoric but still active in an odd way. I imagine it's a bit like growing grapes for wine, each countries climate effects the growth of the plant and it's active contents. Just like with any naturally occurring substance the plant source has a whole collection of things inside it and in varying levels.

I'm a n00b to forums of any sort so forgive me for any ignorance I might have.

What do you actually want to know? I've been taking Kratom daily for 4 years but off it now. Tried every strain available, done every method available so any questions just ask..

jonnyrocket
13-01-2011, 11:32
Is Kratom King still a good guy? I have been out of this scene for quite a while, but we used to be pretty good friends back in the day!! Any advice would be helpful!!! If this post is out of line, mods, please feel free to delete it. . . . I know sources are usually frowned upon, but I am only referring to the dude himself, and nobody would have any idea as to whom I am talking about unless they know him!

Peace and Love everyone!!

lolwhatzdrugs
14-01-2011, 13:13
Is _________ still a good guy? I have been out of this scene for quite a while, but we used to be pretty good friends back in the day!! Any advice would be helpful!!! If this post is out of line, mods, please feel free to delete it. . . . I know sources are usually frowned upon, but I am only referring to the dude himself, and nobody would have any idea as to whom I am talking about unless they know him!

Peace and Love everyone!!

I'm sure this isn't allowed, not just 'frowned upon' ; you seem to know too. You mention a specific name, and then go on to say asking about sources isn't allowed......

RaggaRagga
15-01-2011, 19:16
What do you actually want to know? I've been taking Kratom daily for 4 years but off it now. Tried every strain available, done every method available so any questions just ask..

What was your favorite strain or strain mixture and what was your favorite method?

Also, is there actually a big difference between strains other than potency? for example Do you notice Thai Kratom to be more "energetic" than the "relaxing" Bali Kratom?

attempt4
15-01-2011, 22:23
My first tip in taking kratom is to mix your strains. Just having a single strain can be a rather one-dimensional high. To get a more wholesome effect, I would mix a Thai, say Premium RVT (red vein) and a rounder, smoother Indo such as Sunda or Kali Indo. Most often I would mix 2 strains in a 50:50 ratio, but you can mix and match, try more strains or less in different ratios. Sometimes its better to do 2 strains in a 66:33 ratio)


Kratom affects everyone differently and can be hit or miss. Experiment yourself based on my advice, but dont be disappointed or surprised if they dont work perfectly for you. For example, my best friend really enjoyed Green Malaysian whereas I got literally no effect from it.


The best way to take kratom is undoubtedly the toss and wash. Simply measure your dose (depending on strain/personal tolerance amongst other things, this can be around 6-12g......first timer, I would say try 8g and mix two strains in whatever ratio you like, try 50:50 or even just try one strain at 8g for your first time. ) and grab a teaspoon.
Dump a teaspoon of Kratom on your tongue and wash it down with your chosen drink. Thicker is better. I think OJ works best. It can be tricky to wash down so have another swig after. Swallow it down hard and confidently. Repeat until your Xg dose is done.

There is a pretty huge difference between various strains of Kratom, but in essence they all do the same in that they will make you more content, happy and carefree. Take 10g of good Maeng Da Thai and the next day take 10g of good Bali and you'll see the difference.
Bali/Indo - more relaxing and easygoing, a smoother feel, lasting longer and taking a little longer to comeup. Bali can be very strong :)
Thai/Malay - Thai tends to be very potent but the high can come on too quick and leave too quickly.
There are alot of useless names around this plant but essentially they are all from the same plant but grown in different areas, dried for different lengths of time, dried in the sun/indoors, wildcrafted, picked from mature plants etc.
Red Vein Indo is generally pretty damn weal, but Red Vein Thai is pretty strong.


Theres a real art to being a Kratom Connoisseur. Once you've got the basics like the imperative empty stomach, what strains you like, what dosage suits you better, your preferred method of ingestion etc etc then you will no doubt enjoy this fine plant. I've spent thousands on it, it's a subtle yet strong and relaxing, yet stimulating high. It doesn't overpower and truly intoxicate you, more it enhances life. But thats not to say you can almost get a slight nod late at night, lying in bed on some nice Bali and Indo.


Anything else you wanna know? Are you in US or UK btw? Certain strains sold within UK are bunk and likewise for US....

RaggaRagga
15-01-2011, 22:41
I'm in the U.S. PDX.

I used to have an opiate habit and have to say there is a huge difference between Opiates and Kratom not to say that there are no similarities. But I really feel kratom enhances my life where as opiates consume it.

I'll definitely try mixing more strains. I just found a good local business that has seemingly good quality kratom and really decent prices.

I've got to head out to work right now. But I'll get back on here later tonight when I think of some more questions.

Also Thank you for the tips and objective answers. I'm really glad to finally have access to someone with longer term/diverse experience with Kratom.

attempt4
15-01-2011, 23:20
Yeah thats no problem at all man. I have had problems with alcohol (and opiates to an extent but always found Kratom infinitely better as I could do it at work and be fine....better than fine...i'd be super-productive) and found Kratom to be incredible at easing any cravings. I'd much rather take Kratom daily than get pissed daily.

There are a shit-ton of health benefits with Kratom that you might like to know about, such as it's concentration of epicatechin which is a strong antioxidant found in dark chocolate. It's great for lowering blood pressure/hypertension and exhibits powerful anti-carcinogenic properties (documented efficacy in cancerous tissue in women's sexual organs, mainly). It contains compounds similar to the primary antioxidants found in Green Tea.
Let's see......can't remember anything else at this moment in time, but rest assured that this is a wonderful plant.

RaggaRagga
16-01-2011, 20:10
Have you ever had any bad experiences with Kratom? Was stopping it's use very hard for you?

I Really enjoy a combo of Kratom and Nicotine in the form of English snuff (My favorite ROA for tobacco). Do you have any Kratom combo's?

I definitely will get a little sleep trouble when I don't use kratom, but nothing extreme. I've heard that Phenibut helps a lot with that anyways.

RaggaRagga
16-01-2011, 20:14
Oh and that's pretty cool about the health benefits. I was a little worried because the amount of leaf powder needed daily is at a level where it's literally a part of my diet. I wish I new if it counted as a serving of veggies :)

attempt4
17-01-2011, 00:45
I've never had any bad experiences with Kratom, apart from projectile vomitting once or twice when I was just too hungover after a few days bingeing on booze, psychadelics and stims. But it was a quick clean spew and made me feel great.

Stopping it's use was quite difficult, im not gonna lie. But it was difficult mainly because I had incorporated it into every part of my life. I would wake up to 10g, have another dose before meeting friends, a dose in work, a dose before, during and after everything so it was more the habit that was hard to break. I was doing at least half a kilo a month (often 60g a day).
I loved the stuff....it helped give me the confidence and eloquence that I once had before I was struck down by manic depression and paranoid anxiety.

If you ever have trouble with withdrawals then get yourself some "XX w/d formula" from tyler at ktbotanicals. Wonderfully effective.
RAGGA RAGGA's WITHDRAWAL PROGRAM BY A4 (if need be ;)): Phenibut, fruit/veg, XX w/d formula, exercise and good sleep/rest. You may even try Stem Powder which isn't really potent enough to give a decent high or contribute to withdrawals, but it CAN be pretty great at relieving withdrawals.

I don't smoke tobacco as a solitary habit, but on Kratom, there is nothing better than a few rollups, man. It gives me an insatiable hunger for nicotine for some reason.
Decent combo's: Wine (especially Blue Lotus Wine if you buy some BL) is fantastic at potentiating Kratom. When you are coming up/peaking, have a glass of wine.
Magnesium and White Grapefruit Juice can potentiate it also.
Kratom is FANTASTIC to take whilst at the peak of an LSD trip.
It is an AMAZING hangover/comedown cure.

I always thought that at the end of the day, its a nutritious leaf of a tree and contains a cuntload of fibre, vitamins and nutrients. There was a point where I literally was only eating a couple peices of fruit a day alongside 50 odd grams a day. Still in great health :)

amapola
17-01-2011, 07:00
I used to have an opiate habit and have to say there is a huge difference between Opiates and Kratom not to say that there are no similarities. But I really feel kratom enhances my life where as opiates consume it.


The primary active alkaloids in Kratom are 7-hydroxymitragynine and mitragynine which are both opiates. 7-h-m is actually 20 times stronger than morphine.

I wouldn't say there is a huge difference ;) the only reason you like kratom more is a built in safety mechanism of only being able to swallow so much powdered plant.

Chulo
17-01-2011, 10:55
I had a Kratom plant .. once upon a time :(

attempt4
17-01-2011, 13:06
The primary active alkaloids in Kratom are 7-hydroxymitragynine and mitragynine which are both opiates. 7-h-m is actually 20 times stronger than morphine.



The 2 indole alkaloids you mentioned are opioid agonists, not derived from the Papaver Somniferum plant and therefore not true opiates.

Kratom is a complex plant in it's makeup and can only be marginally juxtaposed with morphine, as it contains at least 28 (ox)indoles/alkaloids that we know of, each one contributing to it's diverse and varied effect. Saying it is 20 times stronger than morphine is entirely useless given the subjective nature of experiencing the psychoactive effects of these alkaloids.

I've used heroin a good number of times, morphine, had an addiction to poppies and certainly had my fair share of other opiates but Kratom gives a much more distinct high and I would say the only real similarities, subjectively speaking, are the relaxed care-free attitude one can achieve with opiates and opioid-like agonists in Kratom. Just as a sidenote, for me, Kratom is infinitely better than opiates....but each have their place and it depends on personal preference of course :)


I had a Kratom plant .. once upon a time :(

What happened to it man? I intend on growing as soon as I can.

Mr.T
26-01-2011, 23:41
Hey whats up,
well i consider myself a Kratlom lover too :)

I justed wanted to ask you:

There are a shit-ton of health benefits with Kratom ....


Where did u get this information, is there any source for this or a link you might have?

Otherwise it would just sound like something to make your addiction to it "benificial" if you know what i mean :)

Have a good night

reggiee
27-01-2011, 15:44
My brother started on the occasional uei mixes (roughly 20% uei), for a few months, then went to straight uei. He got to the point to where he felt like shit after about 8 hours of his last dose, so he did the sensible thing, dose again of course. Well, his tolerance sky rocketed like expected by us both, but he had the money and loved the way it made him feel, more so in the beginning at least. When he managed to moderate his use, and withdraw for a little while, the first doses really made him feel like everything was right (euphoria). It gave his tons of motivation to get things done and made him score high on his college exams, which were tough. It improved his normally bland personality 10 fold and made his a very charming guy. No one ever suspected a thing but it ended up costing him over $40-50 per day towards the end, using it almost daily for nearly a year. Of course it didn't cost that much in the beginning or middle but still a ton of money blew on this shit.

A few times he did quit C/T after heavy use and quickly of course could not stand the w/d and caved. He'd proceed to order an overnight fedex package containing his needed fix. He claims the withdrawals were absolutely unbearable, worst being restless legs, endless insomnia, cold but very sweaty, time passing ridiculously slow, anxiety, depression, some vomiting, can't hold down food, etc, etc. So after talking about it and with our research, he finally got some sense and tapered to just enhanced bali and then just powdered leaf, all steps taking less than a week, then jumped but had an arsenal of clonidine, valium, immodium, hot baths, l-tyrosine, vitamins, etc, etc. Looking back, he says he feels like a lil bitch since withdrawal was fairly easy and short term, like 3 days after jumping and he was back to baseline. He says he has CT off of short-term binges of hydros and oxys with no taper, and just "felt like shit" for a couple days. But the kratom w/d caught him off guard initially, but in the end he concludes that it isn't so awful if you taper just a lil bit.

Healthwise, kratom (powered leaf at least) has provided mass fiber and that is clear from hearing how regular he says he was at least. He also noticed that several warts on his fingers and toes which were growing to the point of him hiding them with band-aids. The ones on his toes made it painful to walk. He says that about 1 month after starting kratom, they almost fully cured, or went dormant or w/e, being viral, but are completely gone visually. This could just be a coincidence in my opinion, but he claims that there might be some kind of immune system boost or something provided by kratom since he changed nothing else at the time.

To this day, he has been off kratom for about 6 months. He doesn't consider using it again because he pretty much avoids costly habits since he thinks they aren't worth it. At least the uei and maybe tincture mixed with uei he liked a lot, but it still cost too much. He even said he thinks opiates would be a better option if he had to choose since it takes less to get high and they typically last longer. But he claims to have tried everything except dilaudid and fentanyl and kratom at the right dose and extract made him feel better than anything else he's tried, opioid wise.

YouKnowYouWantThis
29-01-2011, 08:24
good luck to yall's

attempt4
31-01-2011, 07:51
My brother started on the occasional uei mixes (roughly 20% uei), for a few months, then went to straight uei. He got to the point to where he felt like shit after about 8 hours of his last dose, so he did the sensible thing, dose again of course. Well, his tolerance sky rocketed like expected by us both, but he had the money and loved the way it made him feel, more so in the beginning at least. When he managed to moderate his use, and withdraw for a little while, the first doses really made him feel like everything was right (euphoria). It gave his tons of motivation to get things done and made him score high on his college exams, which were tough. It improved his normally bland personality 10 fold and made his a very charming guy. No one ever suspected a thing but it ended up costing him over $40-50 per day towards the end, using it almost daily for nearly a year. Of course it didn't cost that much in the beginning or middle but still a ton of money blew on this shit.

A few times he did quit C/T after heavy use and quickly of course could not stand the w/d and caved. He'd proceed to order an overnight fedex package containing his needed fix. He claims the withdrawals were absolutely unbearable, worst being restless legs, endless insomnia, cold but very sweaty, time passing ridiculously slow, anxiety, depression, some vomiting, can't hold down food, etc, etc. So after talking about it and with our research, he finally got some sense and tapered to just enhanced bali and then just powdered leaf, all steps taking less than a week, then jumped but had an arsenal of clonidine, valium, immodium, hot baths, l-tyrosine, vitamins, etc, etc. Looking back, he says he feels like a lil bitch since withdrawal was fairly easy and short term, like 3 days after jumping and he was back to baseline. He says he has CT off of short-term binges of hydros and oxys with no taper, and just "felt like shit" for a couple days. But the kratom w/d caught him off guard initially, but in the end he concludes that it isn't so awful if you taper just a lil bit.

Healthwise, kratom (powered leaf at least) has provided mass fiber and that is clear from hearing how regular he says he was at least. He also noticed that several warts on his fingers and toes which were growing to the point of him hiding them with band-aids. The ones on his toes made it painful to walk. He says that about 1 month after starting kratom, they almost fully cured, or went dormant or w/e, being viral, but are completely gone visually. This could just be a coincidence in my opinion, but he claims that there might be some kind of immune system boost or something provided by kratom since he changed nothing else at the time.

To this day, he has been off kratom for about 6 months. He doesn't consider using it again because he pretty much avoids costly habits since he thinks they aren't worth it. At least the uei and maybe tincture mixed with uei he liked a lot, but it still cost too much. He even said he thinks opiates would be a better option if he had to choose since it takes less to get high and they typically last longer. But he claims to have tried everything except dilaudid and fentanyl and kratom at the right dose and extract made him feel better than anything else he's tried, opioid wise.
Well thats just silly, using UEI high end extracts that much and its asking for trouble.

Lost Ego
31-01-2011, 09:47
Have you ever had any bad experiences with Kratom?

Yes one time i took kratom and washed it down with hella alchohol (this was one of my first times) and right after that my friend told me kratom + achohol is bad 99% of the time. So i smoked hella weed and washed some more kratom down with more alchohol and smoked hella more weed. 5 hours into a sick high later i threw up hella. i wasnt even in the bathroom xD, i threw up in a cup and it overflowed

edit: the weed made it longer b4 i threw up and gave me a better high

averagejoeforever
02-02-2011, 02:42
uei kratom and tinctures wow thats a expensive habit your brother had there pal i have treated myself too uei occasionally and i agree its a lovely extract and equals any morphine dia morphine or pod tea that i have taken since morphine is so hard to get hold of nowadays i have settled with pod tea its the cheapest option with a rewarding high kratom is way too expensive and the withdrawals are like you described underrated

BIOCHEM77
04-03-2011, 04:41
Agreed. Most bang for ur buck I think. Anyone know bout kratom being effective while on suboxone?
I doubt that Kratom would elicit any response when taken with suboxone/subutex. Buprenorphine binds very strongly to a variety of different opoid receptors including those that the different alkaloids of Kratom show activity against. I would suggest to try and ditch the Sub and give Kratom a shot as a substitute. It has done wonders for a number of people and is most likely easier on your body than buprenorphine.

jheckrules1
06-03-2011, 18:59
Yes one time i took kratom and washed it down with hella alchohol (this was one of my first times) and right after that my friend told me kratom + achohol is bad 99% of the time. So i smoked hella weed and washed some more kratom down with more alchohol and smoked hella more weed. 5 hours into a sick high later i threw up hella. i wasnt even in the bathroom xD, i threw up in a cup and it overflowed

edit: the weed made it longer b4 i threw up and gave me a better high

Anything is bad with alcohol. It is a poisonous neurotoxin.

Pegasus
07-03-2011, 06:08
I doubt that Kratom would elicit any response when taken with suboxone/subutex. Buprenorphine binds very strongly to a variety of different opoid receptors including those that the different alkaloids of Kratom show activity against. I would suggest to try and ditch the Sub and give Kratom a shot as a substitute. It has done wonders for a number of people and is most likely easier on your body than buprenorphine.

I agree with this for the most part, though kratom over the long period may have some effects on the liver, but this is not definitive one way or the other at all. Pesticides on the leaves of kratom could definitely have negative effects. The fact is, we don't know too much about long term effects of bupe, and we haven't done much actual research on kratom's long term effects (that I am aware of), so really it is hard to say one way or another.

CKone
04-09-2013, 22:33
Hello. I am late to this ballgame. I noticed that I started using Kratom everyday and when I stopped I would get these horrible leg cramps, so I kept doing them. Well, a few weeks ago I realized that it was taking every extra cent I had so I stopped cold turkey. I found this thread online and thought it was SUPER helpful, cause I'm so tired of reading that kratom has no withdrawals. That's not true. So, long story short, here I am on day 15. I have this mind fog, and was already on anti-depressants before I started kratom, but they are NOT helping right now. And I keep reading that the physical symptoms go away in a few days, but I am still having the leg cramps. Not as bad as before, but they're still there. I just don't feel normal. I feel listless, blah, restless, tired, and NOTHING seems to help. I have tried ashwagandha and it helps a little bit, but most days that I wake up, I just wanna go back to sleep. I miss being able to smile again, to laugh and to enjoy things.

Danny Al'thor
05-09-2013, 18:35
The thing I have found out about Kratom, is that it is alot like tramadol, as it has alot of different properties than just an opiate. Thats why I find the withdrawls a lot worse than say just coming off oxys!

Hiltoniano
07-09-2013, 19:34
never had any withdrawals and i use a few times a week for the past year. but I also take 2-4 week breaks every 3 months so....
I also use other opiates like dope, opana, oxy, morph, hydrocodone. I have never really had withdrawals and I am very lucky. Kratom loses effectiveness after like 3 days consecutive dosing and so it is self-limiting.

LSDiesel
10-09-2013, 16:28
I don't really think that you can count my experience, but I feel that kratom withdrawals are very real and very uncomfortable. The reason why I think you can't really count my experience as valid is because I often would be using dope (diamorphine) for several days, and then when money or supply was running low, I would switch to kratom, and then after using kratom for several days everyday, I would experience WD that was just as uncomfortable as when I stopped dope. So I was probably still WDing from dope, not kratom.

YingYang05
24-02-2014, 14:25
Thought it best to bump this than create a new thread, but on average how long should withdrawal last because im on day 14 now and still feel physically and mentally terrible and this is with a habit of on average 25g of Green Malay daily(other than when mail was late) for 5 years. Is it possible i have prolonged the withdrawals with tramadol? over the last two weeks i have taken 50mg 3 seperate times when withdrawl was at its worst.

Thanks

《Plasticity》
24-02-2014, 22:19
Thought it best to bump this than create a new thread, but on average how long should withdrawal last because im on day 14 now and still feel physically and mentally terrible and this is with a habit of on average 25g of Green Malay daily(other than when mail was late) for 5 years. Is it possible i have prolonged the withdrawals with tramadol? over the last two weeks i have taken 50mg 3 seperate times when withdrawl was at its worst.

Thanks
When you say your on day 14 do you mean day 14 of nothing at all or day 14 since you began your taper etc? I ask because as a 3+ year, 25g a day kratom addict my withdrawals are usually gone by day 14. I also use tramadol to help me quit and it doesn't really ad much, if any withdrawals but I only use it for a rapid taper. When I quit I use the following method: I cut out all my daytime doses and take ~200mgs of tramadol throughout the day and take 3g in the night so I can sleep (sleep plays a HUGE factor on my duration of withdrawals IME so make sure you get sleep each night), from here on I drop my dose of tramadol by 25-50mgs a day till I'm down to my 3g nightly dose. I work on tapering my nightly dose and when I'm down to around 1.5g I jump and take some sort of benzo each night until I can sleep. Usually a week after I make the jump to the benzos my withdrawals are 95% gone.

When quitting any drug it's important thag you taper before jumping or your gonna have to deal with PAWS, did you go from 25g a day to nothing? If so that may be your problem right there, anyways don't worry, by 14 days you should be well over the hill. I bet that in a week you should be at least 95% again, just don't give up. If you have any benzos around and can handle not getting addicted to them they REALLY ease the whole process, if you can't get a hold of benzos but are.open to the idea search up "etizolam" on google, it's a legal pharmaceutical benzodiazepine (well, technically thienodiazapene) that can be purchased online, PM me for more info if you want. Keep strong, you'll make it to the other side of the tunnel in no time.

YingYang05
26-02-2014, 12:55
No i quit CT, tried tapering before but it never works for me.... in my kratom induced state of bliss and apathy i always end up just thinking fuck it and start taking loads of it. However i am glad to say that yesterday i took 1.5g of phenibut and had a very long 11 hour sleep and woke up feeling a massive difference, for the better i might add, i wasn't aware one night could make such a difference, the world feels much brighter, or at least im seeing it with more clarity...weird but im guessing that's my brain rewiring itself.

I think i will be fine here on out, but would you by chance know how kratom withdrawal fares with tramadol withdrawal?

《Plasticity》
26-02-2014, 19:42
Tramadol withdrawal is WAY worse, trust me. When you withdrawal from tramadol your basically going through opioid and anti-depressant withdrawal at the same time due to tramadols SSRI/SNRI activity. I've actually heard more than a few times that tramadol withdrawal can be worse than oxy withdrawal but since I've never been addicted to either I can't vouch for that and yeah, sleep is very vital in withdrawal which is why I make sure to get as much sleep as possible, even if that means taking a tiny dose of kratom, tramadol, or benzos. Be carefull with phenibut though, it's not unheard of to get nasty rebound effects/withdrawals after only a weeks use and tolerance builds insanely fast. Kratom withdrawals are a joke compared to phenibut/GABA-ergic withdrawal.

geoffreychaucer
28-02-2014, 09:53
I've had kratom habits for several months where I would dose once a day. When I quit cold-turkey the psychological effects were far more apparent than the physical effects. I felt pretty down and anxious although I had yet to be treated for depression so that was a compounding factor. The physical effects were mostly insomnia and RLS, mostly at night. Also you get a runny nose, chills and fatigue. But overall, it really wasn't that bad and it ended within a few days for the physical effects and a week or so for the mental part to diminish completely. One thing you won't get is GI upset, or at least not nearly to the same degree as with traditional opioids. That was my experience at least.

《Plasticity》
28-02-2014, 22:37
^ yup, that about sums up my experiences with kratom w/d as well. The whole GI symptom set is totally missing with kratom, a very good thing as I think once you start adding in insane cramps, nausea, vomiting, and diahrea the habit becomes less worth it IMO.

Cutless
01-03-2014, 09:28
Same here. In fact, I find constantly eating solid, healthy foods really helpful during w/d and seem to get a massive rebound appetite as part of my w/d. That's just my experience though.

perceptualvigilanc
01-03-2014, 11:17
In some cases, a taper can prolong the withdrawal period to little benefit when considering the overall pain experienced over time. Good hydration and a three day period of halfing the dose should be sufficient for anything less than an iv heroine dependance. Psychological addiction however is a much more difficult hurtle. Society has fallen victim to the AA style victim mentality, promoted by the for profit rehab industry. Medically, your withdraw must be a shock to the system for you start to physically recover. You cannot just taper to a grain of sand and expect to feel normal.

Flaga121
03-03-2014, 07:45
Attempt4 and cpt your comments in this thread have made me feel confident in my decision to use Kratom to help me finally kick my bupe habit (which is taper down to about half a mg a day at this point anyway). I'm not looking for full sobriety anyway to be honest, and Kratom sounds perfect. More like Cannabis, multidimensional and something I can geek out about. It's key that it's not an actively controlled pharmy due to my current occupation, and the variety is just perfect for what I look for in substance. I prefer the things that make me feel good to have some depth worth exploring, not a company stamp. Thanks for some great info all!

nonnihilnitoris
01-04-2014, 17:03
Hello fellow Bluelighters!

I've been using expensive and potent Kratom extracts daily for over two years, equivalent to between 10-20 grams of fresh leaf. Prior to yesterday, there was no way I could forestall SERIOUS withdrawal symptoms. But against my own will, I ran out this past weekend and suffered immensely painful withdrawal. In fact, I would still be shitting gallon after gallon, farting uncontrollably, etc.. if it weren't for a couple of OTC herbs I discovered which work miracles for withdrawal.

Fennel and Black Seed Oil control the gas and bloating.
Holy Basil and Tumeric reduce the soreness, anxiety and depression.
Pure Chamomile and melatonin to sleep.

I also found that ginger, marijuana, apple cider vinegar and garlic helped, although not as much as the aforementioned herbs.


The timeless events runs like this.

>Friday: No usual morning or evening kratom doses. Feeling shitty, mild withdrawal sets in.
>Saturday: Feeling miserable, I take a gram of ground leaf (not enhanced) but it does nothing. Suddenly I have to shit badly. The runs continue every 30 mins accompanied by tons of painful gas.
Apple cider vinegar, ginger and marijuana slightly reduced my symptoms but I was still getting weaker. I take another gram and it seems to stave off the withdrawal until morning.
>Sunday: The same symptoms appear the next day, early on, shitting gallons again and again. I'm sure I've lost 5 lbs already, 5 lbs I can't afford.

I make a trip to the health food store and pickup some herbs. Within an hour of taking the herbs, my symptoms disappear one by one. As hours pass, I announce to my wife that my experiment has been a success and my withdrawals have been conquered through health!


The fennel and tumeric (with black pepper for absorption), holy basil and chamomile are all you should need I think.

I ate nothing but smoothies, fruit and salads the whole time. I feel awesome now. My kratom arrived at my door finally, but I really don't feel like I need it.

I woke up early this morning (still in withdrawal, mildly, so I couldn't sleep past sunrise) but instead of laying slumped somewhere in my apartment, I went for a spontaneous morning run, which is unusual for someone who is in withdrawal, don't you think?

camjua
26-02-2015, 15:43
Sorry to bump this but thought I'd reply to this rather than start a new thread. I was taking 80-160mg of oxycontin up to 4 times a week as well as daily kratom between 3-5grams for nearly 6 months. I'm on day 3 of no drugs except melatonin, pepto bismol and Tylenol... I can hardly sleep, feel super nauseous... My whole body aches, sneezing, runny nose, restless leg syndrome etc. I feel like utter shit. I can barely get more than a few hours of sleep. What's weird is the last 2 days my withdrawals didn't seem so bad until last night. They go much worse over night. Especially when it comes to nausea. The pepto bismol doesn't seem to help in the slightest. Does anyone know any good foods or something to help with the nausea? I'd rather not take anymore psychotropic drugs, so other opioids and gaba drugs are out of the question..