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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards | negrogesic

(Methamphetamine) Racemic vs Dextro For ADHD?

KattyKorner

Greenlighter
Joined
Aug 26, 2022
Messages
19
I have access to racemic meth (I can absolutely confirm it is racemic, let's just leave it at that) and I am wondering if racemic is better, similar to add medications like Adderall, or is the dextro enantiomer better?.

The doses would not be recreational, just for adhd.
 
Well if you are going to compare it to ADHD meds who is to say adderal is better for studying than dexedrine or vice versa? They are both prescribed after all.

That being said desoxyn is dextro-methamphetamine so perhaps thats a good indicator?
 
Well you have a good point! I always assumed racemic was better due to Adderall being everywhere, and also anecdotal experiences from the internet, that racemic is more "pushy" to do things, but with more side effects present, while dextro is more recreational. Idk, you have a good point!
 
L-methamphetamine is not psychoactive like L-amphetmine is.

L-methamphetamine is actually legal and sold as a decongestant over the counter.

When it comes to meth, there is only one isomer you want, dex. There are different impurities in modern meth, but calling it racemic is a misnomer.
 
Let's just say I know someone who appreciates ketone reductions. So yes, racemic.

I know it is not psychoactive, but it still plays, at least somewhat. Anecdotally people say they are different and have different levels of "get shit done" basically, so thus me asking.

Probably better for me not ask for the enantiomers to be separated, as that opens up more recreational ability. I hate stimulants, but that doesn't mean I can't get stuck like the rats and cocaine.
 
dl-Amp totally overrules , the easy mellow effects D-Amphetamine. If that is of any significance.

All illegal produced are probably dl- form, the dextro via prescription's.
 
L-methamphetamine is not psychoactive like L-amphetmine is.

L-methamphetamine is actually legal and sold as a decongestant over the counter.

When it comes to meth, there is only one isomer you want, dex. There are different impurities in modern meth, but calling it racemic is a misnomer.
Is it about blood-brain-barrier crossing abilities then?
 
Is it about blood-brain-barrier crossing abilities then?
No, L-meth does indeed cross the blood brain barrier, it just doesn't get you high. It only produces the physical effects of a stimulant such as vasoconstriction, tachycardia, etc.
 
No, L-meth does indeed cross the blood brain barrier, it just doesn't get you high. It only produces the physical effects of a stimulant such as vasoconstriction, tachycardia, etc.
I was still feeling dumb so I looked about it, levometh has no reuptake inhibitor quality like levoamph, probably that's why? Strictly selective releasers are not worth much what I have gathered.
 
While l-methamphetamine is psychoactive it isn't reinforcing, or at least not particularly reinforcing.

It is mostly a norepinephrine releasing agent, at around 15x the strength of its dopamine release. Thus, a DA/NE release ratio of around 15, which is similar to ephedrine -- which is perhaps slightly more specific of a NE releasing agent. By comparison, d-amphetamine has a DA/NE release ratio of around 3.5, and d-methamphetamine is around 2. Optimal for a recreational drug (at least in my estimation) is around 2 to 1.2 (independent of serotonergic activity). Because of this l-methamphetamine actually reduces the reinforcing effects of d-methamphetamine, so dl-methamphetamine is actually somewhat less reinforcing (although it is still very reinforcing even as a racemate).

So l-methamphetamine has pretty similar pharmacodynamics as ephedrine (which isn't surprising since they have virtually the same structure). I have never taken pure l-methamphetamine (though i probably should just out of curiosity), but I have taken alot of ephedrine, which is a fairly pleasant functional stimulant. On paper, l-methamphetamine appears as though it would perhaps be a bit more enjoyable than ephedrine.

As far as racemic meth as a substitute for d-amphetamine in the treatment of ADHD, I'd say it is inferior in most cases due the side-effect profile and abuse potential. I have tried racemic methamphetamine as a substitute for d-amphetamine for this purpose and found the quality of focus to be worse.

Yet even pure d-methamphetamine, which I've had in the form of desoxyn, felt inferior to d-amphetamine as an ADHD drug. I found desoxyn to have a dreamy, spacey quality to it that made me feel lethargic, cold and tired due to it's comparatively weak NE release and increased serotonergic activity. I tried it for a month and then said fuck it, particularly since my insurance refused to cover it (essentially saying, "nope, no way we're picking up the tab for your sack of meth bro") so I had to pay $400 out of pocket. Had they covered it i would have probably tried it for another month just for the sake of curiosity and given it's rarity.

In that sense I actually feel racemic meth might make a better ADHD med since the increased NE release helps offset the dreamy, spaced out effect of the serotonin release of the d-isomer. Overall, serotonin release makes ADHD worse, which was abundantly clear when I sampled 4-FEA, an amphetamine with highly specific serotonin releasing properties, which makes one feel very cold, tired and spaced out.

But ultimately, outside of this theoretical discussion, the real story here is that using meth, especially street meth, as an ADHD medication is in almost all cases a bad idea as it has a tendency to go south very quickly. Even pharmaceutical methamphetamine is generally worse due to the anti-therapeutic effects of serotonin release and associated increased neurotoxicity (when compared to d-amphetamine). Pharmaceutical d-methamphetamine may be better in unusual cases, like in patients with austism spectrum disorders or with behavioral issue, like to chill out the screaming kid that lays down on the floor at the supermarket and throws a tantrum. "Now come on Grayson, take your desoxyn"
 
I always wondered why Adderall included one racemic amphetamine salt. Heard people saying they combined different salts to create kind of a retard formula but I doubt it would work that way and given that in Europe they prescribed pure dexamph as well as the newer Vyvanse converters to straight d-amph I think it might have been just to get a patent and thus money. 💵
 
I always wondered why Adderall included one racemic amphetamine salt. Heard people saying they combined different salts to create kind of a retard formula but I doubt it would work that way and given that in Europe they prescribed pure dexamph as well as the newer Vyvanse converters to straight d-amph I think it might have been just to get a patent and thus money. 💵
In the US they have:

Dexedrine (100% Damp)
Adderall (75% Damp - 25% Lamp)
Evekeo ( 50% Damp - 50% Lamp)

I was prescribed evekeo once, but my insurance wouldn't cover it. It's new, came onto the market about 4 years ago. It's supposed to be more relaxing/physical high.

I've had tons of adderall and dex, but not true racemic amphetamine. I guess speed paste in EU is racemic, I think.
 
I recall reading on The Hive that l-meth has some ability to potentiate the d-meth. Also I seem to recall racemic lasting a bit longer..

So just out of curiosity.. How was the ketone reduced? :)

-GC
 
I recall reading on The Hive that l-meth has some ability to potentiate the d-meth. Also I seem to recall racemic lasting a bit longer..

So just out of curiosity.. How was the ketone reduced? :)

-GC

Yeah I have heard racemic meth referred to by that crowd as "prope-dope" due to the use of P2P in its synthesis, and some say that they preferred, particularly those that injected it since it produces a more pronounced rush upon injection. And I suppose if you are about to jump on your Harley and do a 10 hour ride with your Mongol biker buddies, racemic meth would be the one you'd want.
 
Yeah I have heard racemic meth referred to by that crowd as "prope-dope" due to the use of P2P in its synthesis, and some say that they preferred, particularly those that injected it since it produces a more pronounced rush upon injection. And I suppose if you are about to jump on your Harley and do a 10 hour ride with your Mongol biker buddies, racemic meth would be the one you'd want.

I’ve heard varying theories on the rush the old “prope-dope” used to give. Some say it’s due to leftover impurities/solvents. Whatever the case it seemed an aspect people enjoyed..

What if you want to dance for 10hrs straight? :)

I get you though, I’m sure priorities and what people want out of drugs has changed quite a bit over the past few decades. Or meth neurotoxicity is real…

-GC
 
Apparently Lmeth may be psychoactive on its own, but only in high dose IV. (important to note there is no citation on the wiki, could be false?), also says it lasted shorter, which contradicts reports of racemic meth lasting longer than pure Dmeth (?). I'm not sure what to think.

I've never IVd meth, nor is wikipedia the best source for this sort of stuff.

"In a study of psychoactive effects of levomethamphetamine, the intravenous administration of 0.5 mg/kg (but not 0.25 mg/kg) in recreational methamphetamine users produced scores of "drug liking" similar to racemic methamphetamine, but the effects were shorter lived.[citation needed] The study did not test the oral administration of levomethamphetamine. As of 2006, there were no studies demonstrating "drug liking" scores of oral levomethamphetamine that are similar to racemic methamphetamine or dextromethamphetamine in either recreational users or medicinal users.[5]"
 
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I’ve done L-Meth. It’s nasty. You get a stimmy effect but it lasts 3-4hrs maybe and isn’t euphoric at all.

I’ve also used it with MDMA, which seemed to work better in that there was synergy and boosted the roll for a bit. It’s these l-meth inhalers that I think got rollers started. Then eventually when the l-meth inhalers became rare, people transitioned without even realizing it.

I don’t think it’s much on its own but could play well with other amphetamines.

-GC
 
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