taking E as aerosol / lung absorption of MDMA

A lecture at uni today gave me an interesting idea; how would administering E as an aerosol change the effects and the rate of absorption?
I’ve previously experimented with dissolving a capsule of EZ-tested MDMA (green&gold cap for those interested) in about 30 ml of water which I drank. Although a bit of a hassle, I found this to work excellent for me. Very subjectively, I found that I came on quicker and possibly stronger than when I ate the same capsule a few weeks later. Coming on quicker makes sense since it’s already dissolved in water, but stronger – I don’t know… there could’ve been different quantities of mdma in the two capsules (which were the same batch) – hard to say.
Now, What I had in mind was putting this solution in one of those old-style perfume aerosol pumps or in those pump-things with which your mom sprays plants. For clubbing purposes, I think I have seen tiny pump-sprays, which work along the same principle. Hair-spray almost.
So theoretically, if you inhale strongly as you spray the solution into your mouth, most of it should reach the lung to be absorbed by the lining epithelium to reach the pulmonary capillaries there. There’s already fluid (mostly water and salts) lining the alveoli, so a few mills of h2o and mdma probably wouldn’t make you drown, and whatever does not reach the lung would logically get trapped in the mouth or pharynx to go down to the gut the next time you swallow to be absorbed like normal pills. So what can you possibly lose? The big question is therefore DOES MDMA GET ABSORBED IN THE LUNG?
Obviously, the lung absorbs a variety of substances, tobacco/nicotine perhaps most frequently. Asthma puffers kind of works in the same manner. For marijuana, I was told by a friend that lung absorption actually is lower than gastrointestinal (GIT) (I think he said 6 and 40 % respectively), which advocates the munching of cookies rather than smoking pot, but I have no scientific facts whatsoever to back that up, just word of mouth (friend, when you read this I know you won’t take offence, haha, – looking forward to sharing that newly arrived 5-htp with ya!! ;-)
So, if MDMA gets absorbed in the lung, the benefits would be that the substance reaches the pulmonary then systemic circulation, totally staying clear of the portal circulation (which transports all “food” from your gut to the liver), to be distributed to the brain directly, BEFORE it gets partly metabolised by the liver as with gastrointestinal absorption. The same principle that applies to plugging.
Now, has anyone experimented with this before, or does anybody know anything about pulmonary (lung) absorption of MDMA?
Thanks
[This message has been edited by Euröslut (edited 16 October 2000).]

What's the diff between this and smoking a pill?

i think nothing, except that I'm not a fan of smoking, be it tobacco or pot or anything. But if you were to, how would you practically do it?

not sure as i am not a scientist. I think that their is already a thread on smoking pills, i didn't think it worked but my girlfriend says that she has seen people very messy from doing it (smoking pills that is).
to answer euro's question you would crush the pill up and sprinkle it on a cone, or sprinkle it through a joint with tobacco
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lurker
[This message has been edited by leumas (edited 10 October 2000).]

This is a bit pointless for you seeing as though you don't smoke BUT - Either sprinkle the crushed up pill on some cones OR make a line of pill on a table about the length of a cigarette (maybe a bit shorter), get a tailor cig and lick along the paper bit from the filter to the end, make it pretty wet. THEN roll the cigarette so the wet bit comes into contact with the pill and sticks. If you make the line relatively thin all of it will stick no probs. Then just smoke it like a normal dhurry mayte. But be careful not to move it too much, the pill will fall off and you'll have to put your nose (or tongue) to the ground and sniff (or lick) it up.
Any questions?

Theres a fairly big difference between smoking it and using an aerosol. One method puts a direct flame on the ecstasy, heating it or burning it or whatever and you inhale the fumes/smoke. Whereas dispensing it through an aresol just shoots MDMA down your gob
Still it doesnt sound like a good idea, and it would be difficult to get the MDMA fine enough to dispense, especially without your body coughing up anything that that irratates it.

like nickstar said getting it fine is a key here, personally i wouldnt try it but there is a medicine for athsma that is not a ventolin but a powder called terbutaline sulfate and another called buesonide that are so fine when you put it on your hand out of the dispenser u can barley see it. id be interested to get a scientific perspective on this but if u try it make sure its very very very fine, wouldnt wanna irritate your lungs

Nicstar & Cowboy Mac are on the ball, I think one of those asthma inhalers are the go (not the pump!) You'll need to crush your pill and cut it as fine as possible. You could get into trouble though if you are allergic to the binder that is used (no idea what that is - sorry!). I still think you'd be better off plugging it though - less hassle.
Tim

if mdma is dissolved in the water/aerosol, getting the powder fine enough wouldn't be an issue as it is DISSOLVED.
if, however, one wants to put it in a puffer, the pill would have to be crushed a hell of a lot, but even tiny bits of the pill will dissolve in the fluid lining of the alveoli in the lung.
hmm. maybe aerosol is bit of a hassle, but i was concerned about the cough reflex to foreign bodies down the respiratory tract.
what about crushing the pill profoundly, like talk almost, putting it all on a teaspoon or something, shoving it into the back of the mouth and then inhaling strongly. surely if the powder is dry it will get to the lung.
[This message has been edited by Euröslut (edited 11 October 2000).]

Here's another option...try to disolve it and put it in a nasal sprayer. Is MDMA easily disovable in water? I suppose it would have to be if it enters the bloodstream. But if so, then squirting the liquid up your nose ensures no wastage. Or you could spray it down your throat and inhale at the same time.
I don't see it as a problem for your lungs in aquaeous form. You breath more crap into your lungs in a walk through the city than you would doing that anyway. The trick would be to make sure you only disolve the MDMA, because the binder would probably not be soluable and your lungs would have to work to remove it.
Basically I don't see the problem if you are prepared so smoke either cigarettes or MJ because it's aquaeous.
The only question is....will someone give it a try?
DB

why not just crush up and snort the pill???

OR you can always drink your urine after u've pilled!!!

You know what Darkblade, that's not a bad idea... I've got some powder left (100mg)... ya seriously got me thinking

hmmm euro here has a point that isn't really practial but may well work well.
smoking pills however i think is not a good idea. too much can be wasted and maybe the heat destroys some of the precious MDMA which we wouldn't want to do.
Absorption of THC (in pot) is higher in the intestines than by smoking, if it is dissolved in other lipids....such as butter to make yummy hash cookies for example. yum yum.
as for plugging....hahah..cant do it. i'll stick to the tradtional technique

There's also the argument people use against making a habit of snorting pills... MDMA is more caustic than a lot of the chemicals we ingest, so the risk of damage being done by the powder to the mucous membranes is elevated in comparison with (for example) speed. I imagine that inhaling a small amount of powder could irritate the oesophagus and sting fairly fiercely - though having not tried orally inhaling MDMA, this is just a guess.
BigTrancer
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I don't want to sound paranoid, but just consider how much of what you're writing could help send you to Jail.

Fuck it - just bang it!
Tim

I think it would be a considered a fairly nasty chemical irritant, by your lungs. Poor little alveoli. Inhaling it, alot would get stuck on the way down. You can only absorb anything from the very bottom air passages and the alveoli. There is a huge amount of surface area before anything gets there, most of which is coated in mucous (that aerosols will stick to). I'm pretty danged sure that this method would cost you a lot of wastage. All the same.... it mostly depends on how willing the MDMA is to diffuse across your respiratory membrane. This membrane is designed to let gases diffuse across.
I think powder would cause some serious problems.
Ever inhaled when you're eating milo?
MDMA would dissolve in the surfactant (ummm basically water that lines the alveoli's respiratory membrane). Past that.... was last year study, so I'm unclear on it. It could make it through the fluid between the alveoli and the blood vessels, and it could make it into the blood vessels.
Not sure if it could get out of alveoli tho.... or how much would make it into alveoli in the first place.
Nasal spray would be swoit I imagine, same basis as snorting so long as you don't breathe too hard, but in a form that is a lot nicer for your mucous membrane in yer nose.
I think I'll stick to eating pills for now, until some practical experience is available.
[This message has been edited by entropope (edited 13 October 2000).]

As an alternative to asthma pumps there is an inhaler called a "turbohaler" (it can drag all the other inhalers at the lights )
Anyway, this inhaler works on a small amount of a very fine powder being distributed into the inhaler, this powder is then sucked down. I cannot find the inhaler at the moment, but I think it would be possible to open the chamber, and instead of anti-asmtha powder, put in MDMA or any other powder you may wish to inhale. As the amount of powder distributed each time is small, it may take a while to inhale a caps worth... But I may try it if I am feeling game

Have a small bit first, just incase the MDMA powder is a strong irritant...
*runs off to find his old turbohaler and await the results of Elliven's trial*

hehee
milo
*chuckle*

Yes the crazed primate has gone down this path and has something to report!
As some of you may know, i am also an asthmatic and have access to a wide range of inhalers, puffers, etc, etc! I was thinking about a new way to take the MDMA cap i had in my hand.......to see if I could get a faster/longer lasting/overall better experience any other way then swallowing!
So the crazy little primate put the cap into a turbohaler and inhaled the contents very slowly........granted....a bit got stuck in my throat but other than that I must say the results were........NUTS!
I had checked that the powder was chrushed up to oblivion.......so it wouldn't irritate me as much!
I did cheat a bit though and inhaled some long acting Ventolin powder (Foradile from memory) beforehand .........with the intention of relaxing my lungs and lessening the mucus.
The offical report is that I have found this VERY effective for both a quick rush AND giving a slightly longer lasting effect of the cap.