Tryptamines Kratom stop a trip on psilocybin and a few other questions that I couldn’t find an answer to on the web

[Juicewrldfan]

Hi Everyone,

I made a post way earlier but I realized I wrote an extremely long post and decided to try to slim it down some so I decided to delete it and start over.

I just have a few questions.

Does kratom stop a trip because it’s a 5ht2a antagonist? Or does it synergize? Does it depend when you take it? I heard if you take it at the same time as mushrooms that it will cause a rebound effect and synergize?

Will chamomile tea help with the come up if I have anxiety in the come up?

Will hydroxizine be beneficial or will it alter the trip? Safe?

Does having a fatty liver effect what dose you should take? I heard a doctor say that you need less if you have a compromised liver function. Is this true?

I have been scouring the web and blue light for these answers but I am getting mixed information. Thank you for all your help!

 

[Juicewrldfan]

So yesterday I dosed a fairly high dose of kratom about 2 hours before my trip. It did not seem to affect my trip in anyway. I also dosed a high dose of kratom on towards the end of my trip and it did not seem to stop the trip at all. So, I either have bunk kratom or kratom does not seem to interfere with the effects of psilocybin at least not in a very noticeable way. My peak seemed to last 4 hours and that's only off of 2 grams of psilocybin. Granted these are grown in a lab so they are very potent. It was an amazing experience. And I did not experience ANY anxiety this time. I am not sure if that was because of the kratom or if that was because I was in a good mood when I took them.

Anyway, I just thought I would share my experience. Kratom does not seem to stop trips. I took 1 gram of 50x black diamond extract powder and 6 grams of kratom powdered leaf 2 hours before the trip. I took 12 grams of kratom powder (chocolate indulgence) towards the end of my peak. Granted even though the vendor says its a 50x kratom extraction. I think its more likely 5x, if that. I doubt ill mess with extractions again. Too inconsistent.

Have a great day ya'll.

 

[Xorkoth]

Kratom definitely does not stop trips, in fact it combines very nicely with psychedelics. I don't believe a fatty liver will impact your dose of psychedelics. However, kratom can hard on the liver, at least for some people. it doesn't seem to affect everyone that way, but there are a number of reports of healthy people with no previous liver problems developing serious liver problems from kratom, in a relatively short amount of time. Personally, I have spent a total of about 10 years of my life addicted to kratom, dosing up to 100 grams a day, and it has never had any impact on my liver. But I'd be cautious if you already have liver issues.

Granted even though the vendor says its a 50x kratom extraction. I think its more likely 5x, if that. I doubt ill mess with extractions again. Too inconsistent.

Extracts can be really nice, if they're good, but they're outrageously expensive. Not in any way worth the money.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Kratom definitely does not stop trips, in fact it combines very nicely with psychedelics. I don't believe a fatty liver will impact your dose of psychedelics. However, kratom can hard on the liver, at least for some people. it doesn't seem to affect everyone that way, but there are a number of reports of healthy people with no previous liver problems developing serious liver problems from kratom, in a relatively short amount of time. Personally, I have spent a total of about 10 years of my life addicted to kratom, dosing up to 100 grams a day, and it has never had any impact on my liver. But I'd be cautious if you already have liver issues.



Extracts can be really nice, if they're good, but they're outrageously expensive. Not in any way worth the money.

Thanks for the feedback man. In regards to the extract I got, it was pretty cheap compared to most extracts I have seen which also causes me to question it. I mean I can't price it because of the rules, but it was about 5 times cheaper than other vendors and it was no way 50 grams to 1.

I am concerned about long term kratom use affecting the liver. I was changing to just making a tea and straining the the plant matter out, but what I was finding is that its much weaker this way. Maybe if I use the red bubble method it will be still good this way. I think all that plant matter isn't good for us. I am wanting to try to reduce my kratom intake to just a couple times a week, but I am just not there yet. Maybe I will start that Sunday. I personally have never experienced withdrawal from kratom, but I never used it this long before. I have been using it for about 2 months at what most would consider a high dose. So, I am interested to see if I do experience withdrawal this time. I used to use heavy opiates so i am just not sure that i will experience withdrawal from this, because I don't get an opiate buzz from it really, just a mild mood lift and sometimes stimulation akin to drinking a monster energy drink. Sorry for the run on sentences.

 

[Xorkoth]

Personally I get withdrawals VERY quickly from kratom, but I have spent a total of 9 or 10 years of my life addicted to kratom heavily, like up to 100 grams a day. Even after long breaks, I get withdrawals the first time I take it two days in a row or even take it twice in one day. Kratom is like... the first day or two after a long break, I get decent effects, it's nice, Then after that, I am just always either in withdrawal or on the edge of it, even right after I dose at the "peak" of the effects.

However when I was much younger, and just starting on it, I used to get wildly powerful opiate and stimulant effects from it. It came on like a train, almost like a cocaine rush, talking non stop and feeling loved up and energetic. And then after an hour it would fade into a strong, even sometimes nodding strong, opiate effect. I used to exclusive use crushed leaf and do the traditional method, which is lightly simmering the leaf for 20 minutes with a little acid, like citric acid, and then making another extraction the same way, straining out the leaf and throwing it away, and drinking it. I used a high dose, my first time was 10 grams and I felt incredible and threw up too, but after a while I was doing 16-18 grams in a dose. With the tea, you can dose higher without the dizzy/nauseous side effects, but I always smoked weed with it which was necessary to combat the nausea I would get. But I absolutely loved it. I don't know if kratom itself has changed (this was all back in 2002-2003, before hardly anyone knew what it was and before the fine powder was the norm). I remember the first time I ordered from my vendor and it was the micronized powder, the effects were so much less nice, but it was also more potent so I couldn't take as much.

It's probably just that my opiate receptors were virgins when I got into kratom... I'd just taken 5mg of hydrocodone a few times. But damn did it used to be different.

 

[Snafu in the Void]

Personally I get withdrawals VERY quickly from kratom, but I have spent a total of 9 or 10 years of my life addicted to kratom heavily, like up to 100 grams a day. Even after long breaks, I get withdrawals the first time I take it two days in a row or even take it twice in one day. Kratom is like... the first day or two after a long break, I get decent effects, it's nice, Then after that, I am just always either in withdrawal or on the edge of it, even right after I dose at the "peak" of the effects.

I've been experiencing this recently since I started using kratom off and on, after 8 years daily.

After a couple days of use I notice I wake up the next day quite depressed and anhedonic, with strong cravings, but not really any other withdrawal symptoms. It's not opioid withdrawal this time.

I was looking into some stuff and I believe it has something to do with how kratom effects dopamine. To me it feels similar to the depression after a meth binge, and the cravings I have feel like I'm craving adderall or something.

Unlike narcotics kratom does not raise dopamine with an acute dose, but repeated doses significantly raises dopamine in the frontal cortex.

Real time monitoring of dopamine release evoked by mitragynine (Kratom): An insight through electrochemical sensor - PubMed

Data from this study indicates that mitragynine significantly increased DA release when administered repeatedly, increased in DAT mRNA expression with the highest tested dose (30 mg/kg). Therefore, the rewarding effects observed after mitragynine administration could be due to its ability to...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Snafu in the Void]

To answer OP, like @Xorkoth mentioned kratom will not kill trips. It has a neutral or mildly synergistic effect. Mitragynine is a tryptamine derivative after all.

It seems to effect 5ht2a in a unique way from both psychedelics and antipsychotics.

I should note that I have experienced some unusual and significant side effects from combining kratom with antipsychotics. This may be my own unique brain chemistry, though.

 

[fastandbulbous]

No, the first aspect of kratoms effects are through adrenergic actions, which are going to make a trip more intense and prone to inducing anxiety. Eventually, mu & delta receptor effects will kick in,but you could have shi yourself, everal times, by that point...