Permanent reward related effects of amphetamine.

[Neuroprotection]

I’ve recently become very interested in the effects of psychostimulants. i’m particularly interested in their long-term behavioural affects and impacts on emotional processing after long-term abstinence. every now and again I hear about“Amphetamine induced hypersexuality”, reward sensitisation and stimulant induced impulsive behaviour. however, the texts making reference to these effects are not very clear in stating whether these effects are temporary/Acute effects of the stimulants or if they are long-term and persistent even after abstinence.
I’d love to hear from actual stimulant users, particularly those of amphetamine.
Although I’ve never tried true psychostimulants,(I’ve only used caffeine and nicotine heavily) which don’t count, I have a strange love hate relationship with them. basically, I sometimes get powerful urges to try amphetamine and deep down I feel like I might really enjoy it. at the same time, fears about addiction, neurotoxicity, tolerance, depression and severe insomnia leading to emotional instability have all put me off. furthermore, the fact that caffeine and nicotine work very well for me and I find them very rewarding, has led me to fear that if I try amphetamine or even a low-dose of methylphenidate, I might not be able to enjoy nicotine and caffeine in the same way again. does anyone know if this is a possibility? finally, being of Yemeni origin, I have witnessed firsthand my relatives chewing the Khat plant, A mildly psychoactive herb containing the amphetamine analog, cathinone. Though i’ve never tried it myself, almost everyone who has says the effects are extremely mild but qualitatively different from those of caffeine. unfortunately, this plant is linked to severe insomnia. interestingly, through observing my relatives when they were under the influence, I found that they will just lie in bed, constantly overthinking things and I know this sounds weird, but I would get some strange vibes from them. it was like I could sense their mind was in overdrive though they would tell me they are very comfortable. sorry, I went off on a bit of a tangent, I just have so much to say but so little opportunity to come on this forum.

 

[negrogesic]

I’ve recently become very interested in the effects of psychostimulants. i’m particularly interested in their long-term behavioural affects and impacts on emotional processing after long-term abstinence. every now and again I hear about“Amphetamine induced hypersexuality”, reward sensitisation and stimulant induced impulsive behaviour. however, the texts making reference to these effects are not very clear in stating whether these effects are temporary/Acute effects of the stimulants or if they are long-term and persistent even after abstinence.
I’d love to hear from actual stimulant users, particularly those of amphetamine.
Although I’ve never tried true psychostimulants,(I’ve only used caffeine and nicotine heavily) which don’t count, I have a strange love hate relationship with them. basically, I sometimes get powerful urges to try amphetamine and deep down I feel like I might really enjoy it. at the same time, fears about addiction, neurotoxicity, tolerance, depression and severe insomnia leading to emotional instability have all put me off. furthermore, the fact that caffeine and nicotine work very well for me and I find them very rewarding, has led me to fear that if I try amphetamine or even a low-dose of methylphenidate, I might not be able to enjoy nicotine and caffeine in the same way again. does anyone know if this is a possibility? finally, being of Yemeni origin, I have witnessed firsthand my relatives chewing the Khat plant, A mildly psychoactive herb containing the amphetamine analog, cathinone. Though i’ve never tried it myself, almost everyone who has says the effects are extremely mild but qualitatively different from those of caffeine. unfortunately, this plant is linked to severe insomnia. interestingly, through observing my relatives when they were under the influence, I found that they will just lie in bed, constantly overthinking things and I know this sounds weird, but I would get some strange vibes from them. it was like I could sense their mind was in overdrive though they would tell me they are very comfortable. sorry, I went off on a bit of a tangent, I just have so much to say but so little opportunity to come on this forum.

The effects are acute and temporary, so things like amphetamine-induced hypersexuality do not persist after discontinuing the drug. If anything the opposite might occur if abuse was heavy and consistent for a long period of time and resulted in monoamine depletion, decreases in monoamine transport densities, etc etc.

Most people don't find regular dextroamphetamine or methylphenidate to be wildy addictive.

I've never tried it, but from my experience with a large variety of synthetic cathinones, I bet khat has a harsher comedown than both dextroamphetamine or methylphenidate.

 

[Neuroprotection]

The effects are acute and temporary, so things like amphetamine-induced hypersexuality do not persist after discontinuing the drug. If anything the opposite might occur if abuse was heavy and consistent for a long period of time and resulted in monoamine depletion, decreases in monoamine transport densities, etc etc.

Most people don't find regular dextroamphetamine or methylphenidate to be wildy addictive.

I've never tried it, but from my experience with a large variety of synthetic cathinones, I bet khat has a harsher comedown than both dextroamphetamine or methylphenidate.

Thanks so much for this. for some reason, I’ve always imagined dextroamphetamine to be a smoother stimulant than cathinone derivatives. However, it is quite surprising that the comedown is less harsh as compared to Cathinones, given that oxygen free analogues are typically stronger dopamine release agents.

 

[plumbus-nine]

Just stick to therapeutical dosages of ampehatmine, start with no more than 5mg of dexamphetamine or methylphenidate and you'll be fine. Millions of people take amphetamine daily to combat ADHD and don't end up being addicted. Specially if you use it sparingly then you'll still be able to enjoy caffeine and nicotine. But of course chances are that you'll like the amphetamine, even at low dosages, and crave it instead of the rather shitty stimulation legal drugs provide. But a therapeutic amph dosage isn't a recreational one of meth which skyrockets dopamine levels way past any orgasm you could ever get.

I am not sure what to think about whether stimulants have different effects in people with vs without attention deficit / hyperactivity but I tend to think that it's overblown and most people get similar effects from stims, ADHD or not. Just those like myself with ADHD perform more poor when sober.

Never got to try cathinone (or methcathinone) but some beta-keton research chemicals like mephedrone or alpha-PVP which are nice but usually with a quite dirty edge and comedown. But if you can get fresh Khat leaves then you might try them, at least they will not be adulterated (if you buy street level amphetamine you won't get isolated dexamphetamine and you won't get it uncut, there's always stuff like caffeine or paracetamol in) and have a loong history of human use.

 

[Neuroprotection]

Just stick to therapeutical dosages of ampehatmine, start with no more than 5mg of dexamphetamine or methylphenidate and you'll be fine. Millions of people take amphetamine daily to combat ADHD and don't end up being addicted. Specially if you use it sparingly then you'll still be able to enjoy caffeine and nicotine. But of course chances are that you'll like the amphetamine, even at low dosages, and crave it instead of the rather shitty stimulation legal drugs provide. But a therapeutic amph dosage isn't a recreational one of meth which skyrockets dopamine levels way past any orgasm you could ever get.

I am not sure what to think about whether stimulants have different effects in people with vs without attention deficit / hyperactivity but I tend to think that it's overblown and most people get similar effects from stims, ADHD or not. Just those like myself with ADHD perform more poor when sober.

Never got to try cathinone (or methcathinone) but some beta-keton research chemicals like mephedrone or alpha-PVP which are nice but usually with a quite dirty edge and comedown. But if you can get fresh Khat leaves then you might try them, at least they will not be adulterated (if you buy street level amphetamine you won't get isolated dexamphetamine and you won't get it uncut, there's always stuff like caffeine or paracetamol in) and have a loong history of human use.

Interesting to know you have ADHD, I don’t want to put you under pressure to give me a medical diagnosis, but I just want to tell you about some of the symptoms I have to see if you think they could be ADHD related or if you can relate to them personally. basically, I’ve always been extremely lazy throughout my life, I really struggle to put in effort to keep on tasks, I constantly procrastinate, become extremely sleepy and often fall asleep minutes into a lecture/Speech and often daydream excessively to the point where I miss out large amounts of important information. sometimes, I need to read over a piece of material 10 times or more to get the gist of what is being said. Note that I use text to speech software due to my blindness. at high school, teachers and support staff attributed my constant tiredness and difficulty concentrating to my vision impairment and said this was down to 2 mechanisms. Firstly, lack of visual stimulation and increased demand for auditory processing increases the energy requirements on my brain making me sleepy faster. Secondly, they suggested circadian rhythm disturbances due to insufficient light entry could be involved. however, those around me in higher education, professional researchers, myself and Family/friends all disagree with very valid arguments. even my old high School Support Assistants have changed their minds. For one, I can actually see light and shadows of very close objects despite having no useful vision. theoretically, circadian disturbances should only occur in those with severe retinal damage. my condition is Leber congenital amaurosis so that’s unlikely to be the case. On top of all that, The idea of circadian rhythm disturbances in blind people is being increasingly challenged by the fact that many blind people are extremely energetic hi performing individuals with no sleep disturbances. Despite my own fatigue, I don’t have any sleep issues.

There’s several barriers to me getting tested for attention deficit disorder all of them revolving around stigma/suspicion from family members. this is because I’ve shown an interest in psychoactive substances and have been reading/learning about them since my early teens. on top of this, I’ve managed to pull off some very good grades in higher education getting B grades at college and first class and distinction grades from my university degree and masters courses respectively. what my family didn’t know, is how much I procrastinated. while studying for my masters, I would waste days/weeks doing virtually nothing, just reading a page or 2 to make myself feel better. it’s only as the deadline approached, adrenaline kicked in and I could scramble something together. perhaps the only clever tactic I did use was to read around the subject of my assignment in a relaxed environment in order to develop an interest in it.

I would then make notes on a document, with my references. this still took a very long time due to poor attention, but it would allow me to procrastinate for months when my deadline was imminent, I could easily throw together a top grade essay. to cover my extreme laziness whilst procrastinating and enjoying myself, I would spend the days at my sisters house, giving my lecturers the impression that I was working very hard when in reality, I was watching YouTube all day. you might wonder, what’s the problem with that? well, my problem is when I will have to focus intensely at work and deliver at pace.

Just stick to therapeutical dosages of ampehatmine, start with no more than 5mg of dexamphetamine or methylphenidate and you'll be fine. Millions of people take amphetamine daily to combat ADHD and don't end up being addicted. Specially if you use it sparingly then you'll still be able to enjoy caffeine and nicotine. But of course chances are that you'll like the amphetamine, even at low dosages, and crave it instead of the rather shitty stimulation legal drugs provide. But a therapeutic amph dosage isn't a recreational one of meth which skyrockets dopamine levels way past any orgasm you could ever get.

I am not sure what to think about whether stimulants have different effects in people with vs without attention deficit / hyperactivity but I tend to think that it's overblown and most people get similar effects from stims, ADHD or not. Just those like myself with ADHD perform more poor when sober.

Never got to try cathinone (or methcathinone) but some beta-keton research chemicals like mephedrone or alpha-PVP which are nice but usually with a quite dirty edge and comedown. But if you can get fresh Khat leaves then you might try them, at least they will not be adulterated (if you buy street level amphetamine you won't get isolated dexamphetamine and you won't get it uncut, there's always stuff like caffeine or paracetamol in) and have a loong history of human use.

Thank you for that. Definitely agree, I’ll probably much prefer the amphetamine if I was to try it. interesting that you have ADHD. I’d like to share my own experience with you of my lifelong problems with attention/Focus, not to ask for a medical diagnosis, but to see if you can relate to my symptoms and if you think they may be ADHD. sorry, it will be a long post and if you find that irritating, you don’t have to bother reading through it. I do ramble on a lot, I have so much to say but so few people I can talk to about these issues.

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

Just stick to therapeutical dosages of ampehatmine, start with no more than 5mg of dexamphetamine or methylphenidate and you'll be fine. Millions of people take amphetamine daily to combat ADHD and don't end up being addicted. Specially if you use it sparingly then you'll still be able to enjoy caffeine and nicotine. But of course chances are that you'll like the amphetamine, even at low dosages, and crave it instead of the rather shitty stimulation legal drugs provide. But a therapeutic amph dosage isn't a recreational one of meth which skyrockets dopamine levels way past any orgasm you could ever get.

I am not sure what to think about whether stimulants have different effects in people with vs without attention deficit / hyperactivity but I tend to think that it's overblown and most people get similar effects from stims, ADHD or not. Just those like myself with ADHD perform more poor when sober.

Never got to try cathinone (or methcathinone) but some beta-keton research chemicals like mephedrone or alpha-PVP which are nice but usually with a quite dirty edge and comedown. But if you can get fresh Khat leaves then you might try them, at least they will not be adulterated (if you buy street level amphetamine you won't get isolated dexamphetamine and you won't get it uncut, there's always stuff like caffeine or paracetamol in) and have a loong history of human use.

Yeah do not abuse the Dexedrine or racemic amphetamines. I used to take 5-10mg 5-6 times a week, not taking any in the summer or when I wanted to drink, smoke marijuana or hashish, or trip on LSD and Psilocybin mushrooms. I have never used METH. The last time I took Dexedrine I took 15mg orally, listened to Bowie non-stop, and studied for a history exam that I easily did very well on, and read an 800 page textbook. I never took street speed or any research chemicals.

I never took Dexedrine or Racemic amphetamines again as the 15mg gave me a dry mouth, a headache, and I was drinking water and eating food but felt sort of dizzy or the headache would not go away, but finally did when I slept. I am not sure if I have ADD/ADHD but I wanted to complete my degree and classes without meds just to prove to myself and others that I could. Time management, having a list of work that had to be done and would become an accomplishment when finished with generally focusing on one task at a time, instead of everything at once was extremely helpful, and I would just drink caffeine in moderate or large doses instead.

I was always easily able to sleep, even after taking Dexedrine or Adderall in the late afternoon or evening. Sometimes when I would take it before class if it was early in the morning or if I was bored I would fall asleep on it. I just took the tablets orally. I never snorted any, injected any, or boofed/plugged them. The comedown was not noticeable.

The one time I used cocaine it felt like Methylphenidate but a lot more "clean" of a high, but unlike Methylphenidate it did not last as long, the crash/comedown was horrible, and the fiending, craving, and obsession were so powerful that I decided to never use it again as I had very quickly and easily used all of a tiny expensive bag of it. I also saw how a lot of friends tried it once or would use it at parties, or on weekends and before they knew it they were addicted and using it daily, stealing from family members or friends, going into massive debt to dealers, IVing, smoking base/cooked coke/crack, and many got addicted to heroin or benzos to help with the horrible crash, or for when sleep was needed after long cocaine binges.

 

[emkee_reinvented]

chewing the Khat plant, A mildly psychoactive herb containing the amphetamine analog,
cathinone. Though i’ve never tried it myself, almost everyone who has says the effects are extremely mild but qualitatively different from those of caffeine. unfortunately, this plant is linked to severe insomnia. interestingly, through observing my relatives when they were under the influence, I found that they will just lie in bed, constantly overthinking things and I know this sounds weird, but I would get some strange vibes from them. it was like I could sense their mind was in overdrive though they would tell me they are very comfortable. sorry, I went off on a bit of a tangent, I just have so much to say but so little opportunity to come on this forum.

This matches my experience's with Khat. The overthinking I would swap for eager and energized to engage in any pleasureable activity. But at the same time being very chillin' and unconcentrated.

Much more then Caffein which is merely a body high. Khat is prominent active in the CNS (central nervous system). Btw I always combined them green Tea to flush the Khat containing salive. Don't use Coffee or energy drinks as they are to strong. You'll get a racing heart, the sweats and such.

Cool to have someone that actually witnessed Khat chewers but didn't try himself. Maybe a light dose is just what you are looking for, not a whole bundle but 1/8 - 1/4. Or something along that line. Never tried it myself but it is a good midway between Caffein and the heavy duty stimulants.

The effects are acute and temporary, so things like amphetamine-induced hypersexuality do not persist after discontinuing the drug. If anything the opposite might occur if abuse was heavy and consistent for a long period of time and resulted in monoamine depletion, decreases in monoamine transport densities, etc etc.

Most people don't find regular dextroamphetamine or methylphenidate to be wildy addictive.

I've never tried it, but from my experience with a large variety of synthetic cathinones, I bet khat has a harsher comedown than both dextroamphetamine or methylphenidate.

The comedown was imo less hars then that of Cocaine, dl-Amphetamine/ speed and MethylPhenidate. For example sleep was always possible after cessation of chewing Khat. d-Amphetamine is also very clean in that regard.

But studying on a high dose of Khat would be a disaster. Worse so then on Coke. Khat is a funny sloppy drug, not academic material.

 

[Kaoririp]

A small amount of d-amphetamine is a good place to start to see how you react to it. High dosages of any kind of amphetamine can be very taxing on the mind and body especially the day/s after use if you've been unable to sleep or eat properly. You could even feel a little sick in an unnatural way.

Methamphetamine is a little different depending on the ROA; smoking or IV feels less straining, the best way to explain it is you have less of a 'body load' compared to taking a bunch of pills. In addition it's significantly more euphoric, you'll be unlikely to ever experience a comparable sense of pleasure from any other activity in your life.

There is definitely a tweaky feeling accompanying the use any stimulant but it's very noticeable in high amounts of any amphetamine, kind of like your brain is fried and isn't working properly. It goes away with a solid sleep and a few days break. You'll notice an intense tiredness and mood swings if you use it for a period of time then stop suddenly. Those effects can last for a significant period of time but gradually go away when abstaining from use. A long term consequence is a feeling of hopelessness and severe boredom with your life, and a desire to use again. I don't know exactly how long these take to go away, everyone reacts differently and I don't know if all users experience this when they stop.

The acute effects can change drastically depending on the activities you choose to do while under the influence and the things you consume. This includes the use of other substances, including legal drugs such as caffeine or nicotine. They can add or intensify acute positive effects. The inverse is also true, they can add or intesify acute negative effects. Many people find it helpful to have benzodiazepines available if the effects get too intense or to smoothen out the comedown.

 

[Neuroprotection]

Thanks everyone for all your informative replies and experiences. it’s funny with pharmacology, sometimes two molecules with almost identical structure and pharmacology can produce rather different effects, even the same molecule could act differently, depending on dose. As it has been mentioned here, khat produces a more dirty/Sloppy stimulation, I assume due to the presence of adrenergic alkaloids structurally related to cathinone. also, cathinone apparently has a very short half life in humans. in addition to this, the rapid degradation of cathinone combined with dependence on oral administration/Sublingual absorption as well as complex polyphenolic structures that bind and delay cathinone release all serve to decrease the amount of cathinone reaching the brain to negligible levels. even when chewed for hours on end, it is impossible to hit the brain all at once with a significant concentration of cathinone that would be needed to mimic drugs like cocaine or amphetamine. meanwhile, the adrenergic alkaloids like norephadrine probably add lots of very unpleasant peripheral stimulation and psychomotor agitation at high doses. I theorise that a very high adrenergic to dopaminergic ratio combined with very slow and limited delivery of active ingredients actually gives khat A very low abuse potential. people in Yemen generally chew it because they are bored and this is a social thing, but as soon as they leave the country, most completely forget about it, and only chew it on occasions like weddings. I remember when it was prohibited in the UK, a news reporter stated that if a non-Muslim person was to try khat they would really not be impressed at all. The reason for mentioning non-Muslims is because of the Islamic prohibition on alcohol, and the fact that the majority of Muslims don’t drink. however, it wasn’t the best way of putting it, as many Muslims in the west and in the Middle East do drink alcohol. i’m waffling a bit now, but my point is, khat really is a mild drug Who stimulation differ significantly from that of caffeine but comes nowhere close to the amphetamines. it’s interesting many fine dextroamphetamine to be far cleaner and to provide better focus, but that makes sense when accounting for pharmacodynamic and pharmacokinetic differences. The problem with dextroamphetamine I feel, is the strong dopaminergic qualities which provides a clean focus and stimulation as well as potential euphoria at higher doses. please correct me if I’m wrong as I’ve never tried any of them, but I imagine dextroamphetamine to be more sinister than cathinone or even Adderall in that, the negative effects are decreased and positive effects are amplified. I feel like this might allow habituation/tolerance and addiction, as well as other psychological harms to creep up, Only to suddenly manifest themselves when you least expect it. this has been the problem in Middle Eastern countries, including Yemen.

Illicit as well as pharmaceutical grade amphetamine pills have reached the population and either being used recreationally or four cognitive enhancement as people seek to make more money and escape the current situation. people assume these pills are just like khat but much stronger. I theory they are. However, in practice, theireffects on the brain are dramatically different, by virtue of considerably larger magnitude and duration of dopamine release with the amphetamines compared to that triggered bye the tiny doses of cathinone from Khat chewing.

 

[Señor Moreno]

I am not a stim user and don't know too much about them, but if for " permanent" you mean " forever", the only "permanent reward" I have seen in amphetamine abusers is psychosis.

 

[plumbus-nine]

Interesting to know you have ADHD

I wrote you a PN about this!

I am not a stim user and don't know too much about them, but if for " permanent" you mean " forever", the only "permanent reward" I have seen in amphetamine abusers is psychosis.

Well, I think that there is the possibility of a (semi- as the brain is very very plastic) permanent effect on the reward structures after using high dosages of stims for long time. I knew somebody who was scripted 150mg dexamphetamine a day and sometimes she took 200mg or more, and after quitting she went through a dark period of lethargy and low energy for months if not a year or more. She and some docs thought her to have suffered permanent organ damage but it eventually recovered and was probably just withdrawal (and she turned out to be pregnant as well - she ceased contact with me but for all I know the child is healthy [but might suffer cognitive damage, Idk]). Meth will be more likely to cause something like this but I think overall it's rare with stims to suffer permament stuff.

 

[Neuroprotection]

I wrote you a PN about this!


Well, I think that there is the possibility of a (semi- as the brain is very very plastic) permanent effect on the reward structures after using high dosages of stims for long time. I knew somebody who was scripted 150mg dexamphetamine a day and sometimes she took 200mg or more, and after quitting she went through a dark period of lethargy and low energy for months if not a year or more. She and some docs thought her to have suffered permanent organ damage but it eventually recovered and was probably just withdrawal (and she turned out to be pregnant as well - she ceased contact with me but for all I know the child is healthy [but might suffer cognitive damage, Idk]). Meth will be more likely to cause something like this but I think overall it's rare with stims to suffer permament stuff.

Sorry, is that referring to private message. If so, due to my visual impairment, I’ve not really use them much but I will try and find it now and will reply to you if I can.
Thanks in advance

 

[Neuroprotection]

I wrote you a PN about this!


Well, I think that there is the possibility of a (semi- as the brain is very very plastic) permanent effect on the reward structures after using high dosages of stims for long time. I knew somebody who was scripted 150mg dexamphetamine a day and sometimes she took 200mg or more, and after quitting she went through a dark period of lethargy and low energy for months if not a year or more. She and some docs thought her to have suffered permanent organ damage but it eventually recovered and was probably just withdrawal (and she turned out to be pregnant as well - she ceased contact with me but for all I know the child is healthy [but might suffer cognitive damage, Idk]). Meth will be more likely to cause something like this but I think overall it's rare with stims to suffer permament stuff.

Sorry, couldn’t find your message. Do you have any idea how I could navigate to it. I’m probably missing something because of my visual impairment.

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

I wrote you a PN about this!


Well, I think that there is the possibility of a (semi- as the brain is very very plastic) permanent effect on the reward structures after using high dosages of stims for long time. I knew somebody who was scripted 150mg dexamphetamine a day and sometimes she took 200mg or more, and after quitting she went through a dark period of lethargy and low energy for months if not a year or more. She and some docs thought her to have suffered permanent organ damage but it eventually recovered and was probably just withdrawal (and she turned out to be pregnant as well - she ceased contact with me but for all I know the child is healthy [but might suffer cognitive damage, Idk]). Meth will be more likely to cause something like this but I think overall it's rare with stims to suffer permament stuff.

Damn, who prescribed her 150-200mg?! Was it for weight loss? I remember decades ago as a teen, my friend and sometimes dealer-to any narcs reading this we have all stopped using drugs and have long periods of complete sobriety my friend is into NA/CMA/AA I am not-told me how he took 100mg of Dexedrine/racemic amphetamine tablets and vomited and I thought he had a death wish or something, just 5-15mg of Dexedrine, or racemic amphetamine tablets taken orally was enough for me.

 

[PriestTheyCalledHim]

Sorry, couldn’t find your message. Do you have any idea how I could navigate to it. I’m probably missing something because of my visual impairment.

@Neuroprotection If you go to the top of the page on blue light on the far right hand side there is an envelope inbetween and next to your user settings icon and the notifications bell icon. Can you turn on the feature for people who are V.I. on your mobile, tablet, or computer where whatever you touch or go to with the mouse it tells you verbally what it is?

This is a direct link to it, you will need to click on it or touch the link:

https://bluelight.org/xf/conversations/

 

[plumbus-nine]

Damn, who prescribed her 150-200mg?! Was it for weight loss? I remember decades ago as a teen, my friend and sometimes dealer-to any narcs reading this we have all stopped using drugs and have long periods of complete sobriety my friend is into NA/CMA/AA I am not-told me how he took 100mg of Dexedrine/racemic amphetamine tablets and vomited and I thought he had a death wish or something, just 5-15mg of Dexedrine, or racemic amphetamine tablets taken orally was enough for me.

Was from a professor and so called specialist for ADHD in Switzerland but if you ask me it was an outright overdose. She kept taking amphetamine every few hours and was incredibly moody if not. Prescription dexamph is stronger than street speed by a great deal. For me even 15mg were too much, with tolerance maybe 30mg's. But I miss my dexedrine, in the country here (Mexico, lol) amphetamines are heavily stigmatized among doctors.

@Neuroprotection yeah, https://bluelight.org/xf/conversations/ is the link to private messages. Forgot to mention that, the access goes usually through an icon which might be hard to find.