Childhood dissociative experience and adult use of dissociative drugs

[GumbyClaymation]

Wondering if anyone reading has experienced similar. When I was young, I used to have recurring experiences where I felt like I was falling out of my body. I don't believe I've ever talked to anyone about it. As an adult, I've enjoyed DXM, a bit of ketamine and more recently abused MXE. Especially the MXE felt like a familiar space, and I wouldn't recognize how fucked up I'd get, then interact with other people when I thought I was sober.

Anyone else experience this link? I feel I need to stop, and that there's nothing to be gained, but keep going back because I think I'll resolve something from my past.

 

[AA357]

Tread carefully. You sound like the kind of guy who might end up on YouTube running naked through the streets and fighting cops on this kind of drug.

 

[jason7]

Maybe try DMT. The elves will explain all.

 

[GumbyClaymation]

Tread carefully. You sound like the kind of guy who might end up on YouTube running naked through the streets and fighting cops on this kind of drug.

Thanks for the warning, but I don't think its in the cards. I am always laying down during the peak if its a high dose. At low doses or on the comedown, I'll walk unsteadily and slur my speech without realizing it, but I'm pretty much there cognitively. One time I did my taxes while on 100 mg with no errors.

 

[AA357]

Thanks for the warning, but I don't think its in the cards. I am always laying down during the peak if its a high dose. At low doses or on the comedown, I'll walk unsteadily and slur my speech without realizing it, but I'm pretty much there cognitively. One time I did my taxes while on 100 mg with no errors.

Cool. I'd still be careful though. What worries me is this line:

"I wouldn't recognize how fucked up I'd get, then interact with other people when I thought I was sober." - that does NOT sound good.

When I was given propofol IV in hospital, the doctors had to restrain me. Apparently I blacked out and kept trying to escape from my bed. And that's just propofol... God knows what I'd get up to on very high dose MXE or PCP.

 

[psood0nym]

I'm sure by "sober" GumbyClaymation meant "felt in control" (correct me if I'm wrong). Dissociatives have inhibition-lowering effects, plus MXE induces hypomania, adding confidence to the mix. So the behavior described isn't surprising.

Sensations of motion are common on dissociatives, and NMDA antagonists block many signals from the body to the brain. It's not surprising that MXE reminds you of this "falling out of body" experience from childhood either.

I feel I need to stop, and that there's nothing to be gained, but keep going back because I think I'll resolve something from my past.

That's how MXE's psychological addiction works: rationalization i.e., "I'm dosing again to accomplish something important." (especially when that something is vaguely defined). Unless you have strong reason to believe your childhood experiences were intimately associated with repressing something disturbing you're unlikely to resolve anything by approximating the past state with a drug. Also, most of MXE's more impressive effects tend to disappear with the tolerance that comes from overuse, including the "out of body" sensations.

 

[GumbyClaymation]

Actually, I did indeed really think that I was back to sober on many occasions. The confidence inducing effects you mention were surely a contributor.

As for resolving issues, I was abused as a child, and in hindsight think that may have induced my dissociative states. But that's indeed a vague sort of goal, and I have probably been chasing nothing.

Unfortunately, this has led to bad relationship issues with me lying to cover up use, and I probably need to stop all drugs (I believe I have used psychs responsibly in the past.)

 

[psood0nym]

Actually, I did indeed really think that I was back to sober on many occasions. The confidence inducing effects you mention were surely a contributor.

As for resolving issues, I was abused as a child, and in hindsight think that may have induced my dissociative states. But that's indeed a vague sort of goal, and I have probably been chasing nothing.

Unfortunately, this has led to bad relationship issues with me lying to cover up use, and I probably need to stop all drugs (I believe I have used psychs responsibly in the past.)

It is almost certainly a good idea to stop all recreational drug use, as you suspect. Trauma induced dissociative states can be profound. There are case studies of individuals who go so far as to perceive themselves outside of their bodies as a coping mechanism (e.g. their perspective is from the corner of the room watching themselves). Of course these people cannot tell how many fingers are being held up behind their heads, but they've nevertheless seemingly called on extreme cognitive resources to produce an ongoing perception that conflicts with their optical input. Dissociative drugs are far too easy to use as an escape to help most people overcome some trauma that they have a history of naturally dissociating themselves from.

I think what you may have in mind with regard to using MXE to resolve these issues is state dependent memory. Famously it's said "if you studied drunk you'll do better taking the test drunk." This is true to a point. By recreating a cognitive context we can marshal associations in memory that on average cohere more than they would otherwise (to a point).

But you were a child when this abuse occurred. That is a context so radically different that I seriously doubt that re-creating a vaguely associated mind state as an adult with a drug that is extremely easy to abuse will ever be productive. If you can find a willing therapist, and you truly believe a drug can help you (after months of sober reflection), MDMA or psychedelic (e.g. LSD, mushrooms) assisted therapy may help you resolve this part of your past. I wish you the best.