The Yankees are coming!!...and they're bringing Barbie with 'em!!

You know friends, I've been waiting for the American's to REALLY 'get' this scene we all love so much, for years.
You know what I mean: when a rave happens on '90210' or 'Sex in The City', we'll all have to start thinking about giving up parties, clubs and doof events for good!
But they've been so held back by their own lack of initiative and contentment in watching the UK scene create the whole thing instead, that it hasn't really happened over there: until now...
What measures do we have to gauge their progress in this field? Pop culture is a good one. Media another. How about both examples?
New US magazine just out here called 'Revolution' pushes the scene HARD to it's young US readership, through topics like MP3 and the Internet....quote "To put it bluntly, America is over the idea of England's dance music elite coming across the Atlantic to say how it is. In case the world hasn't noticed, America has its own scene and a lot of people are damn proud of it..."
Ummm, WE'LL be the judge of that!....
And the pop culture side? Leave Bluelight for just a minute and check out this website:
http://www.generationgirl.com/danceparty/index.asp
Yep, it's from Mattel and it's Barbie, getting a makeover as this generation's hard core dance heroine. But the figure you've really got to check out is DJ Blaine (same site)....Oh My God!... http://www.generationgirl.com/catalog/blainecat.asp
They're coming kids and they have their wallets and the minds of an entire generation of impressionable young things grasped between their pudgy paws.....stand clear!!
candyflip
The Peak!
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[This message has been edited by candyflip (edited 22 August 2000).]

ROFLMAO...Boikah...that is fucking hilarious!..scary too...

but but but
he's got his cell phone, sunglasses, AND a party pass! my god! a party pass!
he don't look like no hip hop fan i ever seen. hehehe
Why don't more doll manufacturing plants burn down?
H-C

if this is where it's heading I'm taking up lawn bowls
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"Never trust a man who, when left alone in a room with a tea cozy, doesn't try it on" - Billy Connolly

In all honesty, when do the egos finally start to dissapate?
Get over it, you didnt invent any techno or had anything to do with its inception...
When you have realised that...party!
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Reach for the stars!

The Americans 'get' this scene...they just do it in their own way.
The dancing and music is so different there because of the huge influence of American hip hop and r&b. The liquid dancing they talk so much about (which is fucking awesome when done well) has evolved from break dancing....you know the wave and caterpillar type flowing movements you see in breakdancing movies...it's a version of that. The music is cheesy cause that's what these kids are used to. They have grown up with cheesy commericals, tv shows, everything. None of them have been to Britain, nor have they been exposed to the music. They don't understand what we're talking about when we say their music is cheesy. To them, nothing is cheesy.
As for the commercialism....again that's what they're used to. You've no idea the commercialism over there. I am absolutely astounded how bad it is. But there's no other option. Out of 100 TV channels, 30 of them are sport, 20 of them are movies, 20 of them are pay per view, 20 of them are home shopping and infomercials. That leaves 10 channels with normal tv shows. The normal channels are so bombarded by ads it's incredible. So no one over there is surprised their scene is getting so commercialised.
I've also realised their need to group people into 'candy kids', 'junglists' etc. There are so many fucking people over here that people are desperate to feel a part of a community, to feel a part of something smaller than the whole. In Sydney, I feel part of the dance community without classifying how I dress, it's not that easy over there.
There are good things in the scene....some fucking amazing dancing, good music does exist (although you have to know where to find it)...all the money that is being thrown into the scene by it's commercialism is creating huge arse parties with the most amazing sound systems, venues and lighting. I've yet to go to Melbourne to compare, but I was impressed.
The worst part of the scene is not the cheesy music...it's the fucked up people. When they say e-tarded, they mean it. These people get fucked up to the point of being retarded. They can't talk, their eyes are rolling back in their head, they have no control over their mind or body. And it's not a small minority who are like that. At least half at most parties I've been to. It's disgusting and sad. Most of them don't care what's in their pills, as long as it gets them as fucked up as possible. (I haven't met bluelighters like this, just seen other people at parties). It's no wonder the police crack down on them.
As for the barbie thing (to keep this on topic with the thread) I'm not surprised. It's just a pity 10 year olds normally play with Barbies. 10 year olds aren't supposed to be interested in partying. Sad.
candyflip....just one thing....your comment of "Ummm, WE'LL be the judge of that!....". What did you mean? That you can judge whether America has it's own scene? That you're judging their scene on what you see on 90210? I do agree that their scene is not what ours is, and not as good as ours ( ) but who are we to judge them on what they do? Especially if we haven't been there to see it for ourselves. Especially if we haven't grown up there and understood why they are the way they are.
I could go on forever here but now is a good time to stop
miss apple

First up, great post apples! I respect a post that is even, without bias.
I've always thought of barbie as the perennial teeny-bopper, whatever barbie is into, is no doubt in the future to become what the little kiddies want to be into. I hope these little kiddies don't all think "hey, i can be a dj too!" there are way too many people wasting their time trying to be dj's, b-boys, rave bunnies, whatever. All about the image.
At my brother's school (he's in grade 10 now) every man and his "dawg" wants to be a b-boy. At lunchtime they honestly have breakdancing competitions and shit like that, i've seen em, some of them are awesome, and well done to them. But, most of the people who want to do it have no involvement with the music of that scene, or any idea of anything associated with b-boys other than Bomfunk Mc's on tv hits. It's just an example of how image (wow, breakdancers are cool) can totally override what the scene is about (music, people, culture), and its pretty sad that kids get into these things because of whats the flavour of the month on tv.
Next month it'll be raving, and all the little 14 and 15 year olds will be buying glowsticks, trying to buy E and getting totally etarded at those underage raves.
Oh well, image wins another battle over the teen psyche.
SD
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"I wouldn't recommend sex, drugs, and insanity for everyone, but they've always worked for me." - Hunter S. Thompson

I've been to America 3 times and have dated a native of their's (Portland, Oregon) for 6 months, so think I know a bit about 'em. As a matter of fact, I LOVE Americans (I'm sick, I know!). I love their culture, I grew up immersed in it. Most of what's shaped me is really 'theirs'. None of this is a slap at them as people.
It's a slap at commercialism of a 'scene'. It happens everytime, in every way and it's unstoppable. It's also as funny as hell...
And they'll think they're doing a great job getting into this Trance scene that they are now following, but they are years behind even we AUSSIES, so I think we can fairly judge how well they're doing (or not). We've had the masters teach us (the Brits)...I think we're qualified to know good music, or not...
and that's it...

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So you're saying just because we are further ahead than they are musically, that we have the right to say their scene is bad? I disagree. There are talented people in the American scene. There are people there who love it and devote their lives and money to it. I just think it's incredibly arrogant of us to say something like that. It is exactly the kind of arrogance that we hate to see from Amercians.

Oh please Apples, have a sense of humour!!...for god's sakes...if you don't think that Barbie thing is funny, I must give up hope!!
You're over there and so VERY protective of your hosts, I understand. But only the Americans can bastardise a culture (in this case, the rave/dance party one) as wholly and badly as they do. Case in point: Barbie.
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Talking about barbie, here's part of a small article I found on the back of Melb's THE AGE newspaper (today section) this morning (23 AUG) -
Meet Death Row Marv, the American action doll that sits fastened in an electric chair waiting for you to throw the switch. When you do, Marv convulses, his eyes dissolve into red sockets, and through is clenched teeth he snorts: "That the best you can do, you pansies?"
In America, they even like their corpses to have an attitude. Marv has proved so popular that, at $US29.95, he is being dragged out of toy shops so quickly that there are waiting lists....."
dont know about you guys but I'm scared to go to the US.

I agree with you Apples, but the problem is that when you look at the party scene here through eyes that have seen how it is in Europe or Australia, theres an awful lot ot poke fun at/be dismissive of. You just need to remember that most americans dont have that perspective, and then you cant really hold it against them.
There ARE good people here, who party like the best of them. There are also a lot of superficial gits/halfwits with their heads shoved up their asses. When you neet the former you have some faith, when you meet the latter, its enough to drive you running and screaming into sunday school instead of the afterparty.
I just had a fucking good sunday out with some good people. There was a good vibe going on, everyone was friendly, silly and getting it ON. So I feel happier about the party scene in the States than I ususally do.
Aussies/Brits/Canadians are so close in mentality, its not surprising we like to throw down in a similar fashion. America seperates itself, whether its intentional or not I dont know, and the roots of the rave scene here have combined with the usual commericalism, materialism and cliqueishness that exist in this country, and those arent exactly prime components for the basis of a scene that thrives on the fundamental principles of being yourself, sharing with others, and looking out for everyone, whether its in making sure theres a vibe for everyone, not just yourself, to preventing 15 yrs olds from being off their fucking tits.
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"The road of excess leads to the palace of wisdom"

Well said been queen and apples. Everybody has their own culture/scene and instead of worrying about what the americans are doing why not just chill out and think about our scene. I see Utopia and it gets more and more commercial everytime. I was watching the MTV channel the other month and they were screening an hours worth of footage from the Transmission 12 party.

I *do* think the Barbie thing is hilarious.
I still think your comment of whether we can judge whether their scene is good or bad is hypocritical and arrogant.
thanks BeanQueen...you understood where I was coming from.

I think alot of ppls are forgetting that the yanks created the hole wharehouse/rave thing as well as pioneering the music..
This all happened in the mid to to late 80's..Detroit techno, chicago House and New York thing... There was a huge underground scene cranking away in the states some time before Europe and ourselves got wind of it..
I think we o alot to the americans..They are the reason for what we have today..

umm i think the brits had a whole lot to do w/ the warehouse/rave thing, didnt they?
i know a lot of the music has its roots in the states, but you cant disregard the influence of europe on the rave scene.

Oh I understand where you are coming from. You're not listening though. With the utmost respect I venture that I personally know much more about the States (having lived them, worked with them and dated them over the last 10 years) than perhaps you do. Read this please: you are NOT the only one that now understands the Americans becuase you are over there.
I know exactly how commercial it is over there (that's MY point!). I know how desperately they need to fit a 'scene' or group. I know it's not '90210' over there (thank god!). You seem to think it is we (I?) who is living in the cultural vacuum!??! Anthropologically, this is all fascinating. But well off my point!
Your post is full of bias, a bias to protect your friends. Are you now so P.L.U.R. that you won't have an opinion Miss Apples?...is that what this new US-based girl has become? I'm disappointed if so (I always appreciated your balanced firey side). Are you so scared of upsetting the apple cart you're now enjoying the ride on?
What happened to the girl who said, in March this year, on the Pacifiers debate in the AUS forum:
"Oh my goodness if anyone from the US actually saw this....
candyflip I agree with you entirely. A little while ago there was a whole thread about whether 'binkie's' were stupid or not and there were so many people who stood up for sucking on something you used to when you were 2 years old it was ridiculous!!! I got flamed like you wouldn't believe cause I told them how absolutely stupid they all looked. They then kept crying 'freedom' and 'it's my right to suck on a binky' and all that 5th amendment stuff. Hey, if they want to look stupid, let them. I really couldn't care less!!
I feel a bit bad now....I feel like we're backstabbing them or something by writing something in this thread. I mean there's really nothing wrong with it if that's what they want to do. What I find funny though is that that scene from Human traffic was from 1991. It's 2000 people!!! America has just taken a while to catch onto the rave scene.
Disclaimer: If there are any American ravers reading this....I have nothing against you personally...we're just making observations on the differences in your culture.
miss apple"
That's funny, so am I!.. You seemed to have an opinion back then?....am I not allowed the same freedom?
If I want to judge something (in this case the Amercian rave scene) the fact that you are amongst them now is hardly going to stop me. You (and I) had an opinion on binkies too....are you going to back down from that stated opinion now as well?
You can call it whatever your like (arrogant, selfish, whatever...) but as your hosts might also state, it is my right to have an opinion on anything, and so I will (and do)...I may be right, or wrong. The forum is for stating that opinion, either way. If it upsets you, that's the nature of a debate. We'll have to live with that.
I'm interested in hearing your arguments against what I've said (as long as it doesn't include "you're being mean to the Americans and they don't know any better"), but I have over 50 years of bad pop culture generated by Americans backing me up here. I hope your argument is compelling?
hope you're having a kick-arse trip...
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Atomica - I have to disagree dude/dudette...
The brits just embraced the wharehouse/rave idea better than the yanks..The Americans were too caught up in the Rap/Gangsta Rap/R&B thing at that time..
But there was and still is a healthy underground scene in the States....
Commericalised rave scenes exist in every country...

Are you now so P.L.U.R. that you won't have an opinion Miss Apples?...is that what this new US-based girl has become?
Bwahahahahaha!!!! ME??? PLUR??? hahahah that's the funniest thing I've heard for a long time.
I'm not sticking up for my new found friends...the independent fiery apples of old is still around I have made friends here but (and not to upset them or anything) I haven't known them for very long....my heart is (and always will be) with my Australian friends and my home country.
candyflip, I have nothing against people expressing an opinion. We all have the right to do that. This is not about you expressing an opinion about the commersialism of the Amercian rave scene. On that I agree with you. It's about the one comment you made that I've already mentioned.
For a magazine to print "In case the world hasn't noticed, America has its own scene and a lot of people are damn proud of it..." and for you to say that 'you'll be the judge of that' is basically telling them they don't have a scene. Telling them they have nothing to be proud of. It's suggesting we're better than they are and they don't know what the hell they're talking about. That's more than just expressing an opinion.
I still think binkies look stupid. I still think the rave scene in America is way behind ours. I still stand by all my opinions on the American rave scene. In fact, after experiencing it first hand, my opinion of it is even worse. What has changed though is my exposure to people who love their scene just as much as we love ours. And exposure to some awesome dancing...and other good things about the scene I didn't previously know existed. For us to say they have nothing to be proud of is wrong.
If there's one thing I can't stand about Americans it's their arrogance that they are so much better than we are. Surely we can refrain from acting the same way.
apples
oh, and I'm not offended or upset...if anyone knows me they know I love a good debate...so bring it on

No, I just think you took it the wrong way.
I meant that having been through it all already, we should be more than a little qualified to have an opinion on whether their attempt is worthwhile. I am certainly not trying to DISCOURAGE the trying! But we still have the (dare I say it, cultural obligation??) to guide them through to good taste....is Rave Barbie in my example (or Electric Chair Harry, or whatever he's called from the above post ) an early example of that success??...I think not...
Anyway, you're there to show 'em the way Apples....I trust their fate is in good hands..

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