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Ketamine Study: Ketamine Significantly Improves Depression Symptoms

I've actually done a series of six IV ketamine treatments for depression late last year. I was surprised that it pretty much eliminated my anxiety for the day after the infusion. The problem is, that effect never lasted more than a day, and it never even touched my depression. Which was pretty fucking devastating for me to realize at the time. Part of me wanted to keep trying it, but the logical side of me recognized that was just the fiend in me wanting to have an altered state of mind at any cost. Apparently most people did monthly infusions after the initial 6 to keep the effect going since it does fade by then for nearly everyone, but tbh at $500 per visit and no insurance coverage for it, I couldn't have afforded it even if it had worked.

That clinic has been around for years though, and only does ketamine infusions. It's gotta be working for a lot of people. I hope it gets to the point that insurances will cover it and it will actually be recommended by doctors to treatment-resistant patients.
 
Interestingly, they've found nitrous oxide to do something similar: https://medicine.wustl.edu/news/lau...n-people-with-treatment-resistant-depression/

I've noticed this phenomenon myself, but it's never felt like the antidepressant effects/perspective shit was anywhere near what you feel in the days after use of drugs like ketamine, 2FDCK, 3F-PCP.

I used to be pretty heavy NOS user, perhaps addict might even been applicable, since I averaged 50 whippet cartridges a day for over a year.

I avoid it these days, but I recently bought a home oxygen concentrator (which converts normal air into 95% pure oxygen) since although it's technically a device that requires a doctor's prescription to purchase, these concentrators are still easy to buy without a script (unlike medical grade oxygen tanks, which are harder to come by). Plus, the oxygen concentrator doesn't need refilling etc.

In any event, I bought the oxygen concentrator mainly to see the effects it might have on my blood oxygen levels while sleeping (which I've been monitoring lately due to some mild sleep apnea I have developed due to the fact that because of my heavy weight lifting, I've gained 25 pounds of muscle in the past 18 months, and because I especially love bench pressing, my chest muscles are particularly much larger and heavier). So basically, because off all this damn muscle, I am technically in the overweight range when it comes to body mass index based on my height (in fact I'm almost considered obese), despite having very little fat (if you were to pinch my stomach to grab some fat, all youd get is some skin). Yet, in any event, fat or not, because of all this excess muscle I'm carrying around, I'm sort of huffing and puffing like a fat guy would.

But after buying the oxygen concentrator, the voice of that little drug demon that eternally lives in my brain said to me, "hey man, since you now have this oxygen concentrator, and given that smoke shops now sell giant tanks of nitrous these days instead of those little cartridges....how if you got one of those nitrous oxide tanks and hooked it up to the new oxygen concentrator in a way where you could get a mix of oxygen and nitrous at the same time --- then you wouldn't have to worry about oxygen deprivation, which is one of the reasons you don't do nitrous anymore. And just to be extra sure, you could wear a finger tip oxygen meter to monitor your blood oxygen levels to ensure you're always getting plenty of oxygen. You could also hook-up a filter to the nitrous oxide gas line so you don't have to worry about inhaling oils and impurities -- which is another reason why you avoid nitrous these days. Finally, if you supplement with enough vitamin B12 you don't have worry as much about your final concern -- nerve damage"

And my response was like, "fuck you man, I truly wish you'd die already, but yeah you actually do make some good points, I guess I could try it out it". So recently I did create such a setup, where I got a tank of nitrous gas, hooked it up to a valve to control the flow, then hooked up a tube connect to a heavy duty filter to remove any oils, which is then connected to another tube that runs through yet another filter ofa different type, before then connecting the tube of now double filtered nitrous to the tube that delivers the oxygen from oxygen concentrator. So now I basically have a set up like a dentist (minus a gas scavenger and accurate dials) though the ratios of the gasses that are being delivered is guess work, but I wear a blood oxygen meter the whole time so have sort fo figured out the ratios that produce the desired effects while maintaining normal oxygen levels (note, i realize there are some issues with this methodology).

In anycase it works well in principle. But I feel way too paranoid to try to visit the depths of nitrous oxide highs that I used to regularly do (they are mystical and intense). Back when I as abusing nitrous a decade ago I guess I didn't care about living as much, and would explore depths of the nitrous experience that at the time felt almost like I was risking death). My life is much different now though, and I no longer have that kind of fearlessness (which was essentially a thinly veiled death wish), so my willingness to push the limits is tempered by increased willingness to live. So these days, I have a hard time treading even near the waters of what I would have then considered a moderate experience. Which is unfortunate because that is where it gets really intriguing. Nitrous trips have stages or plateaus much like DXM trips, and I recall there being like 3 or 4 levels (with the 5th one probably being death by asphyxiation).

The nitrous/oxygen mix also feels different than inhaling just pure nitrous oxide gas like i was used to doing inhaling and holding in pure nitrous feels more euphoric and psychedelic whereas the nitrous/oxygen mix is more relaxing. The pure gas also felt paradoxically stimulating in some ways, more dopaminergic. Never once felt like i could fall asleep on pure nitrous due to rush if thoughts. But the oxygen/nitrous mix feels relaxing and sedating, so much so that I feel like I could potentially fall asleep (at lower levels of nitrous), and after i take the mask off I feel like I could take a nap. Yet when I'd inhale pure gas, if I were to use it too closely to bed, I wouldn't be able to sleep afterwards due to all the brain activity.

In short it's not the same feeling, and when I do try to boost the nitrous oxide levels to very high levels, the psychedelic effects feel blunted, less immersive, less mystical. I also don't have the wired feeling after like I used to have with pure nitrous. I used to hit a few cartridges of nitrous the first thing in the morning when I woke up. It was almost like coffee, woke me up and gave me a positive outlook on the day. When I tried to do the same thing first thing this morning with my new nitrous/oxygen apparatus, after using it for a but I took off the mask but actually felt just really relaxed, like I could go back to sleep.

I'm not sure if it's much use to me in this format. Might be good to snap out of a bad mood, and according to that study, an hour of a 50/50 mix like this appears to have ketamine like antidepressant effects. But it doesn't seem like it really has antidepressant effects that are ketamine-like in strength. And of course, it looks a little weird to my girlfriend seeing me hooked up to all these machines and tanks, with a network of tunes, filters and regulatory valves. Then again, she's been with me for long enough to not find that sort of stuff particularly unusual.

On further testing inhaling a variety if ratios of gas using my homemade nitrous oxide + oxygen device (all done while wearing a high-end clinical grade fingertip pulse oximeter), I have found that the strong psychedelic experiences that nitrous can induce can only occur with high concentrations of nitrous oxide. By messing with different ration while measuring my blood oxygen saturation, I found that these true immersive psychedelic states only begin to occur at an SpO2 of 90% or less (peripheral blood oxygen saturation levels, expressed as a percentage, with normal levels being in the 95-100%, and 97%+ being optimal) . And 90% is where the psychedelic states begin to manifest. The deeper states were in the mid 80% SpO2 ranges, which is also a state of hypoxia where the brain is receiving insufficient oxygen (SpO2 in the low 80% is considered to be pretty severe hypoxia). A short period of this is not a big deal, but when you're in such a state that is when the damage starts occuring. And pulse oximeters only tell part of the story and can't measure the extent to which that peripherally measured oxygen is getting to the tissues, or C02 levels, etc.

In these tests I stopped after briefly hitting 86%, and then increased O2 flow and the number resolved quickly. However the psychedelic state I got to at an Sp02 of 86% was just the entry point of the nitrous psychedelic realm that I used to go far beyond when I was on a daily basis inhaling pure nitrous a decade ago. Which is alarming, because I didn't coadminister it with oxygen, I would just inhale cartridges back to back for long periods of time. Would not be surprised if I was regularly going to the 70% range, which is considered severe hypoxia.

That said, I also found that with my nitrous + oxygen device, that I am able to administer a moderately strong anxiolytic and lightly sedative dose of nitrous oxide and oxygen where my Sp02 stays in the 96-99% range. I guess these are the doses used during dental procedures, and likely the similar doses used in these studies where a 1 hour administration of nitrous/oxygen was used as treatment for severe depression. But these kinds of doses don't produce anything near the kind of effect I was accustomed to when I was blasting 50 whippet a day (i didn't even use balloons I would use one of those bottle type dispensers and would inhale directly from the nozzle).

I wonder what kind of damage I did from being in those severely hypoxic states daily, for around 18 months. Franky in term of long-term effects, I feel like more than anything else, it impacted my respiratory system efficiency. But who knows, brain damage manifests in subtle ways. Still I was able to get through grad school with a 3.93 GPA (this was around 5 years after that year and a half of heavy daily nitrous abuse).
 
Well, I am about to start seeing a new therapist to help with my issues and depression, and most likely medicinal Ketamine will be on the table for me to try at some point. I'm very interested and always wanted to try Ketamine recreationally but never got the chance. My old friends who used to use it did so when I was really young and only smoked weed and later I never got the chance.

I don't know how it's supposed to work as far as long term depression relief, but I like to experiment so I'm all about it. And while I do like to smoke weed and drink and even sometimes take kratom and phenibut on the weekends, I have no plans to stop using those altogether like one poster said. I don't see why it should be necessary to stop all recreational drugs to get effects from ketamine, though I'm not sure that's what the poster was suggesting. I also do not plan on telling the person that administers it that I do like certain other drugs as I don't want them thinking I'm a fiend. I'm not sure that I am actually a fiend lol, but I don't want anyone thinking it. Anyways, I normally do have pretty good habits as far as I eat well and intermittent fast and work out regularly and do healthy things like the Wim Hof method. My depression has been bad enough lately that I really want to see what it does, and I don't see long term damage being likely as I have no source for it outside of the clinical setting I know that administers it. I'm not going to be taking it long term if they do allow me to use it at all.

I also love nitrous and enjoy using lots of balloons in a row, but I don't do it very often and can see the concern of not getting enough oxygen. I mean, I always feel ok but I probably do bring on some mild hypoxia. I should try to combine them with my Wim Hof breathing techniques which highly oxygenate the body and which, by themselves, actually bring on very deep and sometimes even mildly euphoric states where I remember dreams and long forgotten memories.

But I had no idea that smoke shops are now selling tanks! I'd like to get one, but I would be a bit concerned about hypoxia like some of you are saying. I wish I could get an oxygen machine to mix it with but doubt I can. How much do the tanks usually cost? Are they easy to use and set up? And how can you use them without depriving yourself of too much oxygen and messing yourself up? Cause I'm definitely NOT wanting to mess up my brain through oxygen depletion, but I do love nitrous. I mean, can you be hooked up to it and just take regular breaths of oxygen by taking the mask off? Cause I've been administered a nitrous/oxygen mix at the dentist, but this would be different. But if the tanks aren't way too expensive, dangerous and/or hard to use then I'd really like to get one.

Edit: I looked up tanks on amazon and I'm seeing one's you just hook up to whip cream dispensers instead of having to use cartridges. I didn't even know they existed as I've always just used cartridges, but this looks much easier. Can anyone else who uses them confirm whether or not they make the nitrous experience easier and better than using cartridges? And are those the kinds of tanks people here are talking about, or are they talking about ones that have face mask like at the dentist?
 
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I get an afterglow from dissociatives but it is only that same day so it’s probably not a proper afterglow it’s just residual drug being active.

I’ll tell you when I did get a psychological afterglow that lasted a long time ; after the first time I tried ketamine and holed. I was amazed at what was possible with the drug and it opened my eyes to there being something more than just mundane existence and a whole new world of psychedelic exploration that was different that 5HT agonists. But that probably wasn’t an excitement or eye opening mood improvement; it was a strong seed of addiction that had just been planted.

Every time I would use I would have some wild K hole experience and then always be looking forward to the next time I could have one ; exchanging trip stories with friends…my mood was certainly improved because I was excited err/hooked or whatever we want to call it.
Your experience about an afterglow is very interesting, I've never tried K myself. However when ever I had MDMA, I would have a week long afterglow it's almost like my mood was lifted, felt positive, energised motivated a stark contrast to my friends who would be depressed for a few days after taking it...
 
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