Fentanyl to Suboxone.

[FentGirl23]

Hey guys. I have been a lurker on blue light for ages and ages, but never made an account. I'm here today to ask a question about Suboxone use after a year of moderate Fentanyl use. I used my last big dose of Fentanyl Wednesday around 5PM, but I have done very small bumps here and there(I'm talking match head sized compared to my normal dime sized amount) the last bump I did was about 30 to 32 hours ago just to relieve the RLS enough to sleep. I didn't feel anything at all and still had RLS, but not as bad as before. Right now I am experiencing dilated pupils, hot/cold sweats, pain in my legs, I can't sit still, diarrhea, extreme fatigue, nausea, goosebumps, and yawning/sneezing about 3-10 times an hour. When I check my COWS scores it states that I am in moderate withdrawal. I want to take enough Sub just to be able to sleep a few hours, but I don't want to go into precipitated WD. I mean, I don't think I would because of how sick I already am, but I still worry. I just don't want to end up any sicker than I already am. I figured I'd consider some people's input before taking some Sub. I want to take the smallest amount possible just to be able to sleep tonight. Thanks for your input

 

[Pickledlemons]

Hey guys. I have been a lurker on blue light for ages and ages, but never made an account. I'm here today to ask a question about Suboxone use after a year of moderate Fentanyl use. I used my last big dose of Fentanyl Wednesday around 5PM, but I have done very small bumps here and there(I'm talking match head sized compared to my normal dime sized amount) the last bump I did was about 30 to 32 hours ago just to relieve the RLS enough to sleep. I didn't feel anything at all and still had RLS, but not as bad as before. Right now I am experiencing dilated pupils, hot/cold sweats, pain in my legs, I can't sit still, diarrhea, extreme fatigue, nausea, goosebumps, and yawning/sneezing about 3-10 times an hour. When I check my COWS scores it states that I am in moderate withdrawal. I want to take enough Sub just to be able to sleep a few hours, but I don't want to go into precipitated WD. I mean, I don't think I would because of how sick I already am, but I still worry. I just don't want to end up any sicker than I already am. I figured I'd consider some people's input before taking some Sub. I want to take the smallest amount possible just to be able to sleep tonight. Thanks for your input

Hey FentGirl. I have lots of experience switching between fentanyl and suboxone. I find with fentanyl you dont even have to wait the full 24 hours. In my experience, 12 hours is usually enough. if you havent used any fentanyl in 32 hours, well first of all you must feel like absolute shit... But you should be more than safe to start taking the subs. The most important rule with them is that you be in withdrawal before taking them. thats more important than time. You will probably have to take between 2 - 8mg to feel better. So start small and work your way up. Good luck.

 

[FentGirl23]

Yep. Feeling like total shit. Honestly, I am used to the sub pills from back in the day about 8 years ago so I don't even know how to dose this strip. It's 2 little strips off a 12mg sub strip a friend gave me. I am assuming each strip is between 1-2mg. I am only wanting to take enough to take the edge off so I can sleep a few hours. Would half of one of these strips be a good starting point? I am like 5 days into the Fent WD, but still feeling like total crap. I have gone through WD from various opiates including an almost 4 year methadone program, but this Fent is totally kicking my ass. They say Methadone is one of the worst, but the Fent to me is god awful. It's so acute and intense. I'm hoping for it to subside soon

 

[Pickledlemons]

Yep. Feeling like total shit. Honestly, I am used to the sub pills from back in the day about 8 years ago so I don't even know how to dose this strip. It's 2 little strips off a 12mg sub strip a friend gave me. I am assuming each strip is between 1-2mg. I am only wanting to take enough to take the edge off so I can sleep a few hours. Would half of one of these strips be a good starting point? I am like 5 days into the Fent WD, but still feeling like total crap. I have gone through WD from various opiates including an almost 4 year methadone program, but this Fent is totally kicking my ass. They say Methadone is one of the worst, but the Fent to me is god awful. It's so acute and intense. I'm hoping for it to subside soon

I'm not familiar with the strips, I used the pills too. But I would assume you would want approx 1/6th of a whole strip to start.

 

[FentGirl23]

I'm not familiar with the strips, I used the pills too. But I would assume you would want approx 1/6th of a whole strip to start.

I think both tiny strips I had were about 1/6 of a full 12mg strip. Anyway, I ended up taking a bit over half of one of those and I feel so much better. Seriously. Even the leg pain has mostly subsided. It feels strange not having that rapid WD heart beat after like 5 days of Fent WD. I could feel my heart beating out of my chest and now it's like I have no heart beat at all since I got so used to that crap. Lol. I can't believe how well such a small amount works for the Fent WD. I used to take an 8MG sub pill for heroin WD and it wouldn't help this much. Hopefully this means I'm towards the end stages of the Fent WD since it took such a miniscule amount of sub to stabilize. I really appreciate you getting back to me so soon and easing my mind. I would of been going psycho laying in bed thrashing around all night trying to get comfy to no avail without your reassurance. I was so scared of the precipitated WD since this is my first time kicking Fent, so you're a total life saver. Thanks to you easing my mind I'm off to eat and drink while I can thanks!

 

[Trabbamab]

Buprenorphine (the main, bio-available drug in Suboxone when taken properly under the tongue) is an odd little opioid. Its dose-response curve (how much of the drug you take for how much effect) looks very strange. Most of the time, the more dose you take, the more you feel. Not so with Suboxone. It begins to have a slight counter-effect to itself when taken in larger doses. This is one of the reasons it is difficult to "dial in" a user's proper Suboxone dose. Take too much and you still won't have opiate WDs, but you will get a host of pretty nasty side effects from a pounding headache, dizziness, upset stomach and no typical opioid effects at all. But then a user takes 50% of that dose or possibly even less and has a much more pleasant experience. It sounds like you have centered in on what a good dose is for you.

Do you have plans for where to go from here, FentGirl? Can you get more Suboxone and do a taper? Keep in mind that both doctors and methadone clinics can write and distribute Suboxone so you could consider getting a legit supply to taper effectively with. But having just a small amount of Suboxone to hold off the WDs for a day or two may not be the best option to try to kick long term.

 

[FentGirl23]

Well, today I am like 6 or 7 days into the fent WD process. Unfortunately I don't have insurance and I can't afford to see a doc. I was only planning on using the sub for a day or two to help with the worst of the Fent WD. I barely took any sub today, maybe .0125MG and I am feeling pretty fine. Luckily I waited until the Fent WD was literally unbearable to start taking the subs because I don't want to end up trading one dependency for another. Since I have taken such a small amount of sub and only last night and this evening(maybe 1.5MG to 2MG total) I should be fine to stop the sub tomorrow and see how I feel right? Or did taking the sub set me back a ways? I was thinking the Fent coming out of my system was going to be the hardest part. I have tried suboxone and methadone programs at clinics in the past and I honestly do not want to go that route this time around. I feel like the worst is over so it would be pointless to run to a clinic again seeing as sub and methadone never helped with cravings even when I capped off at 120mg methadone and 36mg sub in the past. For me they only work to alleviate WD symptoms and would cause more consequences to get on one and pay craploads of money in cash when I'm so far through the WD process. I actually liked the sub this time though. I wish I could afford it or a naltrexone implant. Maybe when I get insurance again

 

[Pickledlemons]

Sub will prolong your wds but it wont be as bad as the first time. 36mg of sub is a lot.. sub actually feels better at low doses because it frees up some of the receptors for a full agonist metabolite of itself ( cant remember the name ).

Hope everything works out for you!

 

[Trabbamab]

Sub will prolong your wds but it wont be as bad as the first time. 36mg of sub is a lot.. sub actually feels better at low doses because it frees up some of the receptors for a full agonist metabolite of itself ( cant remember the name ).

Hope everything works out for you!

I agree. Actually, I personally think Suboxone is horrible at doses of 16mg or higher. You keep continuously saturating your receptors so you don't get any traditional opioid effects but the side-effects are magnified. 8mg and lower is what has always worked best for me. I actually felt a much better effect of off 4mg than 8mg.

 

[FentGirl23]

Yes, I do wish I would of stayed on the minimum doses possible, but unfortunately I am a rapid metabolizer and once I got used to my new dose I'd be in WD again before my next 24 hour dose. So the clinic kept upping my dose and upping my dose telling me that eventually it would hold me over once I found my sweet spot. It never did hold me over which is insane. I could of done the peak and trough testing to qualify for a Methadone dose higher than 120mg, but it wasn't worth the hassle to me. Plus it would of been pure hell going any higher. I was already sleeping tons, getting fat, no sex drive, no social life, etc. Any higher than 120mg for a 110 lb girl would of been insane. Still dealing with the Fent WD by the way. It's insane how long it lasts!! Everyone says Methadone is the worst opiate to detox from and it takes the longest, but it wasn't nearly as acute and intense as the Fent is. I am on day 11 or 12 I believe. I used subs for 2 days around day 4 or 5 to get through the worst of it and now I'm just trying to ride it out. No nausea anymore, just my least favorite part, the restless leg feeling all over my body plus the insomnia/mental instability. I'm hoping that will clear up within a couple more days. Staying hopeful over here. I feel like I am starting to feel feelings that I haven't felt in the 1-1.5 years I've been on Fent/H straight so that's a good sign even if it's uncomfortable. Might try to catch a meeting soon since I've been going stir crazy at the house. Meetings don't do much for me, but it's a chance to get out. Hope all is well with you guys

 

[Pickledlemons]

I agree fent withdrawal is the worst. I was under the impression that it was shorter than other opiates although I dont know that from experience because it was so bad I've never gone longer than a day without caving or switching to a different substance. Benzos really help but can be more addicting than opiates...

You've made it over a week so it should be getting better from here. Congrats youre doing a great job and good luck.