Opioids Insulfate hydromorphone vs oxycodone bioavailability

[ChiefJared]

New here, just curious as to what’s the best option for taking dilaudid (hydromorphone) insulfation or taken orally and the same thing for oxycodone and what the dosage differences between the two are and which would produce a “nicer” euphoria/effect in your opinion?

 

[Jabberwocky]

hello and welcome to bluelight!

for dilaudid the insuflation has a higher oral bioailability, but with oxycodone oral has a higher BA, intranasal oxy may have a faster onset which gives the impression of a rush but that's it, the roa still weak compared to oral oxy.

oral hydromorphone has a very weak oral bioavailability, give me 2 sec and i'll get some links for you

hope you'll stick around and enjoy the community!

Maximum plasma concentrations were 3.69 and 3.38 mug/L for treatments B and C, respectively. Mean (% coefficient of variation) bioavailability of intranasal hydromorphone was 54.4% (34.8) and 59.8% (22.1) with and without pretreatment, respectively. Pretreatment of rhinitis did not significantly affect the rate or extent of absorption of hydromorphone in this study.

this is the intranasal hydro BA info by ncbi. if you want I can get the oxy links too, but I assure you oral oxy has a higher BA than intranasal.

 

[ChiefJared]

hello and welcome to bluelight!

for dilaudid the insuflation has a higher oral bioailability, but with oxycodone oral has a higher BA, intranasal oxy may have a faster onset which gives the impression of a rush but that's it, the roa still weak compared to oral oxy.

oral hydromorphone has a very weak oral bioavailability, give me 2 sec and i'll get some links for you

hope you'll stick around and enjoy the community!

this is the intranasal hydro BA info by ncbi. if you want I can get the oxy links too, but I assure you oral oxy has a higher BA than intranasal.

Thanks man! I am sticking around I used blue light before but never made an account, so stick to insulfsting dilaudid and orally taking oxy

 

[Jabberwocky]

Yeah, that's the best way for both, chew the oxy if you want a faster onset and no problem we are here to help anytime, enjoy the community

 

[Jabberwocky]

Also, this thread may interest you: https://www.bluelight.org/xf/threads/question-about-dilauded-8mg.877413/#post-14608609 especially jekyl's post which say that for hydro nasal is 56% oral 10% to 65% and rectal 33%

 

[ChiefJared]

Also, this thread may interest you: https://www.bluelight.org/xf/threads/question-about-dilauded-8mg.877413/#post-14608609 especially jekyl's post which say that for hydro nasal is 56% oral 10% to 65% and rectal 33%

Thanks

 

[Deecamps]

hello and welcome to bluelight!

for dilaudid the insuflation has a higher oral bioailability, but with oxycodone oral has a higher BA, intranasal oxy may have a faster onset which gives the impression of a rush but that's it, the roa still weak compared to oral oxy.

oral hydromorphone has a very weak oral bioavailability, give me 2 sec and i'll get some links for you

hope you'll stick around and enjoy the community!

this is the intranasal hydro BA info by ncbi. if you want I can get the oxy links too, but I assure you oral oxy has a higher BA than intranasal.

What is BA? (New here)

 

[Jabberwocky]

Bioavailability

 

[Oxymuncher]

Bump. How can rectal be lower since it's the same membrane (blood barrier) entry mechanism rectally, Both the nose and anus have thin lining that readily absorbs chemicals and drugs that are suited for snorting (insufflation). Therefore it follows that given the larger membrane in the anus, it would be higher there; no?

 

[morphonorconic]

The respective BA's would go oxycodone P.O. > oxy I.N. > hydromorphone I.N. > hydromorph P.O. - barring any influencing factors to like hepatic enzyme deficiency or a compromised BBB which could affect normal metabolism and pharmacokinetics.

Hydromorphone is wasted if not utilized via parenteral ROA. Oxycodone is fun to snort, in the twilight years anyway, but the novelty wears off for most who opt for the superior absorption and practicality with oral admin.

 

[MsDiz]

Bump. How can rectal be lower since it's the same membrane (blood barrier) entry mechanism rectally, Both the nose and anus have thin lining that readily absorbs chemicals and drugs that are suited for snorting (insufflation). Therefore it follows that given the larger membrane in the anus, it would be higher there; no?

Hydromorphone is incredibly hard to place when it comes to bioavailability. I have found studies that give a wide range of BA results. I couldn’t place it for you and no one else really can either. Although the estimations given are the thereabouts of it.

It’s your own personal experience it seems to me with this drug. @hydroazuanacaine would probably say the same.

 

[copium7777]

Hydromorphone is incredibly hard to place when it comes to bioavailability. I have found studies that give a wide range of BA results. I couldn’t place it for you and no one else really can either. Although the estimations given are the thereabouts of it.

It’s your own personal experience it seems to me with this drug. @hydroazuanacaine would probably say the same.

Interested in knowing more about the different ranges of bioavailability for each route since I just got prescribed dilaudid from oxycodone, since my prescription was switched to dilaudid and unlike oxycodone dilaudid has poor oral biovalibility. When I was in hospital I got IV dilaudid which worked very well for my pain, so if it is equally analgesic as my previous dose of oxycodone it doesn't seem like much of an improvement but if I can safely nassaly or rectaly or (I'm not going to but pills in my veins nor do I know how to IV anything) but if one can up the bioavailability by taking it nasally or rectally it would be worth it because I have very bad pain.

 

[copium7777]

I can't find hard numbers for the range of bioavailability of oral versus other types of ROA hydromorphone besides IV or subcutaneous

 

[copium7777]

It sewms like even Oral bioavailability varies widely. If I knew why , I could change absorption. If its an enzyme that's one thing, could inhibit enzyme. If its related to fat or something I could take fat

 

[Oxymuncher]

Interested in knowing more about the different ranges of bioavailability for each route since I just got prescribed dilaudid from oxycodone, since my prescription was switched to dilaudid and unlike oxycodone dilaudid has poor oral biovalibility. When I was in hospital I got IV dilaudid which worked very well for my pain, so if it is equally analgesic as my previous dose of oxycodone it doesn't seem like much of an improvement but if I can safely nassaly or rectaly or (I'm not going to but pills in my veins nor do I know how to IV anything) but if one can up the bioavailability by taking it nasally or rectally it would be worth it because I have very bad pain.

Doctors are VERY lacking in knowledge around pharmacology, it's why when I specialize I will go into clinical pharmacology. What they should have done is convert your dose via a potency chart (hydro vs oxy is 1:3 I think), so they should have divided your dose by 3 then applied a roughly 15% cross-tolerance reduction.......

BUT THEN, a final step nearly every doctor in the UK/US forgets to then do. Is adjust for pharmacodynamics and pharmacokinetics! Aka, the BA being so low! The potency tables don't take that into account. If I were your doctor/in the future when more clin pharm doctors are out there, this stage will happen. You should go back to your doctor and explain it isn't working as well and you believe it's due to its poor oral availability, maybe ask to switch to oxymorphone.

 

[Oxymuncher]

Just a quick note, you could leave your pills in a drink like coke or something relatively acidic overnight so you have an instant release hydromorphone liquid , heat it up to speed up the process but be careful with the temperature not going over around 70C. I did an experiment with all the different ROA, (the rectal route was the dissolved liquid, the oral route was tested with both a whole tablet and also the liquid I described. The liquid worked FAR better orally, but the rectal ROA was extremely effective).

That said, as you have effectively a semi-infinite supply maybe try dissolving 3 pills or so tonight and shake it up tomorrow then drink it slowly throughout the day! Just be careful to not drink it in one!

 

[Coffeeshroom]

Hydromorphone:
Bioavailability
Oral 51.35% +/- 29.29% | Insufflated 52.4% | Rectal 36.33% +/- 29.6%

Oxycodone:
Bioavailability
Oral 60-87% | Insufflated 55-70%

Those are sum general stats of the two for bioavailability

 

[Oxymuncher]

The +/- there is so important, for me personally it's on the lower end. my clinical pharmacologist knows his stuff when it comes to this, I was given hydromorphone in hospital as they didn't have oxycodone on hand (was rushed in due to MRI images being horrific), he came down and ordered 2.6mg every hour until pain relief is achieved.

 

[Bigwavedave2u]

New here, just curious as to what’s the best option for taking dilaudid (hydromorphone) insulfation or taken orally and the same thing for oxycodone and what the dosage differences between the two are and which would produce a “nicer” euphoria/effect in your opinion?

Having experience in both drugs following 4 multilevel spine surgeries and being flat on my back and awash in boredom my results are this:
Dilaudid snorting is a no go and a waste of a good prescription. Crush and drink with liquid.
Oxycodone will generally provide a much better high when also crushed to powder and swallowed with your beverage. Try also swallowing whole pills of ibuprofen. I've found that for me this increases the high. Each person is different so tread lightly. It's not a waste of product to start small to see what works best for your body. This is not based on science but is founded in sheer boredom. Good luck. I end this with a little humor

What does it taste like when you go down on an 80 year old person??

Depends

 

[Dextro .45]

Dilaudid (Hydromorphone) is best taken in an oral syringe, inserted into rectum 3/4 length of your pinky finger, push in plunger and lay for few min on bed. Pulverize Dilaudid tablets or XR beads into fine powder, hot or warm water I used from tap ….just a ml or a 1.3 because all the excipients will reduce the original water volume slightly

Dilaudid is VERY water soluble, and best suited for IV/IM/SC injection (professional pharmaceutical injectable solution/vials/compounding powder HM Forte HP.

Orally is a waste with 70% being destroyed by first pass metabolism (30% oral bioavailability)


Oxycodone is the most euphoric opioid analgesic I’ve ever experienced, out shining IV Dilaudid and illicit Heroin of very good quality. Oxycodone taken orally 80% bioavailability and has stimulant like properties as apposed to the sleepy sedative Morphine qualities of other opioids.

Oxycodone take orally A+++ (Oxycodone 10mg & Ritalin 20mg both IR taken together by a naive user, best pharmaceutical grade, safe Oral Speedball you could have the pleasure of experiencing) the only 2 drugs to ever give me significant pleasurable dopaminergic opioid+stimulant euphoria) just pure fckn sex that combo.

HM taken rectal administration for maximum bioavailability (if you ain’t injecting oral tablets which is/can be very dangerous, and landed me in the hospital for endocarditis/inflammation of the heart from all the excipients/bulking agents in oral tablets)