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VIN # Debacle.

~kira~

~kira~

Bluelighter
Joined
Mar 27, 2017
Messages
162
Alright guys so long story kinda short, I have a 2005 dodge neon srt4 I bought a few years ago. We will call this CAR A. Over the years, this car has gotten some bad rust, to where the floorboards are rotted through. It's a decent parts car. Has an engine, and all of the body panels.

I recently bought CAR B. Which is a salvage certificate (PA) I didn't realize that the title wasn't signed over when I bought it, and the guy whose name is on the title isn't even the guy I bought the car from. I did find the title owner and got ahold of him. It's not stolen by the way! The guy said he had the title in his name but never had it registered, and then sold it.

I was wondering if for some reason we have issues getting the title transferred to me, what exactly could I do?

A part of me was thinking about vin swapping both of my cars. The rusted car A, and car B. Car A would then get chopped up and scrapped. I read that this is illegal. However, if I use all of the door panels and everything else on the rusted car, and put them on car B, is that still illegal? Would it be considered a rebody? Idk what to do. I figured maybe it was a loophole since I own both vehicles and none are stolen or impounded or anything.

Also out of curiosity, what makes vin swapping illegal (in this case both cars are the same make, model and submodel. Just one is an 04 and the other an 05.) Also, how would one find out if someone swapped vins and what would happen if someone found that out?
 
which state are you in?

will the previous owner, with the title, sign it over to you?

alasdair
 
alasdairm said:
which state are you in?

will the previous owner, with the title, sign it over to you?

alasdair
Click to expand...
We are both in PA. And he just signed it today. But the notary place is saying I need a bill of sale and a buy back form (which I should not need that 2nd one) the owner that has it in his name bought it like that, as a salvaged car.
 
a bill of sale is just a receipt/pro forma invoice. you can find a template to use on the web.

fill it out and both sign it.

i can't find a solid reference but i'm pretty sure swapping vin numbers is illegal in pa.

alasdair
 
alasdairm said:
a bill of sale is just a receipt/pro forma invoice. you can find a template to use on the web.

fill it out and both sign it.

i can't find a solid reference but i'm pretty sure swapping vin numbers is illegal in pa.

alasdair
Click to expand...
Now could we write one up ourselves?

And I'm not sure. I haven't found anything on it. I don't understand why it would be illegal if you own both cars in question and they are virtually the same. Weird laws we have.
 
~kira~ said:
Alright guys so long story kinda short, I have a 2005 dodge neon srt4 I bought a few years ago. We will call this CAR A. Over the years, this car has gotten some bad rust, to where the floorboards are rotted through. It's a decent parts car. Has an engine, and all of the body panels.

I recently bought CAR B. Which is a salvage certificate (PA) I didn't realize that the title wasn't signed over when I bought it, and the guy whose name is on the title isn't even the guy I bought the car from. I did find the title owner and got ahold of him. It's not stolen by the way! The guy said he had the title in his name but never had it registered, and then sold it.

I was wondering if for some reason we have issues getting the title transferred to me, what exactly could I do?

A part of me was thinking about vin swapping both of my cars. The rusted car A, and car B. Car A would then get chopped up and scrapped. I read that this is illegal. However, if I use all of the door panels and everything else on the rusted car, and put them on car B, is that still illegal? Would it be considered a rebody? Idk what to do. I figured maybe it was a loophole since I own both vehicles and none are stolen or impounded or anything.

Also out of curiosity, what makes vin swapping illegal (in this case both cars are the same make, model and submodel. Just one is an 04 and the other an 05.) Also, how would one find out if someone swapped vins and what would happen if someone found that out?
Click to expand...
10th character in VIN is year of the car iirc. be easy to get caught in the event you ever have an insurance claim.
 
I'm not in the US so not familiar with the laws obviously.

But I'm not seeing the benefit of doing this.

Where I'm at: the VIN # is linked to the licence plate number and registration papers. And I can tell you that an overzealous and thorough law enforcement officer will demand an explanation if there's any anomalies like this found at a traffic stop. Do you really want to drive around with the hassle of never being sure what's going to happen if you're stopped in a traffic stop?

Also worth bearing in mind: every part or major component in a motor vehicle is tied to the VIN # at the manufacturer. So if you ever decide to sell this car and the new owner just happens to look up the VIN # for whatever reason (maybe even if it gets sent to a dealership for a service they then look it up) then once again there's going to have to be some explaining done. And you never know who is going buy into the truth of what happened or if they're going to assume that something is up and take it further.

Worse still: while the vehicle may not be worth much what happens if you plow into another very expensive vehicle? Insurance companies don't need any incentive to not pay out. And if this is a loophole THEY can use to not have to pay out on a claim: they'll use it for damn sure and you could spend the next few decades making restitution to somebody, in your personal capacity, for their damages or worse still their medical bills.
 
~kira~ said:
Now could we write one up ourselves?

And I'm not sure. I haven't found anything on it. I don't understand why it would be illegal if you own both cars in question and they are virtually the same. Weird laws we have.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure you can write a bill of sale yourself. As long as it contains all the info a bill of sale is supposed to contain. Go to Google Images and type in "auto bill of sale PA". You will have more than enough results to work with. Just download one of the pdf's and fill it out with the previous owner and both of you sign it. Easy peezy.

Like other people already mentioned, swapping VINs is not worth the trouble. The VINs are located on more body parts than you likely have access to, so unless you're a mechanic I wouldn't mess with it. The VINs are not just on the windshield but also on the engine block and frame and shit like that.

I would just go to Google Images, download/print a template, and get it signed by previous owner.
 
exactly. a google search will give you loads of results including plenty of blank templates you can just download and fill out.

alasdair
 
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