Bupe Suboxone blocking Nitrous?

[SuperPsych]

Does any one else find that Suboxone block the effects of Nitrous? I went on a heavy bender for about a year that included around 24-100 chargers of Nitrous a day, then I went to detox. In detox I was put on Suboxone, which I'm still on. Ever since being on it, I haven't felt much of anything from Nitrous. I got out of Detox almost 1 year ago and really haven't used much Nitrous since. I was still getting strong effects from nitrous right before i went in. I picked some nitrous up tonight, I haven't had any in a few months and my suboxone dose is half of what it was 2 months ago, so I thought maybe I'd get some effects, but still nothing. Anyone else notice a decrease in effects from Nitrous while on Suboxone?

 

[Ketamania]

To be honest, I’ve never done subs with nitrous. However, I have done plenty of heroin with it and I thought it was just me; I felt like the effects of nitrous weren’t as great.

My guess is that the “higher” you get from nitrous depends on how sober you already are. Hopefully that makes sense.

Like, I barely feel three hits when I’m on H, but that’s probably due to me already feeling quite high.

I’ve also noticed this “dulling” effect when combined with stimulants.

However, with psychedelics or ketamine it does not feel “dull”. It in fact amplifies the trip.

Hmm I wonder if there’s an explanation to this.

 

[Ketamania]

ACTUALLY!

This might be a stretch, but it’s a hypothesis.

Opioids make your lung receptors “dull” and not able to sense CO2 as well, thus causing respiratory depression. (Basically the opioids do some wacky stuff to your receptors, causing reduced neuronal excitability).

I wonder if this directly somehow affects the absorption or “processing” of nitrous gas as well, I’m betting it does.

I can’t find much else about the exact effect of opioids on neuronal excitability.

 

[SuperPsych]

ACTUALLY!

This might be a stretch, but it’s a hypothesis.

Opioids make your lung receptors “dull” and not able to sense CO2 as well, thus causing respiratory depression. (Basically the opioids do some wacky stuff to your receptors, causing reduced neuronal excitability).

I wonder if this directly somehow affects the absorption or “processing” of nitrous gas as well, I’m betting it does.

I can’t find much else about the exact effect of opioids on neuronal excitability.

I recently talked to my doctor about hopping off the subs. The reason being that now that I've been on it for awhile, I don't feel much joy anymore. I don't feel bad, but activities that used to bring me joy just dont. The main one being music. Music has always been a big part of my life. All of a sudden it doesn't do anything for me anymore. No joy, no goosebumps, nothing. It doesnt sound bad but it just doesnt elicit an emotional response. Doctor said that that makes sense. Suboxone isn't just blocking opioids, it also block you endogenous endorphins from attaching to the receptor, so you wont get that natural "high" from pleasurable things. I thought maybe that was the cause. Similar to how Naltrexone stops the recreational effects of alcohol.

I never heard of opioids making lungs unable to absorb things as well, but if they do then I also think that your hypothesis makes sense.

 

[Ketamania]

I never heard of opioids making lungs unable to absorb things as well, but if they do then I also think that your hypothesis makes sense.

Glad to hear you’re getting off the subs! I wish you luck!

So opioids don’t actually block the absorption of gases. It’s kinda complicated.

The lungs know “when” and how fast to breathe based on how much carbon dioxide they can sense. Because obviously if you have too much carbon dioxide you need to displace it with more oxygen otherwise you would die.

However, with opioids and the way they affect brain receptors, the neurons can’t tell as well how much CO2 is in the blood. Therefore, if they can’t sense the “need” to breath, they don’t.

 

[negrogesic]

Nitrous oxide has a complex mechanism of action, but its analgesic, recreational, psychedelic and anesthetic effects are mainly a result of it's activity at the:

1) NMDAR
2) GABA-A receptor, specifically the pocket between the alpha and gamma subunit (which is also where benzodiazepines bind)

And more relevant to this discussion,

3) A mixture of opioid receptors. For a long time it was assumed that nitrous oxide's analgesic effects were mediated by MOR agonism. They determined this pretty simply. They administered nitrous oxide to two groups of mice; one group was given only nitrous oxide, and the other group was pretreated with the opioid antagonist naloxone. They then burned their tails and the group with the naloxone pretreatment were more pissed off about it. So they figured nitrous oxide was probably a MOR agonist. Problem is, naloxone isn't just a MOR antagonist, it is a rather potent DOR and KOR antagonist, and KOR agonists are potent analgesics. I believe they later found that the analgesia may be KOR mediated, using genetically modified MOR knock-out mice. Either way, opioid receptors are involved.

So, that's a pretty long winded way of saying yeah, buprenorphine will block some of the effects of nitrous oxide

 

[SuperPsych]

Nitrous oxide has a complex mechanism of action, but its analgesic, recreational, psychedelic and anesthetic effects are mainly a result of it's activity at the:

1) NMDAR
2) GABA-A receptor, specifically the pocket between the alpha and gamma subunit (which is also where benzodiazepines bind)

And more relevant to this discussion,

3) A mixture of opioid receptors. For a long time it was assumed that nitrous oxide's analgesic effects were mediated by MOR agonism. They determined this pretty simply. They administered nitrous oxide to two groups of mice; one group was given only nitrous oxide, and the other group was pretreated with the opioid antagonist naloxone. They then burned their tails and the group with the naloxone pretreatment were more pissed off about it. So they figured nitrous oxide was probably a MOR agonist. Problem is, naloxone isn't just a MOR antagonist, it is a rather potent DOR and KOR antagonist, and KOR agonists are potent analgesics. I believe they later found that the analgesia may be KOR mediated, using genetically modified MOR knock-out mice. Either way, opioid receptors are involved.

So, that's a pretty long winded way of saying yeah, buprenorphine will block some of the effects of nitrous oxide

Awesome! Thanks for the thorough answer! I never knew that it worked on the GABA-A and opioid receptors. Can't say that I'm surprised that Nitrous Oxide has a complex mechanism of action.

Well that answers that. I'll try to stop wasting money on it until I'm completely off of the subs