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The Truth About Pavlov's Dogs Is Pretty Disturbing

Kinda unrelated but my old clinic had more vietnam vets than you could count. It was very interesting to hear them talk about their experiences. They said these women called "mama san" would come up to the fences of the base with vials of pure heroin and say "G.I..... G.I.... got #1 cocaine." One of them told me he found a guy dead with a needle in his arm and the sargent told him to take the guy out by the edge of the jungle and and shoot him. They didn't want the soldier to go home disgraced and they also wanted to cover up the extent of the problem.
 
^ so you're saying that plenty of Vietnam vets came home still needing support from the habits they picked up over there?
"Clinic" meaning methadone clinic?
 
^^ And now we're already experiencing an influx of Iraq and Afghanistan vets who have come home with some severe PTSD.

I recall watching a vet trying to have a debate with Bill O'Reilly about it. It utterly shocked me when this 9-year veteran claimed that 80% of the soldiers come home with mental issues (usually PTSD). I believe him, but, Bill didn't seem too keen (no surprise there - he lives on Bullshit Mountain).

Who knows what they've witnessed over there, but I sure as hell understand why they'd resort to mind-altering substances in order to regain some normality - even if only temporary. These things are THAT bad. Pity that words cannot properly describe the horror these men and women end up having to live with every day after coming home. And then to have your government judge you for self-medicating - it's like adding grave insult to injury.
 
Indeed.
To me it beggars belief that soldiers could get addicted to smack in a (highly traumatic) war zone and come home and get clean with -apparently - few problems staying clean, but I've read similar things.

I imagine there may be more to the story, or it is part of some wider narrative.
First casualty of war, and all that.
 
If readjustment difficulty was minimal and the veterans still had families to go back to it is very probable. It doesn't have to apply to all cases. Those who came to a new hell wouldn't be in this category. PTSD sufferers would out as well. Situational tolerance is real whether you believe it or not.

It boils down to marginalized people being more likely to be stuck in a never-ending cycle while those whose lives turn around due to some outside factor having far less difficulty halting their addictions.
 
Yeah I was talking about the methadone clinic Spacejunk but I cannot comment on the percentage of soldiers who got clean or kept using. I can only report my second hand anecdotes.

Now that we are on the subject of the Iraq war I have another one. I had a buddy stationed in Afghanistan and he said they would sell heroin for dirt cheap out of small bazaars by the base. He said that quite a few soldiers were frequent users. He even said that you would see army issued equipment for sale in these bazaars because soldiers had traded them in for heroin. He told me stories of being smacked up and walking through fields of poppies that they were destroying. It is almost a bit ironic.

Another guy I met in jail said that there was even cocaine over there and that he would get coked up before they went out on a mission because it gave him confidence so he wouldn't hesitate to kick down a door and unload his weapon but I am getting a bit off topic here so I won't comment again. I just found these stories interesting and I thought you guys might as well.
 
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One key difference is the rats were administered the drug and didn't know it was coming .. drug users administer their own drugs and the mind is well aware its coming.

A new place could indicate a greater likelihood of a different supply of the drug and thus different strength.

it also indicates a break from the ritual pattern drug users tend to follow which could also have included a larger dose.

I know that when I relapsed I would also often adopt whole new routine so new places may be common for people more prone to od.

A new spot may also mean they were farther away from help and less likely to be found and given aid.

Since a new place is often more stressful a person may feel uncomfortable, rushed, anxious and more dosing mistakes could be made.

It could also indicate they are sick and desperate which may cause people to go a little bigger.
 
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^^These are all excellent points and absolutely true. I have seen these instances again and again with my fellow addicts especially when they are desperate and breaking routine.
 
neversickanymore said:
One key difference is the rats were administered the drug and didn't know it was coming .. drug users administer their own drugs and the mind is well aware its coming.

A new place could indicate a greater likelihood of a different supply of the drug and thus different strength.

it also indicates a break from the ritual pattern drug users tend to follow which could also have included a larger dose.

I know that when I relapsed I would also often adopt whole new routine so new places may be common for people more prone to od.

A new spot may also mean they were farther away from help and less likely to be found and given aid.

Since a new place is often more stressful a person may feel uncomfortable, rushed, anxious and more dosing mistakes could be made.

It could also indicate they are sick and desperate which may cause people to go a little bigger.
Click to expand...


These are all really good and relevant points.
 
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