Trying to quit heroin. I shoot probably a gram a day. I’m trying to find the easiest way to do this without suboxone. I still have to work, parent, etc. despite withdrawals so trying to find a way to soften the blow. Has anyone substituted morphine for heroin to get off of it? Has it helped with withdrawals? Any thoughts, opinions, experiences? Thanks.
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BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic
Opioids Morphine to combat/alleviate heroin withdrawal?
- Thread starter Alruiz78
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Nicomorphinist
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It will work beautifully, actually, What would be the reason for getting off of the heroin? Using a taper of morphine would be simplest for the reasons I outline below. If you need to maintain with morphine over a long period of that is also easier to do. I would also point out that dihydrocodeine, especially extended-release, can also be the basis of a less-complicated maintenance protocol as well. It also would seem to make a faster taper work better as well.
I am on a rotation of strong narcotic analgesics for severe chronic pain, and my experience is with being converted straight across from PO and SC/IM, IV on occasion Vilan (nicomorphine hydrochloride, 3,6-dinicotinoylmorphine) to morphine and the results were minimal side effects, especially with the route of administration. Only intravenously could I tell a difference, and that was the pins & needles, flushing, and a feeling of heat on the face. The difference was caused by the distribution and metabolism of the active metabolite, which in both cases is morphine. Then switching from hydromorphone to nicomorphine had differences Going from morphine to nicomorphine had slightly different effects also.
Having been treated medically with those medications as well as, quite some time ago medicinal diamorphine and Paralaudin (diacetyldihydromorphine hydrochloride) and experimentally with pharmaceutical/reagent grade dibenzoylmorphine and acetylmorphone and also 3-MAM and 6-MAM, I can assert that the relative amount of histamine release on administration can be quite a bit less than morphine, with the drugs in question being in the following descending order: dihydrocodeine, morphine, dihydromorphine, diacetylmorphine, hydromorphone.
So, then heroin (3,6-diacetylmorphine) does indeed have the desired effect. If you are able to have an uninterrupted supply of morphine, it will actually obviate the blow altogether as the differences betwixt heroin, which is 3,6-diacetylmorphine, are what could be called largely administrative. The body turns heroin into morphine in such a way as to make heroin more potent by weight than morphine, and causes heroin to have a stronger bang and rush, the latter having less pins & needles to it. This histamine release with morphine, the lesser nausea and emesis caused by heroin, and heroin being much more water soluble than morphine are the reasons that heroin, also called diamorphine, are used clinically as an alternative to morphine. Morphine is considered to be the benchmark for measuring narcotic analgesics, yet there are the above and other reasons that both, and usually also hydromorphone, and less commonly dihydromorphine, are used alongside each other to allow the maximal amount of flexibility in all cases.
The body begins breaking down heroin into 6-monacetymorphine and morphine within seconds and it is the morphine, and its metabolites which do the narcotising -- the two acetyl groups attached at positions 3 and 6 on the morphine carbon skeleton help the morphine across the blood-brain barrier more quickly and in larger absolute quantity . . .
Morphine hydrochloride in the form of Vendal, MST Continus and the like are used in an increasing number of countries as an alternative to methadone for maintenance and detoxification. This protocol is done also with dihydrocodeine and hydromorphone as well -- and of course, just plain pharmaceutical heroin
I am on a rotation of strong narcotic analgesics for severe chronic pain, and my experience is with being converted straight across from PO and SC/IM, IV on occasion Vilan (nicomorphine hydrochloride, 3,6-dinicotinoylmorphine) to morphine and the results were minimal side effects, especially with the route of administration. Only intravenously could I tell a difference, and that was the pins & needles, flushing, and a feeling of heat on the face. The difference was caused by the distribution and metabolism of the active metabolite, which in both cases is morphine. Then switching from hydromorphone to nicomorphine had differences Going from morphine to nicomorphine had slightly different effects also.
Having been treated medically with those medications as well as, quite some time ago medicinal diamorphine and Paralaudin (diacetyldihydromorphine hydrochloride) and experimentally with pharmaceutical/reagent grade dibenzoylmorphine and acetylmorphone and also 3-MAM and 6-MAM, I can assert that the relative amount of histamine release on administration can be quite a bit less than morphine, with the drugs in question being in the following descending order: dihydrocodeine, morphine, dihydromorphine, diacetylmorphine, hydromorphone.
So, then heroin (3,6-diacetylmorphine) does indeed have the desired effect. If you are able to have an uninterrupted supply of morphine, it will actually obviate the blow altogether as the differences betwixt heroin, which is 3,6-diacetylmorphine, are what could be called largely administrative. The body turns heroin into morphine in such a way as to make heroin more potent by weight than morphine, and causes heroin to have a stronger bang and rush, the latter having less pins & needles to it. This histamine release with morphine, the lesser nausea and emesis caused by heroin, and heroin being much more water soluble than morphine are the reasons that heroin, also called diamorphine, are used clinically as an alternative to morphine. Morphine is considered to be the benchmark for measuring narcotic analgesics, yet there are the above and other reasons that both, and usually also hydromorphone, and less commonly dihydromorphine, are used alongside each other to allow the maximal amount of flexibility in all cases.
The body begins breaking down heroin into 6-monacetymorphine and morphine within seconds and it is the morphine, and its metabolites which do the narcotising -- the two acetyl groups attached at positions 3 and 6 on the morphine carbon skeleton help the morphine across the blood-brain barrier more quickly and in larger absolute quantity . . .
Morphine hydrochloride in the form of Vendal, MST Continus and the like are used in an increasing number of countries as an alternative to methadone for maintenance and detoxification. This protocol is done also with dihydrocodeine and hydromorphone as well -- and of course, just plain pharmaceutical heroin
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KS78
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I've used it before and it definitely helps because as Nicomorphinist stated, heroin pretty much becomes morphine once it crosses the BBB. I would advise you to use a slow release form of morphine preparation if you have access to it. This will make tapering much easier, you won't have peaking levels of morphine during the day and you don't have to redose every few hours. You could also use some other comfort medications (Clonidine, Baclofen, Gabapentin, Loperamide...) to help ease the withdrawal syptoms once you start tapering; they could help you taper and stop much faster.
Good luck.
Good luck.
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Hey OP. Kudos for taking on the beast of withdrawal. You can definitely use the. Take either orall or rectal (higher BA) but you cannot take recreational doses. It will extend your withdraw.
I'd say eat 15mg-30mg.
I'd say eat 15mg-30mg.
Zonxx
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will definately help. it won't be the same as smoking or banging H, although yes h turns into morph, good heroin if thats what youve been using feels like another drug, i find that morphine sulphate is THE BEST drug to use to wean from opiates because even when you crush the ER pills, the effects last a solid 6-9 hours before wearing down.
you migt want to do this THIS IS A SUGGESTION I'M NOT SAYING TO DO IT .
take a higher dose of morphine 100-150mg (idk what you've been using i take 400mg kadian aka morphine sulphate/day)
it'll give you a nod
once youve had a nod, then you cut the dose in half, and when youre ready, cut it in half again and keep the other half just incase you really really cant deal w it, and finally, take lil bits and hopefully you'll be perfecto ^^ i plan on doing somthing similar to this but i also have oxy and hydromorphs
you migt want to do this THIS IS A SUGGESTION I'M NOT SAYING TO DO IT .
take a higher dose of morphine 100-150mg (idk what you've been using i take 400mg kadian aka morphine sulphate/day)
it'll give you a nod
once youve had a nod, then you cut the dose in half, and when youre ready, cut it in half again and keep the other half just incase you really really cant deal w it, and finally, take lil bits and hopefully you'll be perfecto ^^ i plan on doing somthing similar to this but i also have oxy and hydromorphs
Hezman94
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how much morphine does heroin convert to ive niffed abot 150mg obvs not pure..anyone know
the first 3days will be a bastard get some loperamide even jus for one day.
if u get gabas follow the same rules as opiates no more than 3 days
Baclofens are awesomefor withdrawal for some reason.
Pregabalin with no tolerae destroys opiate withdrawal.
get some cannabs make it into small amount of butter and use it sublingualy during the dayy
the first 3days will be a bastard get some loperamide even jus for one day.
if u get gabas follow the same rules as opiates no more than 3 days
Baclofens are awesomefor withdrawal for some reason.
Pregabalin with no tolerae destroys opiate withdrawal.
get some cannabs make it into small amount of butter and use it sublingualy during the dayy
Lorne???
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As stated, H converts to morphine basically 100%, so you have the perfect substitute.
Do you plan on tapering or maintenance? Because there is not really a big difference between H and morphine, unless injecting, and that's mostly potency(H isn't pure anyway, so that is moot)
Do you plan on tapering or maintenance? Because there is not really a big difference between H and morphine, unless injecting, and that's mostly potency(H isn't pure anyway, so that is moot)