No withdrawal symptoms?

[Båtmannen]

Hello.

I have been on buprenorphine for about one and a half month now. I've been mostly on 10 mgs per day. Every morning, I put the suboxone behind my upper lip, by the gums. Then I have to sit down for approximately 3-5 minutes. By then, some of the suboxone has been dissolved, but most of it remains, and then I plug it.

However, now I haven't used since thursday (except the very small amount that dissolves in my mouth before I can get it out. It's soon been 72 hours and I haven't got any withdrawal symptoms what so ever.

Why is this? I haven't really used buprenorphine this long before, but I do have been on heroin for long times. While on heroin I go to withdrawal within 24 hours of the last dose. I know the half life of buprenorphine is much longer than heroins', but ... after 72 hours, I should be feeling something, right?


best regards

 

[Keif' Richards]

You're right that you should begin experiencing withdrawl within this timeframe. The only difference that I can come up with is the fact that Buprenorphine is a mixed agonist/antagonist, so it's not going to substitute completely for an Opiate like Heroin. I'd figure that 1.5 months would be enough to produce a withdrawal syndrome from Buprenorphine itself though. This one's a mystery to me.

 

[Båtmannen]

I haven't been on buprenorphine this long before. I've only used heroin and morphine for extended periods of time.

Is it possible that the buprenorphine my body absorbs trough the buccal ROA is enough to keep the withdrawal symptoms at bay?


I'll have to try to stay of the buprenorphine for more than 72 hours, and see if I get any withdrawal symptoms at all...

 

[spacejunk]

I've known people who have successfully done bupe tapers (switching from a full-agonist to bupe) that have taken a couple of months.
I believe they were constantly dropping the dose in that period, and somehow did not become dependent on the bupe.

OP, do you know about "rapid bupe tapers"? A lot of people are able to completely negate the withdrawal symptoms of opiates with a careful taper.
But you took 10mg for your last dose?
That's a pretty hefty dose, and i'd be surprised if you experience zero withdrawals if you jumped off at 10mg and didn't taper.

Bupe is pretty long lasting stuff - i wouldn't be too surprised if it's holding the WD at bay...but maybe you got really lucky.


One thing i really don't get is this:

I have been on buprenorphine for about one and a half month now. I've been mostly on 10 mgs per day. Every morning, I put the suboxone behind my upper lip, by the gums. Then I have to sit down for approximately 3-5 minutes. By then, some of the suboxone has been dissolved, but most of it remains, and then I plug it.

What exactly are you plugging?

 

[Rehabicable]

You may still feel the w/Ds yet. It just takes awhile with subs cause the half life is so long and you take such a big dose. IME coming off subs after a year + was the worst detox of my life because it took so long..

 

[chelle216]

^ yep, it could still hit you, especially since you've been on a fair dose. Bupe has such a long half life that it just keeps compounding in your system. Before I jumped off about 6wks ago I charted 2 weeks of the elimination half life of the dose I had been on daily (0.75mg) and it was actually about 4x that amount and still climbing. I either picked up a bug or the worst of my withdrawal symptoms didn't hit until about 3 weeks after I jumped, which would have been right about the time that it was fully out of my system.
There's always a chance that you're an outlier, but best of luck other way.

 

[MDPV_Psychosis]

If I'm reading the original post correctly, it sounds he is still placing the strip in his mouth each day for 3-5 minutes. Normally, after 3-5 minutes, he takes the strip out and then plugs it but for the last 72 hours he has only put the strip in his mouth for a few minutes and then removed it.

So it's possible he is still absorbing enough bupe bucally/sublingually within the last 72 hours to keep him out of withdrawal. Or the withdrawals will hit any minute, or he is just really really damn lucky.

 

[Keif' Richards]

I feel like their must be some missing variable here, but also, I think that the fact that he's never been totally dependent on a mixed agonist/antagonist like Buprenorphine could mean that maybe 1.5 months just wasn't enough time to develop a significant tolerance. Ive never used Buprenorphine for longer than a month, so I can't really comment, but from what I've read, the withdrawal from Buprenorphine is less intense than short-acting Opioids, but the PAWS could end up being the worst part of the experience.

The Buprenorphine PAWS seems to be very protracted; a long syndrome with less intense symptoms. I can see how this might be preferable to a short and extremely intense withdrawal, but it's definitely not for me. A lengthy withdrawal, like from Methadone has my spirit utterly broken by the middle of the second week.

 

[JoeJunky]

How are you doing Batmannen? You have me wondering now. I quit sub 3 days ago (.25mg p/day) and I haven't felt any significant withdrawals, I'm really surprised, I'm also taking tramadol and gabapentin. I've jumped off 2mg a day in the past and was kicking around in my bed about 36-48 hours later.

3 months of 10mg a day seems like you should be dependent, but like others said, maybe you're lucky.

 

[MDPV_Psychosis]

How are you doing Batmannen? You have me wondering now. I quit sub 3 days ago (.25mg p/day) and I haven't felt any significant withdrawals, I'm really surprised, I'm also taking tramadol and gabapentin. I've jumped off 2mg a day in the past and was kicking around in my bed about 36-48 hours later.

3 months of 10mg a day seems like you should be dependent, but like others said, maybe you're lucky.

In your case, both the tramadol and gabapentin are probably helping the in regards to not feeling withdrawals, depending on how much and how often your taking them, especially considering you jumped off at only .25mg/day.

When I tapered down that low (.25mg per day), I could feel withdrawals creeping in within 8-12hrs after my last dose and they would definitely be roaring by 24hrs. In my experience FWIW.

 

[JoeJunky]

In your case, both the tramadol and gabapentin are probably helping the in regards to not feeling withdrawals, depending on how much and how often your taking them, especially considering you jumped off at only .25mg/day.

When I tapered down that low (.25mg per day), I could feel withdrawals creeping in within 8-12hrs after my last dose and they would definitely be roaring by 24hrs. In my experience FWIW.

Yeah, that sounds right, I struggled a little bit getting through the day on .25 when I was tapering but I was never "sick".

I'm taking 100mg of tramadol every 4 hours with a taper after 4 days. And the gabapentin is 100mg every 4 hours too, taper after 12 days. I don't feel like I need that much, so I'm taking it as needed. Not sure why the doctor has different tapers.

Batemannen is probably fine, whenever I'm going through withdrawal I'm usually in bed surfing this site.

 

[Båtmannen]

What exactly are you plugging?

They look like this:

^
There's always a chance that you're an outlier, but best of luck other way.

Outlier? Sorry. English is not my native language, and I don't get what "outlier" means even from searching online dictionaries.

How are you doing Batmannen? You have me wondering now. I quit sub 3 days ago (.25mg p/day) and I haven't felt any significant withdrawals, I'm really surprised, I'm also taking tramadol and gabapentin. I've jumped off 2mg a day in the past and was kicking around in my bed about 36-48 hours later.

3 months of 10mg a day seems like you should be dependent, but like others said, maybe you're lucky.

Like the other guy said: 0,25 mg per day isn't much, and your tramadol keeps your receptors satisfied.

Lucky?

 

[JoeJunky]

outlier is a statistical term that basically means..."not normal." Most people who take 10mg for 30 days would not be able to quit and not have any w/d's, so in that sense one could say that you're lucky.

Yeah, those pills are common, either those or the 8mg and 2mg sublingual strips. I've never seen any1 bang the pills, but I have seen the strips, easier to separate the naloxone? Not to say a needle junky won't find a way to mainline something.

 

[MDPV_Psychosis]

There is no need to separate the naloxone even if one is planning to IV. I'm not even sure if there is any easy way to do so, but again, it's not necessary to do so... Except maybe for those individuals who experience unpleasant effects from it (headaches etc) but that is rare.

 

[JoeJunky]

I would stir it in a spoon and let the white stuff (what I thought was naloxone) settle in the bottom and suck out the clear stuff, I thought the "white stuff" would throw me into immediate WD. interesting to know that the naloxone didn't matter, or would have been interesting to know when I was really stupid banging that crap lol.

You're right, there is no real noticeable difference, only did it because I was a needle junky.

 

[Bigfatjoe96]

One word: willpower

 

[Keif' Richards]

I would stir it in a spoon and let the white stuff (what I thought was naloxone) settle in the bottom and suck out the clear stuff, I thought the "white stuff" would throw me into immediate WD. interesting to know that the naloxone didn't matter, or would have been interesting to know when I was really stupid banging that crap lol.

You're right, there is no real noticeable difference, only did it because I was a needle junky.

One of my gospels is trying to explain to folks that it's not the Naloxone that causes the worst sickness, it's the Buprenorphine and in most cases, the Naloxone is going to have minimal to no effect at all. Nobody ever wants to believe. There's even a market around here for so-called "white Bupe" (Subutex) at 4 times the price of Suboxone, because it "won't make you sick".

 

[tango5]

buprenorphine has a long half life and typically resides in your "system" at minimum 72 hours (3 days). Even beyond this window of time, you're likely to have residual molecules residing ... in my experience going through withdrawals--or I should say experiencing the onset of WDs sometimes don't become fully noticeable until the 72-96 hour window--and I've understood the "WDs Window" can start even later ... day 4 or 5.

As you're probably well aware, all of these factors are directly based on a variety of factors ... NOT JUST the last dosage, but the last full day's cycle dosage. What I mean is you may have taken your last dose on a certain day, but the previous day of the full regimen "qty 3 @ 8mg" will bare a more definitive response towards your anticipated window of expected WDs. Does this make sense? And of course other contributing factors are dependent on you (weight, metabolism, diet & fluid intake), and other influencing factors, such as drugs (over/under counter) and how they may or may not impede upon the progress of the buprenorphine exiting your system, as well if these influences (other drugs, metabolism, diet, etc) are perhaps masking to some extent your ability to fully identify and understand whether or not you've begun WDs/detox. Does this all make sense?

buprenorphine Is no joke and reacts very differently with each who uses it. Some report a so called "high", some don't, some experience ugly sizable withdrawals, some don't. Some prefer quitting cold turkey, or rapid versus gradual tapering ... again ALL depends on YOU first and what other influences you introduce into that ALWAYS changing/evolving science project that we all have resting on our shoulders.

I hope I was able to provide some help and I truly wish you well!