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10 hour rave pre & post loading advice

IzGood

Bluelighter
Joined
Jan 27, 2003
Messages
220
I've been using E for a short period and have just searched, printed and read heaps of threads about pre and post loading and have some questions. These questions are relevant to a 10 hour rave I will be attending in a few months. As of yet I have only experienced E over short periods in clubs.
When should I digest my pre-roll load?
The main FAQ in this forum reccommends 1 to 1.5 hours before you roll, yeh other threads have said not to pre-roll 5-htp on the day you roll because it makes you tired and has a "higher affinity rate than MDMA"
In the main FAQ, it said that DLPA makes the effect of E last longer, is this true? and to what extent of an effect does it have? I'm asking this coz I'm looking to digest less E throughout the 10 hour night while still being high.
I've read elsewhere where mixing 5-htp with L-tyrosine (the precurosor to dopamine) could potentilly worsen neurotoxicity. Considering this, should I not have L-tyrosine in my pre-roll intake?
At what time should I post roll?
What sort of an effect does grapefruit juice have?
My proposed roll diet is:
Pre:
5-htp, 100-400mg
Alpha Lipoic Acid
Post:
5-htp, 100-400mg
Vitamin C
Have I not included anything in the proposed diet which is vital or neccessary?
Any input appreciated!
 
There is no definative answer to this. It's pretty much something that you work out what enhances your roll the best for you.
I personally would not take 5htp before a roll, and certainly no more than 100mg because for me it reduces my ability to be walking/dancing and increases my puddling capabilities enormously. I don't take any 5htp for around 24 hours before an event. I sometimes pre load the week or so before with 5htp 100mg at night, stopping the night before the event.
My current pre/post load regimen is approximately as follows:
Pre -
Decent sized meal
Sustained release multi vitamin/mineral
Magnesium
Antioxidant (Vit A, C, E plus B group)
ALA (usually about 300mg)
Sometimes I also take a herb which helps with blood circulation in your legs - horsechestnut (often formulated for varicose veins, but useful for anyone who wants to be on their feet a long time)
I try to take ALA during the night too, if the event is lax enough to allow passouts or no bag searches.
Post -
ALA (if I can also stomach food at the time)
5htp 100-200mg
Magnesium
Antioxidant
Liver Tonic (mine has Dandelion and Artichoke in it)
SLEEP
There are other things I add in sometimes, other times I take only the multi and the magnesium. Magnesium is ultra important for me because I get a lot of the muscle/jaw side effects from what is considered a small dose of mdxx, and I get really sore without it. Antioxidants work really well with ALA, and also give more energy.
As for grapefruit juice this is an excellent and informative thread, which can tell you a lot more than I know about it :)
I've had no experience with DLPA.
My suggestion if you're looking to have less mdxx throughout your night is to wait until part way through the night before you drop. Simple, and effective ;) Certainly do not try more than one method of increasing the length of your roll in any one night.
 
In addition to MezZedUp's excellent advice, I just wanted to add further support to the useof magnsium and ALA. Subjectively, I have found taking ALA (120mg caps) prior, during and after to reduce the hangover from MD**. I also find magnesium invaluable for reducing musle tension and jaw clenching.
I have never taken either DLPA or l-tyrosine so I can't comment on those.
Please also consider your body's energy requirements during the night. Make sure to drink some fluids with energy, like fruit juices, or smoothies if they sell them, or those 'breakfast in a liquid' type drinks. Try to drink some sports drinks too, as your body will require the electrolyes found in them. If you are unsure about your body's fluid requirements and the risk of water intoxication etc I can elaborate.
Be sure to have regular rest periods from dancing too, otherwise you will push your body too hard and will suffer for it!
Ultimately, you will need to experiment and see what works best for you. Just don't try to stay high for the whole 10 hour party, because 1) MDMA just doesn't last that long, even if redosing and 2) you will have one almighty comedown if you do. If you redose more than maybe 1-2 times during the night, eventually you get only more negative effects, not positive ones. It is better to accept that the MDMA high is a time limited one, and plan your party around that.
Personally, the whole day/night long party thing worries me, as it is just more encouragement for people to take larger amounts or multiple combinations of drugs. This means problems are more likely to occur, so the whole danger factor increases. Anyhow, play safe.
 
The page linked above has some Ok pre-loading tips (though personally I don't think it needs to be so complicated). Some of the other stuff I disgree with however, like
MDMA has never been known to precipitate psychosis. Also, try to have Vitamin C on hand in case things go do bad. 1000mg should pretty well kill the experience, 250-500 just to reduce the intensity. MDMA has been associated with psychosis (I have personally witnessed this in my job a couple of times). And in my personal experience and that of others vitamin c does not reduce the effects of MDMA. This thread Vitamin C expands on this topic.
Given the whole page is unreferenced, I would suggest taking caution with some of the advice therein.
 
MezZedUp -Thats is a very long and probably quite expensive list of vitamins and supplements you are taking there! Have you experimented with not talking certain things and seeing if you till get the medical side affects?
 
Hehe. They are not that expensive, and I do prefer taking them over not taking them. I find that I have a better experience. Plus I make use of a lot of those items in my day to day life (although not daily) so it is an expense which I would be managing even if I didn't use them for pre and post loads. I do tend to look at pre and post loading in a similar way as testing the pill - if I can't afford to have the things I know make my roll safer/more enjoyable, I will wait til I can.

My minimum preload is magnesium and a multi vitamin/mineral.
Sometimes I don't post load, but I do notice a difference in the time it takes me to recover.

Magnesium is essential for me due to my jaw and muscle response to md**. I simply don't enjoy the experience as much.

I personally don't use ALA as often as I would like to, simply because I find that particular supplement very expensive due to the large doses suggested for amphetamine use. My experiences with it as opposed to without it include a reduction in severity of headache the day or two after taking md**. It has seemed to improve the effectiveness of 5htp in helping deter depression on heavier useage occasions.

The antioxidant I take most of the time, it IMO gives me better energy, and provide protection against oxidative stress on the brain/body. On occasions where I haven't taken it, I have not noticed a difference in anything other than energy before ingesting md**.

The horsechestnut I usually only take if I have been at work (on my feet) all day prior to going out. That way I feel more able to be on my feet for much of the night as well.

In terms of the postload, I can't really give you observations as to which particualr items make for a better recovery. The things I take after a night out are based on information I know about md** and what my body might need afterwards. I do find that I have a more speedy brain recovery if I take all of the things mentioned, and tend to have less mood swings.

I hope that helped to answer your question? :)
 
With the money y'all are spending on other shit to supposedly "enhance" the effects...I would rather save my cash buy the rolls in bulk and pop an extra one
.
 
It's 10% about "enhancing" it and 90% about PROTECTING YOURSELF from the inevitable damage of amphetamines.

MezzedUp summed it up nicely. Food, sleep, and rest during the rave are the 3 essentials.

ALA is great indeed. Be sure to get the R-ALA isomer as the standard ALA is in fact S-ALA, which is inefficient.

ALA is highly synergesistic with another great supplement, Acetyl-Carnitine, which also protects the body and fuels the mind.

I have found that Deprenyl after a rave is a great way to come down smoothly. It has been proved to have neuroprotective effects against methamphetamine damage.

Whey protein is a safe bet, easy to digest and great for the muscles.

A combination of glutamine and creatine (low doses) will protect your muscles, help keep bodymass, and reduce soreness by a LOT.


Of course, if you are a freak like me, after the rave you will make yourself a fresh juice from 7-10 organic fruits and vegetables, mix in some Greens Nutritients mix and add some Wheat Grass, Barley Grass, Chlorella and Brewer's yeast. Impossible clarity and recuperation will begin 5 minutes after ingestion of so much life and energy. Don't do that right now though, as taking too much green stuff will probably make you flush too much toxins and chemicals, which can make you sick and make you feel like shit.


PS: and if you really want to enchance (not only protect ;) ) your roll, Piracetam + B50 + Alpha-GPC (choline source) will give you back the magic of your first times and add mood-balancing, choline restoration and neuroprotective effects to a clearer mind. Nootropics are the shit :)

PSS: Really, now that my things are set up, this routine costs me about 10$ in supps and food and take 30 min to do. The result is that body-mind recuperation will be much, much faster. And since I work at 50$ an hour, having 10 or 20 more hours of productivity (on say, the next 3 weeks), pays for itself in 15 minutes of work when before I would have been in bed / unmotivated / too fucked up to work right.


PSSS: Really, if you want to keep it simple, the "basic" healty raver stack is

Sleep before (at least 4 hours)
5-htp (a must, don't pre-load it the first few times)
Food (organic green food if possible, whey protein, etc. ) Prepare your meals BEFORE the party.
Anti-oxydants (see food above, + Vit C, + ALA if you can)
Glutamine for muscle protection (incredibly efficient), 5g before and after party.
Magesium if you clench your teeth
Sleep after

Deprenyl, Carnitine, melatonin, piracetam etc are great additions to consider when you'll have covered the bases, but one thing at a time, grasshopper ;)
 
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But see...If you eat healthy, exercise and get 7-8 hours of sleep everyday, it really shouldnt matter though IMO.
 
MDMA is extremely oxidant and corrosive for the brain synapses. Semi-permanent to permanent damages are cumulative. Sleep or exercice will protect your body and keep your energy levels up, but will do almost nothing to protect for the oxidative stress suffered by the serotonin-depleted synapses. Depression, anxiety, mood swings and brain fog, here we come!

Increasing your number of antioxydants in the brain, free-radical scavengers and quickly refill your synapses of serotonin with 5-htp are the only way to protect from this specific damage.

Really, the day after a rave you should feel actually be MORE intelligent, aware and alive. This is what happens to me, now. With this routine the next day I have the brain-enhancing effects of the pill (faster connections in the brain, deeper emotions, more energy, more motivation from higher dopamine etc) without the side effects (irregular / chaotic brain waves and CNS, serotonin depletion, fatigue, brain fog, flashes of images in your head...).

After a rave and consumption of pills, you should be able to do your homeworks efficiently (I do sometimes, great fun), have coherent high-level dicussions, pass memory/cognitive tests as well or better than normal (I know I did), feel zero depression and paranoia, get to sleep easily at a reasonable time, have zero to medium muscle soreness, clean teeth, good skin and good vibe.

If you're managing to do all this by yourself without any supplements, kudos to you. I know I have never met someone who could do it without massive protection and recuperation.

If you feel tired, hazy, unmotivated, fogy, incoherent, incapable of difficult high-level brain work the next day, then your brain and CNS suffered too much damage. You're doing it wrong and should go back to Pill Consumption 101 for your own good.

This thread is all you need to pass your exam ;)
 
Before a rave i often don't take suplements besides the ones i normally take being Cod Liver Oil, Garlic, Gingko and those mega tablets with every vitamin on the planet. I'm not sure if any make a difference but one thing i do know for sure. Don't eat very oily foods ie: Fast food. I have an idiot friend that keeps eating fast food before raves and feeling sick during it because of being bloated and such (eating 1 hr before rave). I'd eat a nice meal with simple starches like some wholemeal bread or even better a nice bowl of rice and some steamed vegetables.

Keep it simple and you'll be fine.
 
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