Misc Diphendidine ( and other diarylethylamines) antagdonized/canceled out by BZD"s

[DiacetylEros]

Hey all, I'm making my 2nd post, hopefully in the correct sub-forum. My question is to a) people with experience with diphenidine (or MXP), and b) people who currently take benzodiazepines concurrently and if they experience diminished effects (or require higher doses) from this class of drugs diphenidine belongs to (diarylethylamines). I recently ordered 1,000mg of diphenidine and consumed it, but being that i have a very large tolerance to BZD's.; roughly 150-200mg diazepam equivalent either conventional benzos (alprazolam and clonazepam), or RC's (diclazepam, etizolam, and clonazolam)... I know, I'm hooked to the gills so please no commenting/suggesting to taper/quit, I am in the process using the Ashton Manual only substituting diaz for diclaz... Point is I realize the perils I face with such dosing. Back to my question, are diarylethylamines (like diphenidine and MXP) antagonized or otherwise cancelled out by BZD'S (clonazepam and alprazolam specifically), as well as TDP's (i think that's what you would call them, but i mean etizolam specifically) by these chems? I ask cos during my research I noticed that I either needed 3x dose of diphenidine (for a "heavy" dose according to a credible site) while on benz/eti (I am heavily physically dependant on these compounds so "low" dosing frightens me, typicallly take 80-150+ diazepam equivalent as stated before makes me feel safe from seizing... 5mg diazepam ARE sugar pills to me, I would horrify some people if they saw me with a bottle of diazepam 5's lol/not lol/really not lol.... So, my main and true question is have any other heavy, or even moderate-light (2-4mg alprazolam equiv) users of BZD's experiences a blocking effects when attempting to dose diarylethylamines like diphenidine, mxp, etc? PS - all dosing was done oral (cos you can't shoot/snort Diphenidine, only vape, and FUCK THAT!!!), my least preffered method. Has anyone who has done MXP (which you can bang and sniff) on high-dose benzo's, preferably IV/IM (the MXP), AND had any success, or at least partially so? I ask cos this class of chems is intriguing in the same way as arylcyclohexamines (but to a much lesser degree) at the same time Blanket ans are a cold hard bitch.. but it's not like the internet is the sole source of compounds lol Anyways, any help, or experience with both especially, would be tremendously helpful, or anyone with a strong chemistry background who could explain the concurrent use of diarylethylamines and bzd's and how they effect each others' input would be invaluable. Thanks Peace Harmony and Chemistry

 

[DiacetylEros]

sorry for misspelling antagonized... i feel moronic.

 

[DiacetylEros]

sorry for misspelling antagonized... i feel moronic.

 

[Phoenix_rising]

I believe that these new diarylethylamines have nothing on arylcyclohexamines,even if you had a benzo habit you still got fucked,taking diazepam actually increases the effects of Ketamine,so if these arylcyclohexamine replacements had any power then they would work through the benzos.
Dont kid yourself and blame yourself for having a benzo tolerance,they just domt work very well even without benzos.

 

[DiacetylEros]

I hear you that they are totally different in terms of chemistry, diarethylamines are psycho-stimulants, why arylcyclohexamines don't possess these properties, and many have depressant properties (the good ones anyway ). The reason that I posted this question to begin with was because on a day I had chosen to take a minute (for me 2.5mg clonazepam..) dose of benzos, I ingested around 330mg of diphenidine (aka a fuckton), and it did indeed work my friends, so much so that the all-encompassing "Fear" set in, as I was fully dissociated 1.5hrs post dose and was beginning to experience the death of the ego (I think, I've never truly experienced it, but it felt like I wasn't me nor anyone else). This incited a fear-reaction in me and I immediately took a 10mg sublingual dose of etizolam, and within 20minutes, i was me again. The trip was literally cancelled out, like how you hear about chlorpromazine (thorazine) is supposed to do with LSD trips, whether myth or fact. 30 minutes post etizolam the only diphenidine effects I experienced were slight analgesia/anaesthesia in my lower extremities and a couple other peripheral effects. it was quite odd, and thats why I decided to pose this question, particularly to my fellow benzo heads that have had any expereience with diarethylamines and benzodiazepines concurrently.

I aint blaming the benzo's brotha, "but the "evidence" (wont say proof just yet lol) was def in the pudding".

 

[manboychef]

It could have been the derealization or depersonalization that comes along with BZD, and TZD withdrawals. When I was abusing diazepam in high doses 100-200mg at a rip, when I finally stopped and dropped my dose extremely quickly to 1mg xanax I felt like I was someone completely different...I mean like different personality, experiences, viewpoints. I don't know if this has anything to do with it.

Keep working on that ashton manual my friend. You may want to stay clear of other substances till you can reign in your BZD dependence. Once you get down to a manageable level, I would say give this compound another chance.

 

[acidbaby]

Where's Fastandbulous when we need him? That guy knows more about arylcyclohexylamines than the Dos Equuis guy.......

 

[DiacetylEros]

Solid advice about sticking to the Ashton and getting down somewhere reasonable before more experimentation manboychef, props bro, that's what I have to do for safeties sake. Anyways, I'm pretty much only user of cannabis, benzos, and buprenorphine. Copping the diphenidine was more of a want for a novel experience rather than the usual bupe and benzos, just wanting to try something different... But I really don't think it was the BZD W/d's for the simple fact that I was extremely calm pre and post trip (and therefor not withdrawing, I'm sure I had enough residual diclazepam as it's HL is ~42 hrs, and i had taken some the day previous), and when I say trip I really mean it, full anesthesia, "space walking", fat tongue making speech difficult. By the point I had gotten "the fear", I remember this sensation rights as I reached for my eti/ppg concoction, it was almost as if i was leaving the room, or like the rooms walls were opening up to the world, the walls and room "changing". idk what to make of this.. and won't until I do as suggested and taper down from a mutant to human dose, or get off entirely the bzd/tzd's. At that point I would like to experiment with diphenidine again, if only to see if my hypothesis holds weight, but also cos it does have some (limited) potential I think.
Does anybody know off hand if phenethylamines are antagonized, or otherwise effected by bzd's? I would think with my limited knowledge of chemistry that arylethylamines are somewhat related. The diphenidine definitely raised my HR and BP, and I've never encountered that with K, the only arylcyclohexylamine with which I have had extensive experience with.

 

[sekio]

I've not had BZDs reduce the effects of dissociatives. In fact if anything they should potentiate the amnesic/anesthetic properties.

 

[DiacetylEros]

That's what I was thinking, cos I've known people, 3 unfortunately... die of respiratory depression from the ket-opiate combo. Btw and sorry to be off topic, but I'm really digging the Gendo Ikari avatatar, sekio. Love NGE, and love how when the shit hit the fans with an angel attack Gendo would be sitting right like that, hands together, calm and collected. Super badass.

But, It was unexpected but as I said earlier the diphenidine had a lot of stimulant properties I never experienced with K nor MXE, that's why I posed the phenethylamines question, as I understand most of those compounds to be paycho-stimulants. To me diphenidine was like a scary mix of an NMDA Antagonist and a paycho-stimulant the one time it worked and I freaked out.

And I should've posted this originally for HR sake, but 300+ mg is NOT a safe dose. People who respond normally to diphenidine have reported 'holing out' at doses between 120-200mg. I took that much cos my first two attempts with it produced nada, doing 70mg the first time plus 30mg a few hrs later, and then the second attempt I took 150mg all at once. The third attempt was the trip described in my previous posts.