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rolling with liver problems

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badrobot114

Bluelighter
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Sep 30, 2013
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a friend of mine wants to try MDMA despite having liver problems that prevent him from drinking. i told him it's not the best idea but he's quite adamant. he does have the odd drink here and there without running into problems and isn't recieving any treatment(no need). how dangerous would it really be for him to try a reasonable dose and what potential trouble could he run into?
 
I would advise him NOT to take mdma espiecally with the potential impurities. I've read some articles about people having liver failure after using recreational drugs so it would not be a good idea if he risks it. I'll try to find the articles.

It would most probably be a gamble. He might take it once and be fine but take it the next time and the issues develop and a rise.

Was he diagnosed for having issues or are you just guessing ? Go see a doctor first.
 
he's diagnosed with a fatty liver. his doctor told him not to drink but like i said, he does get drunk occasionally without issues. he's also a serious stoner and has taken acid, mushrooms and cathinones(but that was when he was much younger so i'm not sure if it came after the diagnosis or not) without problem.
 
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Well since this is a HARM REDUCTION forum I'd still stand my grounds and advise against it. However, knowing how people are he will obviously do it anyway. Test your product and start LOW. Make sure he listens to his body as any sign of discomfort/pain can be a bad sign. Also make sure he gets checked up regulary
 
Its definitely not recommended in any form. MDMA by itself can cause liver damage.

If your friend goes through with this, they need to make sure that they stay properly hydrated and cool as these play huge factors in the overall toxicity of MDMA.
 
he's gonna go through with it, i won't be able to make him drop the idea. now he's a pretty big guy but i was still thinking of giving him no more than 100mg to start with. any supplements he can take to minimize the risks? i have a bottle of milk thistle i take myself after i roll, so maybe it's a good idea to let him have some as well?
 
People are so damn stubborn... *sigh*

Keeping the dose low is a good idea, also making sure that he gets one booster at the most (you don't want to increase oxidative stress after all).

The milk thistle may be helpful but last I heard the jury was still out on whether it was beneficial or not.

It is really hard to give recommendations and risk assessments when the only thing I know is he's a big guy who drinks and has been diagnosed with a fatty liver. Has he been diagnosed with full-blown cirrhosis or any other severe conditions?

MDMA isn't usually terribly hepatotoxic (high doses, mixing with alcohol or other agents hard on the liver, not staying hydrated, going on binges, overheating, etc., all can technically increase the toxicity of the drug all the way around) so as long as he doesn't have any enzyme deficiencies (CYP2D6 specifically) or advanced liver disease (cirrhosis, jaundice, hepatitis, etc), I don't think he'll have a problem with a one time low dose night of MDMA. Its still not recommended but I don't see him having serious complications from it unless something goes horribly wrong or his liver is worse off than what he's telling you about.
 
AFAIK it's just a fatty liver he's suffering from. i wasn't planning on giving him more than one booster(if at all). luckily i'm the one measuring and preparing the doses =P
 
LOL you must have better self control than me. When I'm rolling, I'm generous with my friends. I'm generous when I'm sober but I'm EXTREMELY generous when I'm rolling. I'd end up giving in and giving extra if I was begged enough, no matter how dead set I was on not doing so going into it.

That could have to do with not wanting their whining to interrupt my roll though ;)

Anyway, he should be fine. From what I remember, the liver and kidney damage reported from MDMA has been shown to happen when you overheat and your muscles start breaking down. The liver and kidneys get flooded with breakdown product from the resulting rhabdomyolysis which can end in multiple organ failure if its severe enough. Outside of that, MDMA wasn't found to be that damaging to the liver or the kidneys. Alcohol is certainly far worse and he's still drinking.

It isn't safe but unless there is something else at play, I don't think its inherently dangerous. As you said, he's going to do it anyway.
 
i won't be rolling myself, that'll have to wait until after the semester. but yeah, i tend to be the responsible adult shoving AOs down ppls throats and making sure they aren't going over 200mg even when i'm up and away myself =P
 
I suppose that if I were to be in that situation TODAY, I would be a lot more responsible with it than I was. I never really believed in the bad comedowns and such until I started having the brain zaps. And the shadow people. OH THE SHADOW PEOPLE! lmao.

But yeah, sounds like you're taking the steps to minimize his risk as much as possible so I wish him a great roll :)
 
MagickalKat777 said:
I suppose that if I were to be in that situation TODAY, I would be a lot more responsible with it than I was. I never really believed in the bad comedowns and such until I started having the brain zaps. And the shadow people. OH THE SHADOW PEOPLE! lmao.

But yeah, sounds like you're taking the steps to minimize his risk as much as possible so I wish him a great roll :)
Click to expand...

I thought I was the only one seeing the shadow people :O Strange as hell
 
Your okay, my liver is fat as shit, and I used to roll just fine.
Fatty liver is the prodromal phase of liver damage; its the precursor before you get to active liver damage.
Just don't over do it and you'll be fine.
 
Wanted to let you guys know everything went smoothly and everyone had a lovely evening. Thanks for all the advices and replies :)
 
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