Bluelight Stall - Sydney : where to now?

I'm starting a new thread because bluelight stall part 3 seems to have ground to a halt.
Still at least the issue of affiliation/non-affiliation seems to have been resolved.
So....
Where to now? That is the question.
I suggest we get together for another meeting, this time somewhere that all interested bluelighters can go ie. not a pub, perhaps a cafe.
If you think a meeting is not necessary and that we can do this via icq or instant messenger then so be it.
I'm just keen to keep things rolling along.
If we're still aiming for Chemistry in November or Homelands in December then we really do have to get cracking in order to be ready in time.
What say you?
Finn

i think a second meeting would be usefull. especially if we can get some legal advice b/w now and the meeting about pill testing(our responsibilities, liabilities, etc).
i think the best place to start a pill testing stand would be at a bush party. the promoters of these events seem to be more approachable. plus there would be fewer problems with lack of space(club owners would probably get narky about a table taking up room on their dancefloor) and the authorities.
anyhoo i'll be at the next meeting
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professor.....whats another word for pirate treasure?

If you make the meeting this weekend, I'll come too! Please make it this weekend! (before we all head out in diff directions or something?)
Anyway, I wont be checking back here this weekend, but i'll get Mr Pope to check the thread for me
cheers,
mona.

Yay, Finn! You're a corker!
I'm in! Will wind up the research tomorrow (Friday) in preparation for a possible weekend meetup.
What about Newtown? Heaps of cafes, fairly central. How about *satellite* on Sat or Sun arvo?
happy, happy, happy bananafish
P.S. Based on a detailed review of all the threads, (but haven't seen actual minutes of meetings yet... can't get in! ), below is a suggested agenda of items to workshop/ resolve in the meeting, and current/ potential resources to achieve things. Sorry so formal and detailed but I do this stuff for a living! It generally works. Please improve the list!
LEGAL ISSUES
 Possession of an illegal substance: for the tester and the presenter of the pill. (Resources: D&A, NDARC, Timothy Moore of RLS, Candyflip@ThePeak, Chemical Generation)
 Police "standing over" stall. (Resources: RLS, police liaison unit.)
 Insurance for testers, clubs, promoters. (Resources: any insurance buffs out there ?)
 Liability disclaimers for stall (esp. tort of negligence) (Resources: RLS, check out disclaimer on test kits.)
 Local Govt. permission?? (energy emperor response to Temptress mentioned council permission for stall.)
ETHICS
 Information provided verbally by stall staff about pills presented or enquired about, and on very strong test results. (JB says dancesafe advise strongly against advising on planned pill purchases or results, instead sticking strictly to reporting MDMA test result.)
 Haste's approach of empowerment and referral. (love it, H! )
HEALTH PROMOTION/ HARM MINIMISATION
 Project evaluation (*evidence* to support continuation , funding and promotion of the project). (Resources: Health Promotion Unit.) (Possibly accompanied by a survey of punters and promoters regarding support of pill testing, as purplelisa suggested?)
 Data collection on pills tested, including "a proforma sheet for each test, with space to fill in the details or checkboxes to tick that we need to keep track of, a la: shape, size, colour, details, name the pill was sold under, suspected contents, test result etc." (Big Trancer) with info report on each event tested placed on website.
 Pamphletted information. (Resources: D&A, ravesafe, dancesafe, erowid, bluelight.)
 Harm reduction brief intervention procedure at stall. (Res. A/A)
 Medical issues and support: St. John's?
OPERATIONAL PROCEDURES
 Mission statement, project objectives, policies, strategic plan (NOT at all as scary as they sound!)
 Standardised procedures for testing and reporting to punters. (Professionalism, safety) (Resources: dancesafe?, international testing protocols- JB?)
 Standardised procedures for approaching promoters, setting up stalls, etc.
 OH&S (eg. Hazardous chemicals, hygiene.)
BUSINESS ISSUES
 Becoming a not-for-profit organisation?
 Registration of business name?
 ABN?
 Business name and byline! (ebee willing to put up prize of BL t-shirt for best name!)
FINANCIAL ISSUES
 Donations from locked box at stall, promoters, ?commerce gateway on website, philanthropic trusts.
 Costings of procedural and promotional materials and services.
PROJECT PROMOTION
 Event Promoters: Who do we have established contacts with? How can we best use them? Which promoters are already onside and ready to admit us? (Resources: Temptress(Energy Emperors) and who else?)
 Banners/ brochures/ flyers/ cards/ stickers: Need content, design and printing. (Resources: XSI11VE, Temptress, and who else?)
 Sub-domain page on Bluelight: with information, commerce gateway, information links, EZ tester sales, results of testing events, etc. (Resources: ?Jase, ?Cowboy Mac; Big Foot Dragon can provide a domain name for two years for $33, plus free hosting.)
 Avant Card free café postcards might sponsor small print run if provided with ready to go disc. (Need graphic designer to do this.)
MEDIA
 Importance of positive representation, and how to facilitate this. Approaching street press might be best bet. ?National feature discussion with Paul Dillon of NDARC on Triple J.)
thanks all,
bananafish
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"Take your stinking paws off me, you damn dirty ape!" (Taylor, Planet.)
[This message has been edited by bananafish (edited 19 October 2000).]

ohhhhhhhh Bananafish you and Finn are the best!!!!! Well done!!! Come to Melbourne!! If you need any assitance from me please do not hesitate to contact me. As far as timelines are concerned - when are you aiming to get the first stall up and running - tell me cause I wanna be there
Thank you so much Finn and Bananafish for your un-wavering support - love your work
Haste
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"Well, me don't swim too tough so me don't go in the water too deep."-July, 1975 Bob Marley

Well actually Haste all I did was suggest we have another meeting, but ok, if you insist, I'm happy to bask in bananafish's reflected glory
but seriously...
Thankyou bananafish for so clearly and succinctly summarising where we are at right now.
Mona, yeah baby, let's do the meeting thing this weekend. Is Sunday okay for everyone. I really hope so because I reckon we're back on track.
So...
Let's meet on Sunday afternoon in Newtown at the cafe bananafish suggested (please post directions bananafish).
Where : Satellite (Newtown)
When : Sunday 4pm
Who : all interested bluelighters
Why : 'cos we damn well can
Things to do in the meantime....
1. Contact Redfern Legal Centre today re : legalities. bananafish since you're so on fire I'll leave that one up to you.
2. Research dancesafe site re: pill testing
3. Brainstorm, brainstorm, brainstorm... bring the results of your brainstorming with you to the meeting.
4. Whatever else you guys can think of (it's early and my brain aint working).
YAY....
Finn

BananaFish don't apologise for being formal! - it's just what we need at the moment!
Finn is a perfect example of the fact that our enthusiasm isn't waining, we just hit a little wall with a lack of resources to aid with resolution of legal issues so things were a bit quiet.
A meeting this weekend would be great to get our focus back and keep everyone involved. See yuz there
[This message has been edited by XSI11V (edited 19 October 2000).]

Onya guys! May I suggest that you will get further with this project and be less likely to have clampdowns by authorities who hate harm minimisation if you link up with an existing Drug & Alcohol service. You might try ADIS 8382 2111 (Alcohol & Drug Information Service) or CEIDA (Centre for Education & Information on D & A) 9818 0444, or NUAA (NSW Users & AIDS Association) 9557 1476, or the people involved in setting up the safe injecting room in the Cross which will be set up under the auspices of the Uniting Church (but I'm not sure who's running it in practice - ask NUAA). Bottom line is I think you need the POLITICAL support of some of these people to get this project running successfully, as you will encounter the same sort of backlash from the "Say No to Drugs" camp that the safe injecting rooms project has suffered. Good luck - you're doing great work! )

Thanks for the input D&AWg (drug and alcohol worker guy?). We'll follow that up.
This is the exact reason I advocated doing this independently of bluelight.
More useful tips and friendly advice will be very gratefully received.
Cheers,
Finn

You got it Finn! NUAA are in Newtown btw, but if you're meeting on Sunday get hold of them today because I don't they're open over the weekend. Also check the Ravesafe website (don't know URL) - but no doubt you know about them cos they have a similar project to what you're proposing. I know it's working well in South Africa at raves there.

great work Finn and bananafish, fantastic layout of all that needs to be worked out. great job everyone
unfortunately though i can't make the meeting due to other commitments on the sunday and the fact that i have assignments due on monday
hopefully one of these days i'll be able to get to a meeting!
let us all know how it goes.
Bigfoot Dragon.

OK. From legal and health:
Welcome, D&AWg. We think alike! Credibility, credibility, credibility! While you've been here, I have been chasing the very agencies you mention!
1. Paul Dillon of NDARC is overseas until November 2nd, but is likely to be very helpful and enthusiastic, with current international information a plus.
2. Timothy Moore of RLC is also OS, until the end of Nov. I spoke at length with the centre co-ordinator, however, who is very keen, and also said Timothy is on a steering committee looking into the legal issues we mention, and will be very interested in working with us.
I'll be in touch with both these guys by email.
3. I've put in a call to the office of Dr. Alex Wodak who is head of a major drug and alcohol service in Sydney. He is a sassy, no-nonsense player, and a major figure in the industry; and as such is potentially a key stakeholder for the project. I await a call from them.
4. I am still chasing NUAA (fingers crossed) and also following up ADIS and CEIDA. More on that later.
5. I am liaising with an inner city NSW Health Department Health Promotion Unit, who are experts in implementing and evaluating programmes such as the one we plan. They will be able to help us to set up the data collection Big Trancer described. It is impossible to underestimate the importance of this part of the project, in terms of accountability and credibility.
6. I am chasing the Rev.Ray Richmond, who is in charge of the Tea Room D&AWg mentioned, run by the Uniting Church in the Cross. Issues of ethics, law and controversy will be the fare on the bill when I catch up with him.
7. I also thought it would be worth speaking to Drink Check, which is a project going into pubs, assessing people's alcohol use, and providing harm minimisation information. Legal drug, different story, but a lot of the same structures, etc. Will report later.
8. Last, but by no means least, I am in discussions with another inner city Drug and Alcohol Service. These guys are the real experts in drug and alcohol harm minimisation projects and can offer us a wealth of wise advice along the way. They advocate extreme caution, and setting it up really, really well from the beginning. I will post in detail about this later, because there's a lot to say, but the key thrust is for a "Pill Testing and Feedback" stall, which uses a standardised testing and feedback system as the hub for a brief harm minimisation intervention. (Give harm min. info while you're testing the pill.)
I am also looking into the logistics of selling testers, and the effectiveness of such interventions elsewhere. There's a lot of research to do, so please bear with me.
This is a long term project. It is worth doing properly. Accountability and credibility are definately the go.
Okay, I've really gotta run now. More later.
Tally ho!
bananafish
Haste, I will email you about all this. bf
P.S. Finn has suggested I also put this post in the BL Stall 3 Thread so it's available to everyone. I'll do this. If mods think it's unnecessary, just delete the other post. Ta.
[This message has been edited by bananafish (edited 20 October 2000).]

Here's an article outlining exactly what happens...
http://www.alternet.org/wiretapmag/stories/Gilson051700.html
and another one about the difficulties we may encounter
http://www.squall.co.uk/etest2.html
and this should give you an idea of the organisational issues we need to consider
http://dancesafe.org/seattle/bylaws.html
Bananafish... love yer work. Keep it up.
Finn
[This message has been edited by Finn (edited 20 October 2000).]

can't make meeting on sunday - HSC exam on monday. but still following progress and still deadly keen. u guys all rock !!!
tony

ok i'll try and answer the bitsthat had my name next to them:
ethics/operational procedures...
it's really the same question i guess. the dancesafe protocol is based on the protocols formed in europe. these protocols were put in place to deal with both the ethical and legal implications of pilltesting.
dancesafe's protocol is basically here.
i will be emailing aj in amsterdam and TheGamer in london to try and get copies of their local protocols.
one thing i just remembered about dancesafe'sprotocol is that they don't stress the need to keep the testing area asclean as possible. in the 20/20 segment on them the journos hacked them for not bothering to clean the razor blade used to scrape pills. someone in the mailing list said "so what? what could it matter?" i sent in a post saying how it could matter a lot, and it would be everyone's interest to at least wipe the blade with an alcohol swab. emmanuel posted that he didn't think it was such a big issue and that the journos had blown it out of proportion. still i know i'll be cleaning the blade properly.... dont need anything fucking it up...
the url for the south african site is:
http://www.ravesafe.org.za/
i think it's run by a guy called bruce, who splits his time between london and jo'burg... anyways he's very prominent on the dancesafe mailing list.
if i can help with any other info just ask.

Thanks haste and johnboy,
Much food for thought...
tomorrow perhaps!
for now....
I hereby declare that Finn and bananafish are clocking off for the night *inserts timecard in bundy machine*
We're hitting the town for a bit of r & r!
Finn

DAMN!!! sorry guys, but I was on my way back to school at 1pm I really am sorry I missed it - you guys seem to definitely have your shit together on this whole thing. Unfortunately, I'll be in Bathurst for a while now (exams)and probably won't b able to contribute properly until the end of the year..

Johnboy,
Thanks for that. I look forward to hearing the results from your friends in Europe. Finn has also found an enormous amount of useful information on protocols, etc, so I think between us all we should be able to put together some really fine standards. And I *totally* agree with you on cleaning the razors!! Hmmmn, wouldn't shave my legs with dancesafe razors, let alone my pills!!
mona,
We missed you at the meeting today! Totally understand about uni, though. (Go well!) Still, can we have long-distance visitation rights to your brain while we're putting this together?? Pretty pleeeeaaase?
haste,
Consider yourself adopted! You just need a note from your mum! 'Spose we have to do some kind of tribal rite, now, to seal the deal? Like a stupendous dancefest with magical blue lights in the middle of a volcano or something?? Oh, alright, then, if it's tradition!!
And can you please email me those documents ASAP so we can begin working on them together? Are you on Instant Messenger? Otherwise we can meet in the e-group to chat. Lots to talk through.
bananafish
[This message has been edited by bananafish (edited 22 October 2000).]
[This message has been edited by bananafish (edited 22 October 2000).]

Right! I'm sooo psyched!
(C'mon! Let's go!! )
What a great meeting........only the four of us, but i feel we got heaps done.....agenda or no
right, now i don't know how many of you peeps will see this - will probably have to post in a number of threads - but i'm currently compiling a database of pro***ers and need your help!!
if you know or have the details of any pro***ers, (such as the Trancendance ppl [Vido?], Homelands, Welcome 2001 etc etc) - contact name, phone email etc. Could you please email them to me? I'm talking Sydney, Melbourne, Perth, Brisvegas, *Anyone Anywhere* that holds regular or irregular nights/doofs/raves whatever.
Obviously, we're probably going to be looking for ppl to approach Ps in their local area in the future, but we'd like to send out some kind of formal kit with mission/vision statement, "this-is-what-we-want-to-do-at-your-event-let's-help-each-other-type-thing," plus i think it would be sensible to have one place where all the ppl we've contacted are listed to prevent loss of info and double-ups.
So, i would be much appreciable if you could help me (US!!) out.

super YAY!
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~"my head is full of space"~

yaytima,
GO, GRRRL, GO!!!
We are gonna have a *stupendous* database! And our promo package is going to be fantastic! I'm sooooo excited about this, too!!!
And do you know what? I looked it up, and we worked on *every single thing* on the agenda, apart from local government! We are soooooo on our way!!
YAY! YIPPEEE! YAHOOOOOOOO!
bananafish