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Cats Claw's effects on Methadone

MolokoVelocet

Ex-Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 10, 2006
Messages
178
Thought id throw this one out there. From what ive read it significantly reduces metabolism and potentiates/lengthens methadone. Even more surprising is its supposed effectiveness at even low doses. Being an NMDA agonist id imagine it would help block tolerance too.

Cat's Claw on its own is one fucking cool herb that deserves so much more research it kills me. Its potential with opiates seems pretty big.

OK.. READY....DISCUSS. Ill chime in with some hard info when i get a chance to relocate it
 
What's the active compound in cat's claw? It'd be a pretty rare beast - a naturally occurring NMDA antagonist
 
It doesn't seem to be an NMDA antagonist...

It has the following effects:
-Immunostimulating by way of enhancing phagocytosis:
-Ganglion-blocking with an enhancing effect on parasympathetic tone:
-Inhibitory to striated muscle contraction;
-Hypotensive, uterostimulant and antipyretic;
-Diuretic.
-Stimulation of the non-specific immune system with activation of macrophages and granulocytes to eliminate non-physiological substances;
-Enhancement of the sensitivity and reactivity of the immune system to seize and to eliminate very weak antigens;
-Inhibition of inflammation by a repairing incorporation of lipids into the lipid matrix of damaged cell membranes;
-Selective inhibition of growth of malignant cells by simultaneous improvement of erythrocyte and macrophage function;
-Enhancement of the growth inhibitory effect of (pharmaceutical) cytostatics by an intact immune system;
-Selective growth inhibition of virustransformed cells.

It's true that you can read in many sites that it really potentiates Methadone.
I'm very curious about that as well....
 
MolokoVelocet said:
read up on Cats Claw + Methadone. Uncanny potentiation and basically stops the body from breaking the shit down. ALthough I can forsee possible organ damage from such extended runs on an already organ damaging opiate :p

If this poster is right, then I think Cat's Claw acts on the enzymes that metabolize Methadone to inactive products (CYP3A4, CYP2D6, and two other ones, I forgot their names)
 
Cats Claw IS an NMDA Antagonist (i said agonist in first post, oops).

Mine google/pubmed and you'll find some studies confirming this. Ill find more later... but heres a couple of the better ones demonstrating this on pubmed.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/..._uids=12624526&query_hl=8&itool=pubmed_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/..._uids=12893423&query_hl=8&itool=pubmed_docsum

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/..._uids=11197086&query_hl=8&itool=pubmed_docsum

Aye naturally occuring NMDA antagonists are so rare. Interestingly enough it strongly antagonizes NMDA without causing dissasosciative effects.

ill do some actual research and post some shit. cats claw is a pretty cool herb, its lack of attention considering its unique properties (far beyond recreational drugs) makes me want to champion this shit. Got lots of shit to do today but when i get some spare time ill summerize some shit and post references

im surprised something with such a relevant effect to recreational drug use is completely unknown, even to the veterans of this board
 
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From what i can tell it should work on ALL opiates. If this is true then this would instantly be the reigning king of opiate add-ons.

Just speculation but its looking like Cats Claw could be a powerful tolerance blocker, potentiator, and metabolism inhibitor for some if not all opiates.

Fucking Jack of all Trades... if this holds true then we got us one hell of a OP tool. Sorry.. again, i got very little time and i gotta nod off for an early morning... but i promise you guys im gonna spend some hours mining google scholar (check it out, recently discovered it... its like pubmed X5), pubmed, and various boards.

Best way to find out is to mail me various highly schedueled narcotics so i can spend hours testing this theory, ofcourse. =D
 
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cats claw and potentiation

I thought that cats claw would be good mixed with opiates too.

in doses ranging from 1 grams to over 20 grams I cant say that it is very noticeable.

what is noticeable is a reduction in joint pain it seems...but I would need to consume the herb more to confirm this.

recently a company has made isolated alkaloid tinctures of this plant.

take care.
 
Of the opioids, methadone and ketobemidone are also known as NMDA-antagonists. Perhaps that's why those two often seem to ease chronic pain better than morphine. I have been eating 3 Cat's claw capsules a day for a while now but I am not sure if it's my imagination that tells me that it's working...
 
since this cats claw is legal, i assume its alright for me to ask where i could get some right?

if not mods do what you will..
 
you'll most likely be warned for even thinking about posting about asking where one might find cats claw. i aint joking.

ill pm you
 
i cant believe this...i read this whole thread and only ONE person posted whether or not they actually tried cats claw and methadone(or any opiate/opioid)....and his posts isnt making me run out to the herbal store anytime soon!!!

lol please lets worry about antagonist/agonist, inhibitor, enzymes, etc later on...for now, lets just see if it fucking works at TRULY potentiating an opiate high...none of that grapefruit juice or tagament bullshit(yall know its increase in effects is negligable at best...personally i get NOTHING). the only thing ive found to actually increase the "high" of an opiate is phergan(promethazine)....and not just increased sedation.
 
I am very familiar with herbs and herbal teas and all that, i actually have a large textboox size binder overflowing with literature on herbs and plants to use for teas, tinctures, baths, etc. It describes the best method for each specific disease/complication.

I'm sure that if i look for cat's claw i will find it.....however the name was familiar to me b/c i am pretty sure i remeber reading it as an ingerdient in an Lakota, which is an indian (native american) pereparation capsule of different herbs and plants.

However, how is the best way (does it say?) to take cat's claw? By method of tea? (which i'm assuming would be best since it has all the chemicals of the plant, unless it is only a CERTAIN chemical that potentates opiates/opioids, in which case an extract or a pill would be better). Are there pills containg the extract (like there are with Valerian, Kava Kava, etc) in pharmacy stores?

I would really reasearch the ACTUALL effects of cat's claw, before you use it in higer does or daily doses to potentate opiates/opioids, b/c teas are actual drugs, and can contain drugs to cause harm in the long run, esp when someone is taking other medications like opiates/opioids and/or other drugs (rec or therapeautical).

I am interested in this since i'm on methadone myself, i came down from 205mg to 140mg right now and i'm on a slow taper so i am interested as well in this thread.
 
Cats Claw IS an NMDA Antagonist (i said agonist in first post, oops).

Mine google/pubmed and you'll find some studies confirming this. Ill find more later... but heres a couple of the better ones demonstrating this on pubmed.

Er, no... Those abstracts that you've linked to are about compounds from Uncaria rhynchophylla that have NMDA antagonist activity, but Uncaria rhynchophylla isn't cat's claw - cat's claw is actually Uncaria tomentosa, which is a different species. Being from the same genus in no way implies that the two different species will have the same alkaloids or same pharmacological activity (compare Salvia divinorum to any of the other thousand members of the genus Salvia if you want an example).

The last ref does mention a compound isolated from U. tomentosa that reverses the behaviour blocking actions of a known NMDA antagonist

Uncarine E (20 mg kg(-1), i.p.) also blocked the impairment of passive avoidance performance caused by the nicotinic receptor antagonist mecamylamine (15 mg kg(-1), i.p.) and the N-methyl-D-aspartate (NMDA) receptor antagonist (+/-)-3-(2-carboxypiperazin-4-yl)-propyl-1-phosphonic acid (CPP; 7.5 mg kg(-1), i.p.)

but it says nothing about it being mediated via the NMDA (PCP) receptor, so you can't infer anything from that stating that cat's claw has any NMDA antagonist activity
 
ktx49 said:
i cant believe this...i read this whole thread and only ONE person posted whether or not they actually tried cats claw and methadone(or any opiate/opioid)....and his posts isnt making me run out to the herbal store anytime soon!!!

lol please lets worry about antagonist/agonist, inhibitor, enzymes, etc later on...for now, lets just see if it fucking works at TRULY potentiating an opiate high...none of that grapefruit juice or tagament bullshit(yall know its increase in effects is negligable at best...personally i get NOTHING). the only thing ive found to actually increase the "high" of an opiate is phergan(promethazine)....and not just increased sedation.

As for grapefruitjuice, it works but ONLY with methadone in my opinion. I have never felt anything with the other opoids. Better still is of course higher alkaline ph in the urine. And that is proven scientifically.But the only things that will happen is that the methadone is LONGER in your system. You will not feel more euphoric. As for cats claw...To really judge cats claw the more ppl use it the better I guess. I am not sure that it's not a coincidence that I feel almost overmedicated right now.
 
cats claw's been around forever and nobody ever looks into it. i used to have a methadone habit and the shit really has significant lengthening effects on methadones action/duration. 25% maybe? give or take placebo effect, but real
 
IntralopeAMINE said:
cats claw's been around forever and nobody ever looks into it. i used to have a methadone habit and the shit really has significant lengthening effects on methadones action/duration. 25% maybe? give or take placebo effect, but real

That's what I felt like - only I wasn't sure it wasn't some coincidence or my imagination. But I do feel better stabilized or what the f-k the word is.
 
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