Dilaudid vs. Oxycodone

[AbsolutDoc]

Hi all. I hope thisnis in the right place. Returning member.
I have been on:
oxycodone 10mg 3x/day
Oxycontin 10mg 2x/day
I kicked the Contin...didnt last 12 hours and to dependent. The IR's i can juggle easier.
now I incorporate
Advil 2 - 2pills wx/day (the shit works!)
Especially since I get almost zero relief from oxy.
I was snorting oxy a lot. Until I realized it was all mental and didn't provide actual relief.

I was prescribed Dilaudid 8mg 3x/day after a surgery. I cut them and ate 4mg when I was expecting some heavy stuff. I crush and snort a little here and there. Before major social and a little.before sleep. I have the chance to get it again....

My point is/questions are:
I've been on the oxy for 8 years. I take them NOT to feel shitty instead of actual pain relief. My doctor offersd to switch me to Dilaudid 8mg 3x/day again. I feel like a million bucks on half 4mg.
So... is that a good idea? I.have some oxy as reserved in case I might need them... but I shouldn't right?
And also I've heard that Dilaudid is more bio effective intra nasal. Or is the same as oral.
And... I tend to suck and chew my oxy's... is that considered Oral? Or does oral refer to swallowed and better ingested route?
And one for the greatest points of my day is sucking on advil 2's.... is that wasting the actual pain relief? Am I just falling for a mental effect?
Thanks to anyone Still reading and responding.
Sorry again if this is the wrong place. I tired to absorb the rules.
Thanks all.
-Doc
Is there a better route I'm not thinking of?
I'm open to plugging, NOT IV.

 

[axe battler]

Oxy has quite a high BA so chewing or sucking or just swallowing the IR pills is giving you like 85% ba. Snorting oxy only gives around 60%.
Conversely hydromorphone (dilaudid) has quite a poor oral ba but if you snort them or plug them the ba is way higher. I've never had the pleasure of trying hydro being in the UK but I hear they hit hard but are quite short-lived. Though saying that oxy doest last very long either.
Maybe you could switch for a while and see how it goes. Ask the doctor if you can switch back if it doesn't go well.

 

[jasperkent]

Don't snort pills.
Ever.
Wasteful, short-lived, stupid.
Swallow em, chew em up, maybe figure out a way to plug em.
And shooting em is unnecessarily risky.

Personally, I like oxycodone better than Dilaudid. YMMV.

 

[AbsolutDoc]

Don't snort pills.
Ever.
Wasteful, short-lived, stupid.
Swallow em, chew em up, maybe figure out a way to plug em.
And shooting em is unnecessarily risky.

Personally, I like oxycodone better than Dilaudid. YMMV.

I want to know what stupid is specifically and make my choice from there. I think this site revolves around not judgement, but facts.
Are you saying it's stupid because pills have more bioAV as intended?
Or it's stupid because you think it's risky.
Have you snorted and found less effects?
or just becuase you think its a gate not to open.
Ive snorted C, H, vitamin b12....

I've heard countless times that Dilaudid has better Bio intranasal then oral.
I appreciate your concern, but I'm looking for facts.
Have you tried plugging? The way you said maybe leads me to believe you think that's a better route.
Thanks for your input!
-Doc

Don't snort pills.
Ever.
Wasteful, short-lived, stupid.
Swallow em, chew em up, maybe figure out a way to plug em.
And shooting em is unnecessarily risky.

Personally, I like oxycodone better than Dilaudid. YMMV.

Oxy has quite a high BA so chewing or sucking or just swallowing the IR pills is giving you like 85% ba. Snorting oxy only gives around 60%.
Conversely hydromorphone (dilaudid) has quite a poor oral ba but if you snort them or plug them the ba is way higher. I've never had the pleasure of trying hydro b

Don't snort pills.
Ever.
Wasteful, short-lived, stupid.
Swallow em, chew em up, maybe figure out a way to plug em.
And shooting em is unnecessarily risky.

Personally, I like oxycodone better than Dilaudid. YMMV.

eing in the UK

Oxy has quite a high BA so chewing or sucking or just swallowing the IR pills is giving you like 85% ba. Snorting oxy only gives around 60%.
Conversely hydromorphone (dilaudid) has quite a poor oral ba but if you snort them or plug them the ba is way higher. I've never had the pleasure of trying hydro being in the UK but I hear they hit hard but are quite short-lived. Though saying that oxy doest last very long either.
Maybe you could switch for a while and see how it goes. Ask the doctor if you can switch back if it doesn't go well.

but I hear they hit hard but are quite short-lived. Though saying that oxy doest last very long either.
Maybe you could switch for a while and see how it goes. Ask the doctor if you can switch back if it doesn't go well.

Thanks for your feedback Axe. That's what I heard about Dilaudid.
So when people say on here. "Oral" they mean chewing and sucking is ok?
Because I know things like Tylenol or Para-something in the UK is better through digestion.
I remember girls snorting Tylenol PM after a 36 hour bender of blow and I'm just like:
No, you're just gumming up your nasal cavities. LOL.
But somethings are mental I guess.
But I really appreciate what you and everyone is doing here.
I was a mod for a kink website... it can be fun, but it's more work than people realize.
Cheers
Is there a space I can post about if anyone has experience with addiction to the smell of Home heating oil (kerosene) or is that taboo?

Also, to address what you said about hydro... when I suck and chew them, it still takes me almost an hour before I'm fully pain free. And I'm good for a solid 4 hours.
Snorting, I usually do little pecks.
I use a contacts case, it has rounded edges and a right seal. Ill have oxy sometimes cut with B12 on the green side and straight Dilaudid on the other.
i dip my finger in and pop.
but when theyre lines, its more of a disembodied feeling where if i sit after running them, im sitting for a good while letting it wash over.
if im in the middle of a project or actively doing something and STAY doing something, im super high function and have a bounce in my step I haven't had in years.
I really think discussing this out loud has helped me understand what I might need.
Thanks Axe!

Don't snort pills.
Ever.
Wasteful, short-lived, stupid.
Swallow em, chew em up, maybe figure out a way to plug em.
And shooting em is unnecessarily risky.

Personally, I like oxycodone better than Dilaudid. YMMV.

Don't snort pills.
Ever.
Wasteful, short-lived, stupid.
Swallow em, chew em up, maybe figure out a way to plug em.
And shooting em is unnecessarily risky.

Personally, I like oxycodone better than Dilaudid. YMMV.

 

[axe battler]

Yeah sucking or chewing the pills would still be oral as your still swallowing the drug but defeating the time release mechanism of the pill. I suppose you'd be getting some of it sublingually and buccally but it's still mainly oral.

I'm not sure what JK means by saying snorting dillys is stupid as the ba is higher than with oral. Plugging is apparently even better and you don't risk talcosis from getting small amounts of pill fillers in your lungs, which is the biggest risk AFAIK.

 

[jasperkent]

I'm not sure what JK means by saying snorting dillys is stupid as the ba is higher than with oral. Plugging is apparently even better and you don't risk talcosis from getting small amounts of pill fillers in your lungs, which is the biggest risk AFAIK.

I did not know that about Dilaudid.
I do know that with other pills the onset is faster but the duration is shorter. Personally I prefer a longer-lasting high over a rush.
YMMV

PS-- Also, most pills contain fillers and binders. I don't like that crap clogging up my nose. And pills like Percocet have acetaminophen, which I also don't want in my nasal cavities.

 

[Dextro .45]

Oxycodone- more stimulating euphoric energy, taken orally (Great oral bioavailability), amazing opioid analgesic that in its original patent for Eukadol (Oxycodone) mentions a profound euphoria and a side effect profile very similar to Cocaine, being stimulant like euphoria

Dilaudid (Hydromorphone) is a very potent morphine ester causing much more sedation than Oxy and has piss poor oral bioavailability, roughly 70% or oral dose is destroyed by first pass metabolism. Often administered IV/IM in hospital setting.

10mg Morphine
5mg Oxycodone
2mg Hydromorphone

 

[SHarp153]

I'm a writer. I do mostly paranormal romance stuff. In my current project, I have introduced a love interest werewolf-like character. He's a drug dealer and he is interacting with a lot of users and dealers, and I am not absolutely sure about a couple things. This may noy be the right thread, but I saw it was talking about the two specific opiates that the first issue is about.
1. I know dudes who have gotten high(er) off pills by inserting them in their rear. Does this get you high faster than oral consumption? Could a female character instert a pill or substance vaginally to get high? I'd assume the amount blood vessels in the vagina would make it work, but has anyone ever witnessed or known someone who did it?
2. If a human adult female was taking about 10mg of oxycodone every 6hrs for 5 days, would they suffer physical withdrawal when they were cut off cold turkey? I know psychological addiction can occur in as little as 72 hours, but Is 5 days enough time to become addicted physically to the point of the puking and diarrhea and hallucinations after stopping?
3. Is snorting an opioid pill better than rectal insertion as far as bio-availability.
4. Do people ever just let oxycodone pills dissolve under the tongue? What is the effect in comparison to oral and snorting?

Thanks in advanc

 

[WellTram]

Go for hydromorphone, much stronger and better than oxy or morphine. I was smoking pure powder of these 3 opioids. I like oral Oxy but not smoked. Morphine was good little bit too sedative. Hydromorphone was much more euphoric-more energetic-morphine like painkiller.

 

[paranoid android]

Going on dilaudid is asking for a bitch of a addiction imo. The stuff is good for sure but its so short acting you have to redose so often

 

[Jnowhere]

Everybody is different, I have been on Oxy for almost as long as you. Their effects, do not help much anymore. Way back when, a higher dose of oxycodone might be the solution.
However, IV dilauded in a hospital, was the best pain relief I ever had, for about 2 1/2 hours.
That said, I don't know how long the pills last, I was thinking of trying to get my doctor to switch me. But everyone is different, so you need to consider if the dilauded will last you through the day.
Also it might be like oral morphine(which I took along with oxycodone but stopped, didn't do much and the pain lessoned) and how a persons body metabolizes dilauded might vary from person to person.
Ask your doctor if you can switch back to the oxycodone if you decide you don't want the dilauded.
I am in a similar situation but, I have a bad liver and am scared the oral dilauded may not work. After all the hospital I got IV dilauded only would give 1 MG, which was enough but didn't last very long, the fact that they make 8mg tablets means a low bioavailibility.
They would only give 2mg to patients in the ICU who were hooked up to heart monitors.
I personally would switch, if I knew they would work, and that the daily dosage would be enough.
I am not here to make judgements, however if you want to use them as suppositories remember this, they go straight into the bloodstream.
Obviously you are not opiate naive, but(no pun intended) you could overdose. I would only use a pill orally.
Also plugging them could easily raise your tolerance, which is not good.

 

[Parabolan]

I guess people are different, cuz I would choose Dilaudid over Oxycodone any day of the week.

You should try plugging Dilaudid, it has a rush to it.

 

[Dextro .45]

IV injected Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) is a VERY potent Opioid analgesic, slightly to moderately more potent than Diacetylmorphine (Heroin)

Oxycodone is synthesized from theBaine which is a stimulant like opioid narcotic analgesic …..unlike the rest of morphine derived opioids (Morphious-Greek god of dreams)

Oxycodone is hands down the most euphoric pleasurable opioid I’ve ever taken in my life

Oxycodone & Methylphenidate (Ritalin) the only 2 drugs to ever give me true Euphoria….the ultimate oral Speedball

 

[Rachrach]

Hi all. I hope thisnis in the right place. Returning member.
I have been on:
oxycodone 10mg 3x/day
Oxycontin 10mg 2x/day
I kicked the Contin...didnt last 12 hours and to dependent. The IR's i can juggle easier.
now I incorporate
Advil 2 - 2pills wx/day (the shit works!)
Especially since I get almost zero relief from oxy.
I was snorting oxy a lot. Until I realized it was all mental and didn't provide actual relief.

I was prescribed Dilaudid 8mg 3x/day after a surgery. I cut them and ate 4mg when I was expecting some heavy stuff. I crush and snort a little here and there. Before major social and a little.before sleep. I have the chance to get it again....

My point is/questions are:
I've been on the oxy for 8 years. I take them NOT to feel shitty instead of actual pain relief. My doctor offersd to switch me to Dilaudid 8mg 3x/day again. I feel like a million bucks on half 4mg.
So... is that a good idea? I.have some oxy as reserved in case I might need them... but I shouldn't right?
And also I've heard that Dilaudid is more bio effective intra nasal. Or is the same as oral.
And... I tend to suck and chew my oxy's... is that considered Oral? Or does oral refer to swallowed and better ingested route?
And one for the greatest points of my day is sucking on advil 2's.... is that wasting the actual pain relief? Am I just falling for a mental effect?
Thanks to anyone Still reading and responding.
Sorry again if this is the wrong place. I tired to absorb the rules.
Thanks all.
-Doc
Is there a better route I'm not thinking of?
I'm open to plugging, NOT IV.

Perhaps someone else already pointed this out but, Oxycontin IS Oxycodone. The former is simply a brandname. The latter is the actual active substance.

 

[Rachrach]

For others discussing bioavailability of hydromorphone, folks tend to conflate terms which confuses the issue. "Insufflation" & "Intranasally" are not synonymous. The latter refers to a pharmaceutical preperation dosed through a specific device. Even there the bioavailability averages 54%. Oral bioavailability is 50% but only on average. It can be 74%.

When you crush tablets you are ingesting binder & filler along with active product. You are never going to obtain the 4% advantage, and there is a chance that orally alone you can surpass the intransal figure.

 

[OceansState]

Dilaudid is a serious pain med. I was given it for major surgery after morphine shots wouldn't touch the pain. Was on IV in the hospital then transferred over to pills when I left for about a month. Good stuff if you really need it, bad stuff if you really don't.

 

[paranoid android]

Unless yolu are going to iv them oxy is probably the better bet. I prefer dilaudid but i always iv them.

Dont however start iving because you can get dilly as thats what i did and that iv habit lasted over a decade

 

[Keif' Richards]

You will meet a lot of people who prefer Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) over Oxycodone (Percocet; Oxycontin). In fact, I believe most people with experience would choose Hydromorphone over Oxycontin, in both the realm of recreational use and pain management. I had lots of surgeries in my childhood (like 18-19 requiring full anesthesia and post-op Opioids) so I'm pretty familiar with Opioids both as recreational substances and also as pain relievers. I would choose Hydromorphone over Oxycodone any day at equipotent doses.

Everyone will have a different way of explaining their experiences. I feel like my best explanation is like this: Oxycodone relieved pain, but it felt more in my head (like mental euphoria) than in my body. It felt like Oxycodone was underneath my skin, but Hydromorphone was in my fucking spine and radiating to all corners of my body from my spine. It felt like my full body was feeling the drug, whereas Oxycodone was barely underneath my skin. I hope that esoteric explanation means something to you. Oxycodone felt good and relieved pain, but Hydromorphone was like being rocked in your mother's arms and nothing can hurt you. That was always how I felt about Oxycodone, a good drug for abusing and an effective analgesic, but not one that can compete with your Morphine and its derivatives.

Now onto the more scientific side of things.

Oxycodone is fairly unique among commonly used Opioids, as its bioavailability is essentially the same between the oral route and the injection (parenteral) routes. Hydromorphone follows the typical Morphine-derivative bioavailability ratios in that:

Oral: ~33%
Rectal: ~30%-40%
Intranasal: ~66%
Injection: ~100%

Take note of the fact that rectal administration doesn't provide any benefits in terms of bioavailability. This is also a fairly uncommon phenomenon among drugs in general, as rectal administration of a given substance, as a rule, is almost always significantly more potent than the oral route. Likewise, Morphine can be a little funky when administered rectally and you'll find a lot of conjecture in the available literature on this topic.

Now, if you're taking 50mg Oxycodone per day, this is equal to ~75 Morphine Milligram Equivalent (a good metric to get used to using) whereas your 24mg Hydromorphone orally equals ~96 Morphine Milligram Equivalent. So, even if you stick strictly to the oral route, this change represents a ~25% increase in your daily Opioid intake, which is nothing to sneeze at at all.

There is a big difference between telling someone how to have a good time with a drug and advising someone on how to use a drug for its intended effects in the mot efficient way. For Opioids to be used long-term and maintain their efficacy, a person has to have total discipline in their intake. You need to use the lowest dosages possible at all times. You have to be responsible. It's not always easy.

The notion that maybe you will try insufflating the Hydromorphone is an idea that I would try to put out of your head immediately. By insufflating the drug instead of taking it orally, you will be effectively doubling your intake overnight. This might feel great for a week or two, but then you will start becoming tolerant and after a month, you're going to be not only back where you started, you will be at a significant disadvantage. In both the recreational and medical sense, Opioids seem to produce diminishing returns as the dosage is escalated.

What this would look like in your case, is becoming dependent upon the new 2x higher dosage of Hydromorphone to be at an even keel and you will likely be in more pain than you were at the 50% dosage. From here, the tendency is often to use more and more and those diminishing returns get smaller and smaller. The end stage for this sort of thing is a person in constant chronic pain while also needing high dosages of Opioids simply to function even with that pain.

For right now, I would absolutely just see what happens with the new prescription without messing with it at all. As mentioned previously, you're already getting a 25% boost in your overall Opioid intake. I feel like this is worthy of a trial run prior to seeking out more potent means of administration. When you switched between different ROA's while on Oxycodone, this wasn't incredibly significant due to the aforementioned stable bioavailability between different ROA's.

Now, if for instance you were trying to conserve your medication, it's not a crazy idea to insufflate half of a given oral dosage. This isn't something I would recommend trying unless you have a legitimate concern over your medication supply. The faster onset of action and faster peak in blood levels can be a psychologically reinforcing thing in itself, so don't mess with this unless you have a legitimate concern, that's my advice.

Finally, your questions regarding drugs in your mouth. For most drugs, the mucous/saliva membranes of the mouth and sublingual region allows for efficient absorption, however this is limited by the relatively slow process and the limited area involved. What this means is that anything that doesn't get swallowed, will generally be absorbed into the blood stream through the various surfaces of your mouth.

When a drug is placed under the tongue for absorption, this is termed Sublingual Administration. When a drug is absorbed through the surfaces of the mouth's interior, this is termed Buccal Administration. This is how, for instance, Nicotine Gum/Lozenges are absorbed. It's also how cigar smoke is imbibed even when a person does not inhale. The drug Buprenorphine (Suboxone; Subutex) is a drug commonly administered under the tongue. In general, substances absorbed through the mouth will have a higher bioavailability than drugs swallowed. So, there is nothing to be concerned about, either you're absorbing the drugs through your mouth or you're swallowing them, so suck to your heart's content.

 

[Dextro .45]

Dilaudid is a serious pain med. I was given it for major surgery after morphine shots wouldn't touch the pain. Was on IV in the hospital then transferred over to pills when I left for about a month. Good stuff if you really need it, bad stuff if you really don't.

Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) 7.5mg oral is equal to 1.5mg IV injected

I was started on Dilaudid 2mg IR & Hydromorph-Contin 9mg XR orally after using Oxy-IR 5mg & OC 10mg for months. For serious pain, IV Dilaudid is hard to beat.