potentiation of drugs from milk thistle?

[Anon54]

milk thistle is a strong antioxidant used to protect & repair the liver. & it is used to repair the liver with ppl who have also used to much APAP over there life time.
ive also read that milk thistle also promotes the growth of the enzymes which convert codeine to morphine.
Ive also heard that it potentiates oxy as well.
Seems like a great supplement to take. helps with to much apap & helps potentiate opiates. great.

Anyone know if this is actually true & had any experiences with potentiation?

what about other drugs like benzos?

the highest dose in a pill of milk thistle ive found is 3.5g. It's found in liver tone shots which is advertised atleast in Australia as a liver tonic for ppl who drink to much alcohol. but it has a much lower dose of milk thistle aka St mary's thistle. So if u wanna go buy some make sure u get the cheapest one u can buy with the highest dose. dont just buy it because of the brand. take time to pick one with the highest dose.

I'll do some more research & edit this post if i can find any relevant quotes from websites. that's what im looking for help with finding sources which back up these theories.
well ive had temazepam & codeine today but i only got the milk thistle after id already taken em & i suppose ud have to be taken it for a while anyway to notice any potentiation. Anyways it's really good for anyone health who takes drugs because it actually repairs ya liver. Ive heard they give it in large amounts to ya in the hospital for ppl who have eaten poison mushrooms & stuff by accident.

 

[Pjkt2501]

I found this link for ya: http://www.umm.edu/altmed/articles/milk-thistle-000266.htm

Seems to be more of an overall positive than I initially thought it to be. Nice.

I don't think I'd go mixing it, however..

 

[Anon54]

I found that Milk thistle may inhibit the metabolism of certain drugs. Before taking milk thistle, ask your doctor if any drugs you are taking are metabolized by a liver enzyme called CYP3A4. Can anyone go out of there was to see which drugs are inhibited but milk thistle?
ahh. I'll go check myself
where's that chart on BL that has a list of drugs inhibitors?
found it: (it only includes benzos. Methadone & hydrocodone seems like they could be the only ones. hmm it included weed & coke)
a few sites have listed apap so it might be good to take while detoxifying from apap it might not be safe to mix em together. mmm so can someone help me find out if it increases levels of apap?

Supplements that can be consumed in conjunction with acetaminophen include antioxidants such as selenium, vitamins E and C, alpha-lipoic acid, and nutrients such as S-adenosyl-L-methionine and NAC, which increase levels of glutathione. In addition, milk thistle extract has been shown to protect the liver and is widely used for degenerative liver diseases such as cirrhosis, which, like acetaminophen overdose, is associated with decreased levels of liver antioxidants.

here's another one

Milk thistle liver solution, known formally as Silybum marianum, contains flavonoid. Flavonoid shields the liver from poisons and toxins such as high doses of acetaminophen in the liver (acetaminophen is an ingredient found in Tylenol). Too much acetaminophen in the liver can kill a person; the flavonoids found in milk thistle prevent the accumulation of acetaminophen in the liver, thus prolonging longevity and the condition of life. Silymarin (flavonoids) also contains antioxidants, which help the liver repair itself and grow new cells.

i found that so it may be good to take with cwe. although it may be bad...... im researching now cuz i do cwe regularly
anyways here's the list of drugs inhibited
alfentanil
almotriptan
alprazolam
amitriptyline
amiodarone
amlodipine
amprenavir
aprepitant
atorvastatin
bepridil
bexarotene
bromocriptine
budesonide
buprenorphine
buspirone
busulfan
cannabinoids
caffeine
carbamazepine
cevimeline
chlorpheniramine
cilostazol
cisapride
citalopram
clarithromycin
clindamycin
clomipramine
clonazepam
clopidogrel
cocaine
cyclobenzaprine
cyclophosphamide
cyclosporine
dapsone
delavirdine
desogestrel
dexamethasone
dextromethorphan
diazepam
dihydroergotamine
diltiazem
disopyramide
docetaxel
dofetilide
dolasetron
donepezil
doxorubicin
dronabinol
dutasteride
efavirenz
ergotamine
erythromycin
esomeprazole
estrogens, oral
contraceptives
ethinyl estradiol
ethosuximide
etonogestrel
etoposide
exemestane
felodipine
fentanyl
fexofenadine
finasteride
flutamide
fluticasone
fluvestrant
galantamine
haloperidol
hydrocodone
hydrocortisone
ifosfamide
imatinib
imipramine
indinavir
isradipine
itraconazole
ketoconazole
lansoprazole
letrozole
levobupivacaine
lidocaine
lopinavir
loratadine
losartan
lovastatin
methadone
methylprednisolone
miconazole
midazolam
mifepristone
mirtazapine
modafinil
mometasone
montelukast
nateglinide
nefazodone
nelfinavir
nevirapine
nicardipine
nifedipine
nimodipine
nisoldipine
nitrendipine
norethindrone
omeprazole
ondansetron
oral
contraceptives
oxybutynin
paclitaxel
pantoprazole
pimozide
pioglitazone
prednisolone
prednisone
progesterone/
progestins
quetiapine
quinidine
quinine
rabeprazole
repaglinide
rifabutin
rifampin
ritonavir
salmeterol
saquinavir
sertraline
sibutramine
sildenafil
simvastatin
sirolimus
tacrolimus
tamoxifen
temazepam
testosterone
tiagabine
tolterodine
toremifene
tramadol
trazodone
triazolam
trimetrexate
valdecoxib
verapamil
vinblastine
vincristine
vinorelbine
voriconazole
(R)-warfarin
zaleplon
zileuton
ziprasidone
zolpidem
zonisamide

 

[Pjkt2501]

Interesting.. I'm betting the reason it cautioned against mixing a lot of these on the sites I read would be due to increased effect: something WE want, but not many others (and certainly not the kind of people who write those articles. :D.)

Also - thank you for using a relevant search title: that makes this this thread easily searchable, and you included good information. Good stuff mate.

 

[snipher]

It is true about milk thistle being able to repair and cleanse our liver and I've tried it myself. You can take it even if you don't have any problems with your liver. You can just simply take it as vitamins and I suggest you do so you can have the milk thistle benefits earlier in your life.

 

[Angelus26]

Any idea about the dose of milk thistle to potentiate modafinil

 

[Speed King]

I came across this old post last night, and was hoping someone else would reopen it. Overall, it has to do with what live enzymes are being tied up. I'm sure, since Milk Thistle helps clean the liver, some of its potentiation effects come from busying up liver enzymes, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was some enzyme induction going on. I just started using Milk Thistle for this purpose

Yesterday, I ate 1.2g of Milk Thistle extract and 960mg Silybum marianum (seed) standardized to contain 80% Silymarin. I took it 1.5 hours before consuming 10mg Percocet. I must say that 10mgs felt closer to 20mg for me.
I found this link about modafinil that may help you figure out if Milk Thistle potentiates in the same way. http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/brain-and-nervous-system/medicines/provigil.html

 

[Raysu]

I'm reviving this thread because the posted links are quite useful, however, I'm wondering if anyone has personal experience with milk thistle and hydromorphone specifically. As it has such poor oral BA, the addition of milk thistle seems ideal.

 

[NuitNuar]

How much milk thistleshould i take at what time to make my methadone dose last longer?

I am going to start talking milk thistle in order to (hopefully) make my methadone dose last for at least 24 hours. Rather than starting to feel withdrawal symptoms in as few as 8 hours. Resulting in being sick more than feeling ok.

My question is how much milk thistleshould i take at what time to make my methadone dose last longer?

 

[Solipsis]

Raysu, If it is an inducer then potentiation of percocet / oxy makes sense since you would get more metabolism into the powerful oxymorphone before it's cleared (though depending on what is induced it may have shorter duration)... but with hydromorphone it doesn't really make sense because the only major metabolism for hydromorphone is glucoronidation that results in an inactive metabolite.

So only if you would inhibit the glucoronidation would it make sense.

But it would help to know what milk thistle actually does to your cytochrome enzymes otherwise this speculation is a little pointless.

Anyway just saying that what may work for oxycodone probably works very differently (not or counterproductively) for hydromorphone.

For now, it appears pointless anyway since:

Exposure to milk thistle extract produced no significant influence on CYP1A2, CYP2C9, CYP2D6, or CYP3A4/5 activities.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25028567

more data is needed.

Three other study did not find induction but inhibition of the CYP450 ... which I guess could work for oxycodone because it all gets backed up, may get you more high but with less analgesia from the oxymorphone although that may still come a little later.

However milk thistle also modulates UGT which is actually responsible for the hydromorphone metabolism, but it isn't clear in which direction. It appears it is induction which makes it unhelpful or a bad idea for hydromorphone.

 

[Raysu]

I appreciate the research! I went through two bottles of off/on use and from my experience couldn't tell the difference either way for what it's worth.