Alcohol The Benefits of Alcohol?

[kleinerkiffer]

it's not that toxic, oding from it is quite hard so getting addicted, and even with addiction most problems caused are reversible

It's toxic for your whole body, particularly for your liver and brain.
ODing isn't that hard and can kill you, either through respiratory depression or asphyxiation on your own vomit
And have you ever seen an alcoholic? Liver cirrhosis, Korsakoff syndrome, withdrawal can kill you, delirium tremens etc.

 

[white55]

I've heard that some schools hold secret parties with lots of alcohol and prostitutes for possible future athletes, so that they'd choose to go to play for their Uni. http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...d-scandal-of-us-college-football-2351406.html

Maybe some universities are more relaxed on alcohol, so that more kids would want to study there = more tuition money for the school. There are "party schools." I doubt universities would care about some government/business agenda.

It depends on what your definition of education is. Some say that modern colleges just spew out useless degrees, like: women's studies, black people's studies, Asian studies, Muslim Psychology, basket weaving, English degrees, racist studies, art degrees, Star Wars alien language studies, etc. Every one of the degrees listed is practically useless when applying for a job, unless it's Starbucks or McDonald's. I suppose they are just ways for kids to BS an easy degree on their parents money, while partying and drinking on all the free time they have, from not needing to study for anything useful. Of course colleges don't care, since they are being payed for these degrees.

@white55 Where did you mean by "here"? I don't think that's in the United States, if the drinking age is 18..

Europe mate. Eastern Europe drinking is like a national sport here.

It's toxic for your whole body, particularly for your liver and brain.
ODing isn't that hard and can kill you, either through respiratory depression or asphyxiation on your own vomit
And have you ever seen an alcoholic? Liver cirrhosis, Korsakoff syndrome, withdrawal can kill you, delirium tremens etc.

I didn't say it's 100% safe but compared to other drugs most of the toxicity requires prolonged high dose use or huge ODs.

And again while you can od on it surprisingly little people do... a park here is full of teens (high school) or people in their early 20s (early college) downing 1+ bottle of vodka each Friday night and most of them return home drunk but far from oded (there's maybe an ambulance called 1 or twice per month)

Most of them either stop drinking nearly as much/often by ~25 yo and never develop true addiction. So yes while some people will get the problems long term addiction causes (and even then they are relatively reversible if caught early.... for example cirrhosis starts as fatty liver disease which is fully reversible and mild cirrhosis while not fully reversible still improves upon cessation of drinking up to the point that it doesn't cause much issues for the person who has it. Korsakoff syndrome again takes a lot of abuse to develop and if caught early is treatable to a certain degree. And drowning in your own vomit is possible but again rare, most people here know that people who have drunk so much should be put in the correct position for unconscious ppl at risk of vomiting, an ambulance will arrive soon (under 5 min) which is not enough time for you to drown in your own vomit.

Tbh most of the bad effects of alcohol I've seen irl aren't directly from it but from the stupid shit it makes some ppl do (everything from driving, getting in to pointless fights, ....)...

So while not the safest drug around it's still relatively safeish especially since it is so common that everyone knows what to do if someone ods and since most people just don't drink enough for a long enough time for the long term effects to develop. At least not here. Other countries might be different.

 

[kleinerkiffer]

I didn't say it's 100% safe but compared to other drugs most of the toxicity requires prolonged high dose use or huge ODs.

Compared to what drugs ?


https://www.niaaa.nih.gov/alcohol-health/overview-alcohol-consumption/alcohol-facts-and-statistics

In 2012, 3.3 million deaths, or 5.9 percent of all global deaths (7.6 percent for men and 4.0 percent for women), were attributable to alcohol consumption.

In 2013, of the 72,559 liver disease deaths among individuals aged 12 and older, 45.8 percent involved alcohol. Among males, 48.5 percent of the 46,568 liver disease deaths involved alcohol. Among females, 41.8 percent of the 25,991 liver disease deaths involved alcohol.
Among all cirrhosis deaths in 2013, 47.9 percent were alcohol related. The proportion of alcohol-related cirrhosis was highest (76.5 percent) among decedents ages 25–34, followed by decedents aged 35–44, at 70.0 percent.

 

[noone1]

You're dealing with a website full of people who can't control themselves. Yes "moderate" alcohol is good for you but what is "moderate" ? it would differ for everyone but if we are talking about medicinal doses from what I've heard then one shot or one very low alcohol beer or a quarter of a glass of wine if you are talking about every day use... any more and the side effects come into play. I've read many stories of people that live into their 100's who will drink and smoke daily but will literally only have ONE standard drink and one cig and almost never, ever indulge... that is very difficult to do.

 

[Eisbaer]

Compared to what drugs ?

https://www.niaaa.nih.gov/alcohol-health/overview-alcohol-consumption/alcohol-facts-and-statistics

You can compare it with etizolam. If the same amount of people used etizolam, as alcohol, then people would be having seizures, addictions and dying left and right.

You should also compare a drug using the same pool of people. You can't compare 100 people dying from alcohol, if 6 billion people drink alcohol, as opposed to 100 people out of 500 dying from etizolam. I made these numbers up, but it's an example.

It also would be incorrect to use different age groups too. If 43 people die from alcohol overdose, and are all above 50, then there surely would be age related reasons why those people died, and alcohol would not be the only factor.

White55 was right, most people don't drink that much/for long enough to become addicted to alcohol. You can far quicker become addicted to benzos, opiates, or heroin. And most people know what to do when they become drunk, so it wont be like a RC overdose, where the doctors wont know what to do when someone is unconscious.

@white55 which part of Eastern Europe? Eastern Europe is huge. My guess is either Russia or Belarus?

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

You're dealing with a website full of people who can't control themselves. Yes "moderate" alcohol is good for you but what is "moderate" ? it would differ for everyone but if we are talking about medicinal doses from what I've heard then one shot or one very low alcohol beer or a quarter of a glass of wine if you are talking about every day use... any more and the side effects come into play. I've read many stories of people that live into their 100's who will drink and smoke daily but will literally only have ONE standard drink and one cig and almost never, ever indulge... that is very difficult to do.

All of what is posted here. Alcohol gets you drunk, and a lot of people including me have trouble drinking in moderation sometimes when we start drinking. Drinking in moderation consists of only 1-2 pints of beer, glasses of wine, or shots.

You can get the same benefits from red wine from drinking grape juice, or eating grapes. Some people take the revistoral supplements.

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/alcohol-full-story/

 

[Slow_Mobius]

You can compare it with etizolam. If the same amount of people used etizolam, as alcohol, then people would be having seizures, addictions and dying left and right.

You should also compare a drug using the same pool of people. You can't compare 100 people dying from alcohol, if 6 billion people drink alcohol, as opposed to 100 people out of 500 dying from etizolam. I made these numbers up, but it's an example.

It also would be incorrect to use different age groups too. If 43 people die from alcohol overdose, and are all above 50, then there surely would be age related reasons why those people died, and alcohol would not be the only factor.

White55 was right, most people don't drink that much/for long enough to become addicted to alcohol. You can far quicker become addicted to benzos, opiates, or heroin. And most people know what to do when they become drunk, so it wont be like a RC overdose, where the doctors wont know what to do when someone is unconscious.

@white55 which part of Eastern Europe? Eastern Europe is huge. My guess is either Russia or Belarus?

We're not trying to compare it to any drugs in particular. I think the take home message is that alcohol isn't to be underestimated, and it's increased availability/legality makes people think it's not even a real drug. Saying "let's go do drugs" carries a very different connotation from saying "let's go drinking". I think that's partly way this site generally has very negative view of alcohol. A large portion of society thinks alcohol carries significantly fewer risks than scheduled drugs, but that simply isnt true. It's legal because it's a significant part of Western culture.

 

[burn out]

You said that alcohol and football are used by universities to dull students' minds and make them docile slaves to corporations and to brainwash them. That is ridiculous

If by ridiculous you mean obvious I agree.

 

[burn out]

Orwell was against totalitarianism. To suggest anything in his writing was against education is taking him out of context. Drugs and entertainment can be used by those in power to control the masses, but to suggest that universities have this hidden agenda with corporations to brainwash their students is 100% conspiracy nonsense.

I might leave it at that since this is straying off topic. Short answer: Universities are not using alcohol to help brainwash students so that they will become docile slaves for corporations.

How is it nonsense? The entire educational system is one long brain washing process where they teach us what to think and prepare us to fit into the workforce (ei corporate slavery).

This should be obvious just by considering how little time they spend teaching us life lessons, like how to be empowered human beings, how to question authority and think for ourselves, how to keep ourselves healthy and strong (instead look what is available in most school cafeterias), how to get along with others, philosophy,art, religion, spirituality, practical matters. Very little time is devoted to these while instead the focus is on turning us into left brain dominated corporate slaves who all share the same dumbed down mindset with no ability to think for ourselves. i don't know what school you went to but where i went the vast majority of what was taught had very little value in helping me succeed in life while nearly all my important life lessons had to be learned on my own.

i am not saying this is all done consciously. its not like every professor is turning around and laughing an evil laugh as soon as the kids leave the classroom. i am saying this is how society runs, a largely unconscious machine that gravitates toward the lowest common denominator. and of course there are always people ready to capitalize on this in order to gain $, power and influence and universities are just one of the insitutions which are instrumental in keeping the current system going. they reap enormous financial benefits from promoting college sports and turning their students into beer guzzling sports fans who return and buy tickets decades after graduation. don't you see what an ingenious scheme it is from a business standpoint? it's all free advertising.

 

[hotgirls.jpg.exe]

We're not trying to compare it to any drugs in particular. I think the take home message is that alcohol isn't to be underestimated, and it's increased availability/legality makes people think it's not even a real drug. Saying "let's go do drugs" carries a very different connotation from saying "let's go drinking". I think that's partly way this site generally has very negative view of alcohol. A large portion of society thinks alcohol carries significantly fewer risks than scheduled drugs, but that simply isnt true. It's legal because it's a significant part of Western culture.

Yes, as I said back a couple pages, the fact that we frame it - it's always 'drug AND alcohol', like they're two separate things - it allows people to compartmentalise the two. It's a very dangerous kind of cognitive dissonance because it's not a drug with a good safety profile, the therapeutic index is quite narrow, it seriously affects the user's judgement, it's a literal poison and carcinogen. If alcohol was a new substance synthesised/discovered this century there's no fucking way known it would be legal.

 

[d1nach]

I think it's easy to delude yourself into thinking you have self control. I'd say the difference between alot of people on this site vs the general population is a increased awareness of how they might loose control. But ask the average person when's the last time they kept to their gym program or diet ECT. I may not have any urge to drink but I am right now being pulled towards water porn sugar and pills I could go drink a class of apple juice and say I'm in control because I choose to stop and pour the glass. But a large part of it is my brain sensing things and making choices for me and I am just giving it what it wants . The only difference is if it was alcohol I might be in the hospital tonight vs apple juice where I might be fine right now in my twenties but get high blood sugar and die in my 60s

 

[d1nach]

According to the CDC alcohol causes 88,000 deaths per year while deaths from every single prescription drug added together is 27,000. When one chemical kills more then triple every prescription drug combined in fatalies I think it's a hard sell it is hard to od.

 

[kleinerkiffer]

I honestly don't see much of a point on continuing this thread

 

[mulholland602]

Sorry if this isn't exactly 100% relevant to this thread but I was wondering about withdrawal symptoms....I was under the impression that alcohol withdrawal syndrome only occurred in those extreme drinkers that hit the bottle day in day out....I'm really more of a binge drinker but do drink to.excess on a semi regular basis usually having from a few days to two weeks off...I recently (start of last week Tuesday through Saturday morning) drank excessively and after my last drink within a few hours drink had the onset of symptoms i mistook for the most severe hangover or the medication I take fucking up my liver....I have been to A & E explaining to them that I believed my liver.may be failing due to the combination of Co-codamol and extreme alcohol intake...In short they told me.in no uncertain terms that no this wasn't the case...I now believe from doing.some reasearch that this was quite sevede alcohol withdrawal....I had quite severe shakes to the point that I couldn't hold a cup,I was sweating and had a fever but also at.time cold sweats,I had body aches in my side.my back and my stomach,I was quite anxious and on edge,I literally could not sleep even though I truly needed it,I had heart palpatations and a severe headache....Now I pdeviously would never believed this possible clearly alcohol naive I am now about 60 hours on and.feel much better....Sorry for the long post.would appreciate any advice and views on wether you agree that this could be the case.

 

[GirlWithBlueHair]

Withdrawal symptoms usually only occur from having a substance continually occupy your receptors so they downregulate. Like with addicts continually slamming their brains with drugs all day every day. But binge use can do the same thing. Just stop using and start eating healthily since you already feel better you haven't done the damage yet!

 

[aihfl]

I had quite severe shakes to the point that I couldn't hold a cup,I was sweating and had a fever but also at.time cold sweats,I had body aches in my side.my back and my stomach,I was quite anxious and on edge,I literally could not sleep even though I truly needed it,I had heart palpatations and a severe headache....Now I pdeviously would never believed this possible clearly alcohol naive I am now about 60 hours on and.feel much better.

Yep, this is alcohol withdrawal. And it doesn't just suck, it can be fatal. If you find yourself in this situation again, it's best to seek medical help. Not all detoxes need be inpatient, but alcohol WD should be overseen by a physician to minimize the risk of seizures. And take it from a former late-stage alcoholic, WDS only get worse over time. Not somewhere you want to go.

 

[kleinerkiffer]

Sorry if this isn't exactly 100% relevant to this thread but I was wondering about withdrawal symptoms....I was under the impression that alcohol withdrawal syndrome only occurred in those extreme drinkers that hit the bottle day in day out....I'm really more of a binge drinker but do drink to.excess on a semi regular basis usually having from a few days to two weeks off...I recently (start of last week Tuesday through Saturday morning) drank excessively and after my last drink within a few hours drink had the onset of symptoms i mistook for the most severe hangover or the medication I take fucking up my liver....I have been to A & E explaining to them that I believed my liver.may be failing due to the combination of Co-codamol and extreme alcohol intake...In short they told me.in no uncertain terms that no this wasn't the case...I now believe from doing.some reasearch that this was quite sevede alcohol withdrawal....I had quite severe shakes to the point that I couldn't hold a cup,I was sweating and had a fever but also at.time cold sweats,I had body aches in my side.my back and my stomach,I was quite anxious and on edge,I literally could not sleep even though I truly needed it,I had heart palpatations and a severe headache....Now I pdeviously would never believed this possible clearly alcohol naive I am now about 60 hours on and.feel much better....Sorry for the long post.would appreciate any advice and views on wether you agree that this could be the case.

Please make a new thread
But yes, sounds like alcohol withdrawal and as others have said, severe withdrawal can kill you, so get help!
And alcohol withdrawal kindels, meaning that each time it'll get worse, plus binge drinking is extremely bad for your brain

 

[tremours]

Take two shots . 5 morphine and .5 of ethyl alcohol the morphine is going to kick in a long time before the vodka will

 

[tremours]

Honestly alcohol is no joke 211 is amazing

 

[kleinerkiffer]

Closed for now