Victims of ecstasy, ketamine get a voice

[schnabeltier]

i´ve done ketamin for some weeks, about 1g a day i.M, never had problems with my breathin, at least i didnt recognized it dude ^^

 

[frizzantik]

I'm sure more people are killed by fishing accidents each year in the United States than from ecstasy and ketamine combined.

well there were 700 boating related deaths in 2005..

http://www.commanderbob.com/cbstats.html

Pearce is trying to show kids and parents that there is a risk.

unfortunately they do nothing to put the risk in context. In addition, anecdotal evidence of the worst effects is not going to have a major impact on people who have already used and did not experience those effects.

here's an archived article on Erin Rose: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=138472

 

[E-llusion]

This thread is 4 years old

 

[frizzantik]

lol

 

[silentscience]

wtf?

 

[Black]

The last time I was familiar with the research literature, it was the question of whether any receptor changes due to MDMA use were long-term/permanent - or of a temporary nature - that was still up in the air. As I understand it, the long-term work on meth is clear - there is some degree of permanent change. With MDMA, there was conflicting evidence of the longer term stuff. . . but that may have changed in the last few years and if that's the case, I stand corrected.

as far as i know due to more recent research all signs are pointing towards no long term neurotoxicity even in heavy mdma users. as far as 'receptor changes' go receptors are generally modified during regulation of signal transduction. it is a normal process in nearly every signal transduction pathway. there can't really be permament receptor changes as receptors are permamently internalized, degraded and new ones built.
saying mdma leads to receptor changes is like saying 'LSD changes gene expression', which i have heard multiple times. listening to music changes gene expression. as signals travel to neurons receptors are activated and consequentially modified and downstream processes change gene expression.

also the neurotoxicity of mdma in apes was found at 70mg/kg. SEVENTY MILLIGRAM PER KILOGRAM! thats for your average male like taking (or maybe even injecting) 60 good pills at once. i would be quite amazed if such a dose did not cause some kind of damage…

enough ranting for now

 

[tobala]

I'm quite sure there are thousands of FDA-approved pharmaceuticals that are neurotoxic at plasma concentrations far lower than these "dangerous party drugs."

The point being that "neurotoxicity" is often more a political issue than a medical one. Case in point: ibogaine.

 

[Junglistvibe]

Ketamine is not biologically addictive.

What does that mean? Anything that is fun can be habit forming and therefore addicting. And ketamine is probably the most fun drug I've ever tried

 

[phr]

^
I think he means it doesn't cause dependence. I don't know shit about ketamine, so I don't know if that's true or not.

 

[Crankinit]

I'm a victim of ecstasy. I took this funny colored pill at a party one night, now I can't stop dancing to loud repetative music. Help me!

 

[tobala]

^^^^ Hang in there! Ciba is working on a pill for that. However, it may be neurotoxic to the neurons that control lower body coordination, so you may end up as the evening's entertainment for your friends when you hit the clubs...

 

[Joey]

She sounds the alarm that “kids are dying” from drugs. Ok so at what age is someone too old to be a victim anymore? 18? 20? 21?

Depends how you define youth. In Canada, Statistics Canada the organization defines the youth demographic as being 18-34. Therefore, you can either say its anyone under 18, or anyone under 35 as being the victims here. As soon as you turn 35 though, you obviously have been asking for it.. and are probably actually a predator going after those poor under 35 children.

I hate 35 years olds; and 36 DAMN. Anything above that I cant even speak of! Imsa shakingz as i typsethis holysgodd

 

[the_void]

Depends how you define youth. In Canada, Statistics Canada the organization defines the youth demographic as being 18-34. Therefore, you can either say its anyone under 18, or anyone under 35 as being the victims here. As soon as you turn 35 though, you obviously have been asking for it.. and are probably actually a predator going after those poor under 35 children.

I hate 35 years olds; and 36 DAMN. Anything above that I cant even speak of! Imsa shakingz as i typsethis holysgodd

No I mean by this woman’s standards of “drugs killing kids.” 35 would definitely be too old . Maybe even 21. All her “victims” were teenagers at the time.

 

[Joey]

No I mean by this woman’s standards of “drugs killing kids.” 35 would definitely be too old . Maybe even 21. All her “victims” were teenagers at the time.

I know. Im just shitposting. Sorry. Its just kind of a silly subject to me when theres all these Nancy Reagan DARE fucks around making it all so black and white. Anyone can be a victim any age, and sometimes that includes the dealers who are actually being given a runaround they werent expecting when theyre now being threatened with dismemberment or death if they screw up by their “superiors”.

 

[the_void]

I know. Im just shitposting. Sorry. Its just kind of a silly subject to me when theres all these Nancy Reagan DARE fucks around making it all so black and white. Anyone can be a victim any age, and sometimes that includes the dealers who are actually being given a runaround they werent expecting when theyre now being threatened with dismemberment or death if they screw up by their “superiors”.

Yeah. It’s just entirely subjective who is

a) “experimenting with drugs “ (victim) - when I first went to rehab at 25 for using drugs twice a week for 5 years and then meth bong rips with torch lighter (blue flame ) for 5 months all day every day , a 40 year old veteran hardcore stimulant addict called this “experimental”

B. A “kid” (victim) . many grandparents list under 40 as a “kid “

C. Drug dealer. (Victimizer) Just about Everyone with a serious history with drugs has picked up drugs, then split the drugs/cost and got high with a friend. By law this is a “drug dealer”

 

[Joey]

Yeah. It’s just entirely subjective who is

a) “experimenting with drugs “ (victim) - when I first went to rehab at 25 for using drugs twice a week for 5 years and then smoking daily meth for 5 months , a 40 year old veteran crack addict called this “experimental”

B. “kid” (victim) . Well many grandparents list under 40 as a kid

C. Drug dealer. Just about Everyone with a serious history with drugs has picked up drugs, then split the drugs/cost and got high with a friend. By law this is a “drug dealer”

I personally believe anyone 25 and under is definable as a “kid” because the brain is still developing until 25 years old. Thats on average too, it can actually continue until as late as the early 30s for some people. I know for me there was a shift in mental acuity and maturity around my mid-late 20s. Im three months shy of 30 now.

anything under 40 is young still.

The whole victim mentality though. I dont totally buy it. Regardless of physical brain development by 25-30whatever and still being young by your grandparents standard til your 40s or whatever, taking these drugs is most often a choice.

Being an addict and having terrible things happen to you to be victimized is not, but continuing to engage in behaviours which are leading to these victim situations is a choice.

Once you’re at the point that youve realized all this, and keep doing the drugs anyway the victim card doesn’t hold as much weight then. It’s kind of a terrible truth, but it is truth is that often even in a situation where there is a victim, in any respect, the victim does hold some responsibility to the situation as well as the perpetrator. Not always, or even often, but sometimes for sure. Im speaking to more than just addictions and dealing and all that shit now.

My mom stayed in abusive relationship for 20 years with man and already had a years long history of staying with abusive men prior to this. I 100% hold her fucking responsible for this because she both could have and DID eventually escape these men. Why the fuck didnt she do this earlier? I dont know, but now as well ad being a victim for way, way longer than she ever needed to be.. BOTH of her children have suffered so now both me and my younger sister are also victims to HER not taking responsibility to HER side of the abuser/victim dynamic. We were both abused by these men as well, and terrified watching this go on for years and years as well.

Sometimes the victim is also the perpetrator.

 

[the_void]

I personally believe anyone 25 and under is definable as a “kid” because the brain is still developing until 25 years old. Thats on average too, it can actually continue until as late as the early 30s for some people. I know for me there was a shift in mental acuity and maturity around my mid-late 20s. Im three months shy of 30 now.

anything under 40 is young still.

The whole victim mentality though. I dont totally buy it. Regardless of physical brain development by 25-30whatever and still being young by your grandparents standard til your 40s or whatever, taking these drugs is most often a choice.

Being an addict and having terrible things happen to you to be victimized is not, but continuing to engage in behaviours which are leading to these victim situations is a choice.

Once you’re at the point that youve realized all this, and keep doing the drugs anyway the victim card doesn’t hold as much weight then. It’s kind of a terrible truth, but it is truth is that often even in a situation where there is a victim, in any respect, the victim does hold some responsibility to the situation as well as the perpetrator. Not always, or even often, but sometimes for sure. Im speaking to more than just addictions and dealing and all that shit now.

My mom stayed in abusive relationship for 20 years with man and already had a years long history of staying with abusive men prior to this. I 100% hold her fucking responsible for this because she both could have and DID eventually escape these men. Why the fuck didnt she do this earlier? I dont know, but now as well ad being a victim for way, way longer than she ever needed to be.. BOTH of her children have suffered so now both me and my younger sister are also victims to HER not taking responsibility to HER side of the abuser/victim dynamic. We were both abused by these men as well, and terrified watching this go on for years and years as well.

Sometimes the victim is also the perpetrator.

Yeah it’s not as black and white as she makes it out to be.

Kid - victim , old druggie - who gives a fuck
Experimenter - victim , addict - who gives a fuck
Drug user - victim, drug dealer - victimizer

There is so much gray between those that naive people like this woman don’t see.

Anyway. i define “kid” as under 25ish as well

I'm doing some more research on the ketamine od. A Google search on Erin rose ketamine turned up this :

User of 'Party' Drug Is Left a Shell of Self

Health: Erin Rose, 18, suffered brain damage after taking the anesthetic ketamine. Experts are alarmed by its growing popularity.

www.google.ca

It quotes dr siegel. WTF. I know well who dr Siegel is - he's not anti drug evangelism at all -he's the author of 'intoxication the 4th Drive" that argues that getting intoxicated is actually the 4th drive.

He was until his death one of the most progressive people on the planet

In the book, he looks at different things that have been used medically, including crack cocaine aka Esterene

 

[Skorpio]

Ima make a documentary about ketamine and ecstacy being a victim of my nose. I'll interview the bag and ittl be like no no please don't snort me, its a tragedy that needs to be exposed.