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Opioids Difference between heroin #3 and 4

B

bluntman1993

Greenlighter
Joined
Dec 10, 2010
Messages
16
Can someone tell me what the difference are. Which type of black tar and which type is brown powder/rock
 
Heroin#1 is really morphine. Heroin#2 is Heroin base, the most common type from Afghanistan.It's smoked but can be injected with an acid like citric or vinegar. Heroin#3 is a eutectic mixture(lower melting point like ice/salt) of heroin hydrochloride and caffeine, sometimes barbiturates, and sometimes with quinine and traces of strychnine.#3 is from Burma and most common in east asia. It's for smoking but can be sniffed or IV. Heroin#4 is Heroin hydrochloride, most common from Burma or Colombia.It's for snorting or IV. Some call Afghan #2 heroin #3 heroin because they're both smokable. Black tar is the hydrochloride so is technically #4, just not purified as good as Burmese/Colombian.

The number system is an out of date categorization of heroin in Vietnam made by the DEA in the 1970's.
 
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Ok the one i got is like powder hardened into a ball. is it still possible to snort it if u crush it up into a powder? or would it be better for me just to smoke it?
 
If you live west of the Mississippi in the US or some east coast states like Ohio it's tar. It comes from Mexico. It'd be best to smoke but some dissolve it in water and squirt it up their nose. Does it break into powder or stay together? If you live on the east coast of the US and it's powdery it's #4 that's best to snort. Also sometimes Black tar is cut into a powder, usually called mud, it can be snorted or smoked, or in Texas cheese for snorting. And if you live in Europe, Africa and some parts of Asia you get #2. It's best to smoke it, though some claim it can be snorted. Does it dissolve in water? If it does it's #4, if it doesn't it's #2.

Heroin hcl aka #4 burns up when smoked, like powder coke does. But #2 or #3 should be smoked. #3 isn't that common anymore so I doubt you have that. Black tar heroin is just so impure that it can be smoked, and pretty much has to be if you want to avoid needles.
 
Yup, #2 is what most often is seen in west Europe(Holland-French-Spain etc.) Dissolves not very good in water(prolly only some cuts dissolving) and vapes really well&even when smoked of tin foil.
 
I think you got it all wrong, #1 and #2 do not exist as Heroin, they are parts of the production process, the only Heroin that exists is #3, which is the unfinished product in base-form, and #4, the end-product, in salt form. About Black Thar I don't know anything, I must admit... But I'm quite sure 1 and 2 are in no way at all Heroin yet.

Also, #4 can come from Afghan as well and is just as well present in Europe, tho #3 is more common indeed. The H4 I have is Afghan and is a bit white with a pink-like color.

Furthermore, you can definitely sniff H3, where I am from (Amsterdam, the Netherlands or Holland) possession of any drug is legal, we can get them tested in professional laboratories, and they confirm that H3 can be sniffed, tho it will not give the same rush as when it's smoked (let alone when injected) it will absorb more of the H and the nodding off is stronger and lasts longer when sniffed instead of smoked (and it's more easy to OD when sniffing H3 than when smoked). (over here we call it basen, instead of smoking, because smoking over here means you would smoke it in a cigarette, not off tin foil)

I like to know as much as I can about the drugs I use, so I'm still looking for the complete and correct explanation for the reason why a base like H3 can be snorted efficiently...

But main point: 1 and 2 are NOT Heroin, look it up.

Kind regards.
 
#1= morphine either purified hcl or crude base from opium.... I'm not sure.
#2= crudely opium or morphine conversion leaving 3/6-mam and dam. Better known as black tar
#3= dam base
#4= dam hcl


If I'm not mistaken that is how it breaks down. At least explained to me a while ago. Plus #3 on the dark net is base form usually.
 
tacodude said:
#1= morphine either purified hcl or crude base from opium.... I'm not sure.
#2= crudely opium or morphine conversion leaving 3/6-mam and dam. Better known as black tar
#3= dam base
#4= dam hcl


If I'm not mistaken that is how it breaks down. At least explained to me a while ago. Plus #3 on the dark net is base form usually.
Click to expand...

Black tar is not equivalent to heroin #3. Black tar is produced using a different process than was used in southeast Asia, appeared on the heroin market after the numbering schema was developed by the DEA, and does not correspond to any one of those four types of heroin.

Heroin #1 is not the same as morphine. Why would morphine be labeled as a type of heroin? That doesn't make any sense! Heroin number 1 is the unpurified product of morphine acetylation; heroin number 2 is purified heroin base, which is used to produce heroin #3 (by mixing with caffeine etc) or heroin #4 (by purification and conversion to the HCl salt). Most users would never come in contact with #1 or #2. However, the DEA needed a way to track and differentiate all the forms in their databases when they came across samples.
 
The heroin numbering system is stupid, inaccurate, and does not reflect reality in all forms. It was created by the DEA to describe the manufacture of and movement of heroin along the supply chain. You can ignore #1 and #2.

#3 is what you see in Europe, its base, need an acid to IV, good for smoking. The reason they have #3 over there is probably a mixture of geography and marketing(smoke able, don't have to use a needle, and less likely for naive users to OD, and its proximity to the middle east). And #4 is hcl, what we have in the eastern US.

You can try to squeeze black tar into the numbering system, but its stupid to do so as it was never intended to describe black tar.

#3 is not base mixed with caffeine, it would be pointless to do so, you can already smoke base without caffeine. And its not hcl with caffeine, as #3 is what they have in the UK and europe, where you need citric, you wouldn't need citric to dissolve hcl and caffeine. Although you can make #4 smokeable by adding caffeine, it is not its own entity on the #1-#4 scheme.
 
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Mananas said:
I like to know as much as I can about the drugs I use, so I'm still looking for the complete and correct explanation for the reason why a base like H3 can be snorted efficiently...
Click to expand...

The reason is actually very simple: it's absorbed through your nose. It's the premise (or lack of) that's wrong.

You're assuming that because #3 isn't soluble in water, it won't be availed through your nose - but something does not need to be water soluble for that ROA.

The fact is that your nasal membrane is made up partially of lipids (fat) which are, in effect, a non-polar solvent of sorts (because lipids themselves are non-polar). Similarly, that #3 would dissolve in vegetable oil if you were crazy enough to do that.

Interestingly, water soluble molecules are absorbed a bit different by your nasal membrane. I stole this last paragraph from another site - Google it if you want the source, along with a very short video with illustrated examples of these two absorption methods:

Fat-soluble molecules, such as steroids, alcohols, and some vitamins, can dissolve in the lipid portion of the membrane, which is how they diffuse into and out of the cell. Water-soluble molecules, however, cannot pass through the hydrophobic middle portion of the phospholipid bilayer. Instead, they must diffuse through membrane channels. Even then, only ions or very small molecules can fit through such channels.
 
Coolwhip said:
The heroin numbering system is stupid, inaccurate, and does not reflect reality in all forms. It was created by the DEA to describe the manufacture of and movement of heroin along the supply chain. You can ignore #1 and #2.

#3 is what you see in Europe, its base, need an acid to IV, good for smoking. The reason they have #3 over there is probably a mixture of geography and marketing(smoke able, don't have to use a needle, and less likely for naive users to OD, and its proximity to the middle east). And #4 is hcl, what we have in the eastern US.

You can try to squeeze black tar into the numbering system, but its stupid to do so as it was never intended to describe black tar.

#3 is not base mixed with caffeine, it would be pointless to do so, you can already smoke base without caffeine. And its not hcl with caffeine, as #3 is what they have in the UK and europe, where you need citric, you wouldn't need citric to dissolve hcl and caffeine. Although you can make #4 smokeable by adding caffeine, it is not its own entity on the #1-#4 scheme.
Click to expand...

The caffeine definitely needs to be added or the Heroin would not roll down the foil and burn up instead of being able of inhaling the active components. The numbering system is not stupid at all, you just used Google and one of the first sites shown says that, a very not trustworthy site... The system is used to describe steps in the production process, from purifying the raw Opium to raffining nr. 3 to nr. 4, while 1 and 2 are not yet Heroin.

Tar is very low purity type of Heroin and has another production process, hence it is not categorized by this system.

The purity, color and type of Heroin depends on the region of production, where a) poppies do not make the same amount of Opium and with differences in for example how much Codeine is present or not and b) the production process. Also types of use are come to be due to where a type of using just happens to be common or not.
 
I didn't use google, nor do I know what site you are even talking about.

Nothing in your post contradicted what I said, except possibly #3 containing caffiene as well, and I can see how this would make it much easier to smoke although theoretically it shouldn't be required, but either way my overall point was the addition of caffeine or lack thereof is irrelevant to the numbering scheme. If it makes you happier I can rephrase what I said to make it more accurate. Using the heroin number system for anything other than its intended purpose is stupid. i.e. unless you are a DEA agent from 30 years ago, and even then it had to be applied very narrowly to not fall apart. We would all be better off if people just forgot it even existed, and just identified it as either hcl or base.
 
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Imho the numbering system isn’t very useful.

All that matters is whether it is freebase or salt, and the degree of purity. Tar is more or less an entirely different substance than heroin common found in New England or Europe, I mean it is heroin but it generally has a number of other actives (albeit related to morphine/heroin).

I mean, the numbering system is useful to a degree, but it’s pretty limited and more or less outdated, especially when current trends opioid use are considered.
 
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