Opioids Oxycontin 10ish Years Ago, Literally Going Through You-Did It Happen To Anyone Else?

[RT24]

I've been thinking about this a lot over the past week - the event that... Well... Turned me into a total opiate addict, I suppose, forevermore. I've been prescribed them for a very long time. And, you know, I did mainly use them for pain alone for about 12 years, for the most part. Sure, I had a couple days a week that I scheduled out a little "nice time" where I'd take a couple, right at 8pm sharp, to better enjoy my absolute fave primetime TV shows (lol, I'm getting way too old, to have lived in a non-DVR and no streaming world) But I was hardly addicted or anything of the sort.

Then came that event 10 years or so ago. I'd been taking Oxys orally for maybe 8 years at that point. Suddenly? I noticed I was getting zero relief! Next thing I know, my... Err... Well, bowel movements? They were what you might expect absent opioids in an opioid dependent person: And all that was solely because the Oxycontin 40mg pills were coming out in the toilet 100% intact. They even still had the coating on them, where you could see and read the good 'ol OC and 40 on it! I fished them out at first using a cup - I even showed one of those to my personal physician, in asking both wtf and what can I do to resolve this, ASAP?

The doctor, but of course, had no answer available for me. Just keep taking them, was what they said. It was inexplicable to that doctor. Well, another couple of days of the same thing? I'd had enough. I did the only logical thing at that point: The coating wouldn't dissolve? Well F that coating, then! So crush it I surely did, then taking the powdered result orally.

Well, that was when I truly experienced it for the first time. And, you know what? I'm not even sure I can look back and be that upset over what it did to me: That feeling is just like one would imagine being touched by God Himself. I can't imagine a life without it - mind you, without diverging too much here, my life/health is absolute crap: I've nearly died twice in the last two years (one time, I had a 5% chance of living, the second time, two months ago, a 25% chance. Mind you, neither had absolutely the slightest bit of connection to opiates.) I had the one person I lived for die in front of my eyes, just before that near death pneumonia into septic shock. I'm convinced that this one thing is the only thing keeping me alive at this point, what I live for. That might sound terrible, but, oddly enough, it totally isn't. The only negative is tolerance: Today, ten years on, I can do 1000mg or so of Oxycodone IR at once, and have it be just "right".

But enough of that. My question is rather as such: Did anyone else experience Oxycontin pills, especially the 40mg form of the old OCs, run right through them ten years or so ago, when they took them orally, as intended? Because I am convinced Purdue was F'ing with the formula at the time, trying to alter their abuse potential or something, even though these were indeed still the good old crushable OCs. I had been taking the pills for several years at that point, and always had them work just fine - until suddenly they didn't. Whatever the case was, I have that (what had to be an alteration by Purdue Pharma) to thank for introducing me to the full wondrous, genuine understanding of opioids.

'Tis both a most beautiful and inconceivable thing, while also being a curse and utter damnation. (And the latter is solely because of a lack of anything remotely resembling a sufficienct supply for my current "habit" - I've never once experienced anything remotely resembling an OD, 25+ years on. If you could buy opiates much as you can liquor or cigarettes, life would truly be an amazing thing. Unfortunately, that sure ain't the case, especially now that the political world and current culture has targeted them to near abouts extinction.)

So thank you very much, Purdue Pharma. You made at least one legitimate pain patient become an opioid... Fan? - because of your ridiculous experiment. And, btw, I just realized this might come up, but they were absolutely and totally legit Oxycontin tablets, received from CVS/Caremark, and, when crushed, were indeed Oxycontin tablets, with all the opiates that surely would entail.

Edit to add: This was around 2007/2008 or so, at least two years prior to the switchover to the newer OPs.

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

Well RT I don't know how they made it through some 30 odd feet of digestive tract. I've never had that problem, although I didn't always take them whole either. The thing is the coating would come off after 20 seconds of sucking on them and then you could feel the gritty powder start to go next. I've also dropped a whole one in water and it was dissolved within 6 hours. In the patient monograph it tells of skeletons coming out in the 80 & 160 sizes, but the Oxy leached out of the matrix into the small intestine before it's journey was terminal. In fact it was a common practice to insert the old OC tablets rectally in patients that couldn't swallow or had severs GI issues, so this one's a head scratcher.

Now with the new formulation it's all polyethylene oxides so it turns to goop and works in a similar manner with the oxy diffusing out over a set time vs erosion of the old formula pill. Purdue along with Abbot released the first formulation and to alter it would be tantamount to admitting a mistake and possible legal action. It wasn't till OC became the scourge of the nation that they made a change and that took a new FDA application. Changing formulas without the FDA's permission is a big no no.

Did you go into withdrawal when the pill came out whole?

 

[N2theavenue]

As a nurse I've seen this happen. Even heard of people that would wait for an elderly patient to go and fish out their pills to keep for themselves. I've seen them come out in ostomy bags as well. Usually if this is happening there is a problem with the digestive tract. Even if it is just the slowed tract of an elderly patient.

 

[RT24]

Wow, okay, so it wasn't Purdue - guess I've been misplacing my blame all these years, I should have been blaming my body, yet again. And this isn't a surprise to hear, either, because GI is indeed one of my many health problems. I had just figured, since it happened so suddenly, and in the midst of the outcry to make them abuse proof, it had to be tampering with their formula.

And as far as the first replier goes? Believe me, I couldn't believe it either. But I swear to you, you *could* make out the 40 and the OC, quite clearly. I know what you mean, I myself am used to any pill meeting any liquid - and if course, I took it with a drink- and... It dissolves, fast, at least some. But these were indeed the old OCs, and I remember from my efforts at getting any relief at all from them (a spoon and a hearty crush), that coating was still something else. It was very strange, very hard, and... Well, I could then understand how it could survive an entire trip through my GI system.

As far as the withdrawal? No, I was uncomfortable from the sudden loss of my primary opioid as an opioid dependent, but I also had Percocets for IR breakthrough, so it wasn't 100% WD. I'd only get to know the joys of that several years later, as my tolerance skyrocketed.

 

[tacodude]

That's how the pills that don't break down work. A member here who worked a pharmacy said customers would bring in their pills dug out their shit, which ended up getting tested, and none can't back with more than 10% active content left if any.

 

[RT24]

Hrmm... It was ten years ago, and I'll admit, the mere fact of seeing it as such likely had a psychosomatic role, but I'll be damned if I was getting the relief I was prior. Mind you, I was still using them... "recreationally" at that point on occasion, but strictly by swallowing the pill (meaning plural, of course), as intended.

They weren't working, and then I started having the pure liquid BM's which is how I first noticed the pills coming out intact. Likewise, I hate to contradict science fact based solely on my own personal experiences and recalled memories, but... The fact remains, I'd been taking them for 10 or so years at that point. While I can't say it was 100% of the time, there definitely weren't any whole pills coming out. It happened quite suddenly, and it was constant for that two week period prior to my overcoming such issues. Likewise, I can believe some of the pill did get absorbed in my system, because I do understand the rudimentary chemistry and pharmacology behind it - 25 years on from this journey with such things, you come to do your research and understand quite a bit. But, again, based solely from that personal recollection, i'd say total absorption was closer to 10%, hardly 90% - believe me, you know when you feel that "feeling" and when you don't.

 

[mostly-human]

How did you find out your exact probability of living?

 

[RT24]

Lactic Acid level from septic shock. Epidural hematoma from a seizure, the size of it. Modern medicine is an amazing thing, eh? It's *all* actually narrowed down to a science! What a thing.

Edit to add: I'm also not sure exactly what that has to do with anything in the thread, but... I might very well be wrong on this, but it sounded more like a comment wondering if I'm a hypochondriac or fabricator. I'm sorry if my probabilities sounded off to you, but they were/are just a plain fact. ?

And, actually, since you did bring it up...? Let me tie it back into an on topic comment for this forum: In how I said that I'm not so sure I can be that upset about what I mentioned in my first post turning me into the state today, where I live primarily for such a thing as what I'm assuming we all on this forum know all too well?

That 95% should have f***ed me up bad. My Blood Pressure in the ER was so low, none of their instruments could detect it. They had to insert an arterial monitor, into my wrist artery. It was then detected to be 26/38. I should have died. My body was in a severe state of septic shock, period. The doctors all treated me like I would die, and told me as much. I should have needed some serious psychological counseling, because a near death experience is severely traumatic, to anyone. I *should* be dead - and, to make matters worse, it happened within months of the loss of that one person I mentioned. I was already really reeling from that alone, which should again have f***ed me up for years - they dropped dead in the middle of talking to me, gone in seconds.

But you know what? I made it through all of those, psychologically completely normal (save an addiction, of course!). I remember, the day after they died? I was saving my daily intake for when I got home - without them, I wasn't even coherent: I couldn't stop crying. So, in the middle of talking to the cemetery guy, I went ahead and took them: 30 minutes later, I returned to completely coherent and rational.

My point in this rant? I'm tired of this nonsense against opioids. I'm not trying to puff myself up here, but nobody knows them better than I do: I was 8 when I was started on them. I know the "high" from everything save heroin, because I've never done an illegal drug, not even marijuana. They *can* be a very positive thing. The only problem, is when you don't have them. Of course that's a huge problem, but it doesn't have to be so. I'm not so sure I am advocating for an entire world of opioid addicts, but, handled properly (meaning knowing what you are taking, and not being such an idiot that you can't control yourself and take so much as to "nod out", but rather *just* enough to feel the euphoria? Well, I feel as though I've been taking these long enough, and then, because of this that I mentioned in the first post, long enough as someone who definitively can't do without that just indescribable feeling, without any adverse or negative/detrimental consequences, but just the absolute opposite.

This utter fear and aversion to opioids is just wrong to me. They have spared me from becoming an absolute wreck - I can actually function and be rational, and utterly psychologically healthy, that one thing aside. But without that one thing? I'd be on so many antidepressants and anti-nervousness drugs as to fill a pharmacy - and God only knows what long term liver/kidney/neurological consequences they'd have. Never mind all the therapy and counseling. So, I realize it is an unpopular opinion, and one I might get a lot of flack for having ranted thusly in this thread, but the only reason I can function because of those probabilities you mentioned is just so. Like I said in the first post, I'm *not* upset over it. Actually,, again, just the opposite: I'd probably have been another suicide statistic a long time ago without it... So c'est la vie.

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

The usual travel time through the GI tract is around 17 hours, Gastroenteritis could cut that down to a fraction of the time. Taco is right that there are Matrix pills like Desoxyn that leave a skeleton every time but the old OC's were ammonio methacrylate copolymer based, but the patient monograph does state:

9).Patients should be advised that they may pass empty matrix " ghosts" (tablets) via colostomy or in the stool, and that this is of no concern since the active medication has already been absorbed.

It's just personally I've never heard of it happening to anyone on the smaller size/ lower dosages. The not "feeling it" either seems to point to a GI issue as you said it was a two week phenomenon.

 

[RT24]

Well, it was a two week phenomenon only because I'd had enough, and went with the recourse of crushing them and then taking the powder orally.

One absolute fact I can state, however, is they were not skeleton pills: I pressed my fingers on the first instance (after washing it thoroughly, of course!) The *entire* pill was there. There was not an inch of give there, the entire pill, including what lay beneath the outside shell, was there, and not inside of me, as it should have been.

Like I said, now hearing these posts, and knowing GI issues are one of the primary problems with my chronic illness, I can put it down to my own GI issues. I'd just always assumed it was Purdue experimenting with a few batches, however, as the timing was suspect: Starting right when they desperately were trying to avoid the regulatory condemnation of creating a street drug more than a pharmaceutical one. So... Apparently I can now safely lay blame on that turning point in my life in my own GI tract, with little question about it.

Edit: Actually, I was just thinking about it: Again, I'd washed it thoroughly, but I just remembered: The first times I did crush them up? They were solely those that i'd fished out. I'd collected so many, and they'd solely come out of me, that I suppose I thought at the time it'd be wasteful to do anything otherwise. And because of that simple fact, I can state with absolute certainty that the oxycodone was definitively all there, not having been absorbed through the shell.

 

[tacodude]

That's why I mentioned the old ones that powder, which could possibly dump the dose faster than the new ones that stay intact as one of the oxy forrmulation is named

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

The patient monograph that I quoted was from the old OC's taco. If the hypromellose yellow color was still intact then I'm at a loss. If it was pale white then the oxy salt could have diffused out in your GI tract and still have retained it's structure, it's just strange to have so little erosion that the imprint was visible. At this point we can only speculate and the Statute of Limitation has passed as far as Purdue liability. Hope your current pain management is sufficient during the "crisis" as it's lean out there right now.

 

[tacodude]

Wait I didn't start this thread... Thanks for clearing it up though. I didn't think the old ones would come out recognizable, but it makes sense they could be a blob of retained mass although I doubt it would look undigested. W.E off topic

 

[Jekyl Anhydride]

If corn can make through right?

 

[tacodude]

??
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??

 

[BeachBum4u]

OP, I too was prescribed Oxycontin from about 98 - 2010 and had to deal with the switch from OC's to OP's. I had not really heard of any talk of pills "passing through" until the OP version came out. Obviously it could happen because the coating was now freaking plastic, for cryin' out loud! The really bad thing for me is that like you, I had discovered the joys of crushing the OC's. We didn't come about things in the same way but we both got there. Anyway, I ended up taking the new ones orally and that was that. It pretty much sucked but my body eventually adjusted.

My point was, sorry I strayed OT a little bit, that I had never heard of any of the OC's making it through one's GI tract basically intact. With the OP's, yes but not an OC. Mainly because with the old ones the coating was easily removed with one of my fingernails. There just can't be too much to them if I can do that, right? Anyway, just thought I'd throw my 2 cents in the ring. Good luck OP!