What to do when you're not included in group conversations?

[iridescentblack]

In High School, multiple times I was caught in the crossfire (sitting) between two people who literally talk back and forth without pauses almost as if they're the same person having a consistent monologue.

Then there was the proverbial rude person who shouts over my head, trying to get someone's attention in their "line of sight" with me in the middle.

I eventually developed a sort of second-hand skill to be able to know the difference between when someone is shouting at someone near me or behind me due to the scrutiny and shaming I used to receive.

Nowadays whenever I'm at a get-together I'm rarely included in any conversations. Mostly I'm just told to shut up or talked over if I ever do speak.

How do people assert themselves better in these situations? Do they just talk louder than the other person or is there more to it that I'm missing?

 

[G_Chem]

Do you really get told to shut up? That ain’t right..

In these situations it’s often more about some sort of social hierarchy than anything the people are doing. Unfortunately…

If people in the group are telling you to shut up (especially if it’s a partner) it instantly devalues you to others around you. Plus depending how it’s done it’s just plain embarrassing.

-GC

 

[Buzz Lightbeer]

Talking louder yourself is definitely not the way to go, but don't talk too quietly, just about on the same level as most people, somewhat louder maybe if the situation requires it (music, annoying LOUD talkers haha). If it's a personal convo between the two you're stuck between you're best off just moving for a minute and go talk to other people.
I often just ask what they're talking about and forcefully insert myself in the conversation lol. If things like this would still be a bother I'd just bring it up, but this probably depends on the group and situation if this is doable.

The main thing would be gaining confidence in these situations, such that you just "get good" at talking, no idea how to get it though. It kinda is indeed about social hierarchy, but witch closer friends it's more about having interesting things to say in a variety of possible conversations. One thing is that you shouldn't overthink things you said or you did, people don't remember minor things, don't overthink like you might do, and there's definitely not much weight added to some more stupid things you said/did.

If I got repeatedly told to shut up, I'd tell 'em to fuck off tbh. I think I have rarely witnessed a serious "shut up man", at most a "sorry man, I wanna hear what he was saying". It might be that you're doing some other things wrong though, like trying to "force" yourself in the wrong conversation at wrong moments (like talking about really serious and heavy stuff when they're just talking about random shit, or the other way around). In "difficult" groups I like to have a friend that I know really well and where we both know that we really like each other nearby, so if I'm bored or not really included in anything I can talk to him, that way you can move on together to conversations with more people. Not feeling comfortable for me kinda equates with not really liking the people I'm with though, so this is a question you might have to ask yourself.

As for specific tips, I don't know, these can be kind of intense situations, but some beers help to smooth things over. Sometimes I remove myself to get a beer, bring some drinks for people who want something and when getting back I'll have thought of a couple interesting things that can spark nice conversations at dead moments.

All in all, just about making good friends. When you're not one of the people directing conversations, it's about feeling what is right and when. To me this comes natural, but I have a couple of friends I see struggling with this from time to time. As a good friend you try to make 'em comfortable and actively ask something if someone is left out, then things come more natural.

So yeah, come up with interesting things, maybe go talk to someone that is also fairly quiet, bring up your concerns with someone if this would be doable. Going outside with some people to smoke is also good, breath of fresh air, smaller group with different dynamics. People love to fucking talk so if someone is telling a story or something, laugh at some joke or story, affirm his/her feelings, share something in a similar vein yourself. That way you develop connections with some people that are not the dickheads ignoring people or telling them to shut up constantly. You might be close to these things and it's just a couple hoops to go through. But above all, be yourself, otherwise people see through that, even if it's subconsciously.

Don't know if this helps, I have too much energy. Good luck

 

[Nurse Ratched]

Do you really get told to shut up? That ain’t right..

In these situations it’s often more about some sort of social hierarchy than anything the people are doing. Unfortunately…

If people in the group are telling you to shut up (especially if it’s a partner) it instantly devalues you to others around you. Plus depending how it’s done it’s just plain embarrassing.

-GC

No shit, man. That's an awful put down.

 

[Nurse Ratched]

Talking louder yourself is definitely not the way to go, but don't talk too quietly, just about on the same level as most people, somewhat louder maybe if the situation requires it (music, annoying LOUD talkers haha). If it's a personal convo between the two you're stuck between you're best off just moving for a minute and go talk to other people.
I often just ask what they're talking about and forcefully insert myself in the conversation lol. If things like this would still be a bother I'd just bring it up, but this probably depends on the group and situation if this is doable.

The main thing would be gaining confidence in these situations, such that you just "get good" at talking, no idea how to get it though. It kinda is indeed about social hierarchy, but witch closer friends it's more about having interesting things to say in a variety of possible conversations. One thing is that you shouldn't overthink things you said or you did, people don't remember minor things, don't overthink like you might do, and there's definitely not much weight added to some more stupid things you said/did.

If I got repeatedly told to shut up, I'd tell 'em to fuck off tbh. I think I have rarely witnessed a serious "shut up man", at most a "sorry man, I wanna hear what he was saying". It might be that you're doing some other things wrong though, like trying to "force" yourself in the wrong conversation at wrong moments (like talking about really serious and heavy stuff when they're just talking about random shit, or the other way around). In "difficult" groups I like to have a friend that I know really well and where we both know that we really like each other nearby, so if I'm bored or not really included in anything I can talk to him, that way you can move on together to conversations with more people. Not feeling comfortable for me kinda equates with not really liking the people I'm with though, so this is a question you might have to ask yourself.

As for specific tips, I don't know, these can be kind of intense situations, but some beers help to smooth things over. Sometimes I remove myself to get a beer, bring some drinks for people who want something and when getting back I'll have thought of a couple interesting things that can spark nice conversations at dead moments.

All in all, just about making good friends. When you're not one of the people directing conversations, it's about feeling what is right and when. To me this comes natural, but I have a couple of friends I see struggling with this from time to time. As a good friend you try to make 'em comfortable and actively ask something if someone is left out, then things come more natural.

So yeah, come up with interesting things, maybe go talk to someone that is also fairly quiet, bring up your concerns with someone if this would be doable. Going outside with some people to smoke is also good, breath of fresh air, smaller group with different dynamics. People love to fucking talk so if someone is telling a story or something, laugh at some joke or story, affirm his/her feelings, share something in a similar vein yourself. That way you develop connections with some people that are not the dickheads ignoring people or telling them to shut up constantly. You might be close to these things and it's just a couple hoops to go through. But above all, be yourself, otherwise people see through that, even if it's subconsciously.

Don't know if this helps, I have too much energy. Good luck

Nice post

 

[iridescentblack]

It kinda is indeed about social hierarchy, but witch closer friends it's more about having interesting things to say in a variety of possible conversations.

I was afraid of that.

Reading over your post made me realize, I probably shouldn't be hanging out with any of those guys at all.
They've strictly gone out of their way to make sure that I wasn't invited to any of their weddings, birthdays, baby showers, kids birthdays. All that stuff. I mean, some of those guys (which I've altogether stopped calling my friends) will talk about their kids with me when I see them, but I've never even seen their kids.

My brother frequently albeit randomly says at times "C and all those guys really like you. They think you're awesome", but the fact they don't include me in anything could really just mean they're just saying that.

Anyway, I'll hopefully be moving to a new area soon and forget about the two-facedness. Thanks for letting me rant.

 

[Buzz Lightbeer]

Agreed over the board, I'm guessing you don't have a plus one, aren't married and don't have kids so that might be part of them not really including you, moreso than a straight personality issue. Maybe, I have no reference points to get in the mind of.

A good rule of thumb is, in my opinion, if there is a very apparent social hierarchy it's best to just stay away. Who's got time for these highschool level games when you can be doing more interesting things.

 

[iridescentblack]

Thanks for the tips everyone. I've rekindled some of my relationships, especially with family, realized my mom doesn't talk over me *because* she's trying to cut me off and upstage me, but rather because she's used to speaking over people who have something less important to say. JK. She talks in a manner where she listens at the same time, which is something I need to learn... btw.

Anyway, things here in the forum have made me reconsider the effects of what is going on psychologically and sociologically... within a reasonable band of the inner and outer struggles spectrums.

So thanks guys. Keep truckin'

 

[MyrandaK]

I have nothing neogative to say about anyone. Good morning and praying you have and feel great and have a great day!

 

[axe battler]

Yeah OP I can only echo what everyone else hase said. Glad you've realised that these people don't appear to be real friends and that you're moving on. You seem like a decent and thoughtful person, I'm sure you won't have any problems making friends in the new area you live in.