Treatment Bipolar disorder and medication

[Juicewrldfan]

If you have bipolar diaorder or have extensive knowledge about it and treatment, how have you managed/functioned without meds verses with meds. I guess meds just always make me feel worse for some reason. And I really am not so sure I have it. My therapist if 7 years does not seem to think so and when I asked this new psychiatrist that saw me for 5 minutes before telling me I’m manic and would like me to go into the hospital for a bit to get stabilized. 5 minutes!

And there were zero safety concerns and never are. So hospitalization was silly for me. I understand some get so panic that they need it but I function very well. Just my wife gaslit me into thinking I was manic because she would lash out at me after work all the time putting me down for no reason and recently I said no more because it makes me start believing the things she says when she puts me down for example- “your a dumbass for calling roadside assistance and now we have a claim”

And as soon as I started defending myself she says it’s not her and it’s me because I’m manic. Gaslit me. And has been acting like this for years.

Especially when I have been diagnosed and meds helped for adhd but I’d end up abusing them so can’t take 1st line meds and I tell them that upfront nowadays. (Recently started doing that)

Additionally, I tend to take kratom for its stimulating effects which I don’t find to be overpowering as with amphetamine like substances. And I like to before social encounters and he saw me in an induced state ontop of being very anxious about meeting with him because psychs can really fuck you up if they don’t know what they doing or don’t do their due diligence in diagnosing. I feel that too many of them just like to try different meds until they find one that helps them they say it helped so that’s their diagnosis.

I’m cool in that. Probably abandoning this psychiatrist and going back to my GP and ask for Clonidine for hyperactivity.

There are some good psychs out there but few and far between.

 

[Eryximachus]

I have a bipolar diagnosis, but looking back - I didn't have major mood problems until I got into anabolic steroids around 2011. By 2012, I was on lithium. Then in 2017, I was on seroquel and clonazepam. I was much more aggressive after this time, probably due to the low dose of Seroquel I was taking (200mg or less). A lot of psychiatrists are not familiar with the research that low doses of the drug can actually cause mania. Further, there is no evidence doses less than 400mg helps with bipolar stabilization. With other mood stabilizers, 300mg can help with depression. That's all there is.

The worst thing about Seroquel for me is it caused more compulsive behavior, especially with cocaine and amphetamine. Which led to more benzos. Today, I'm still on Seroquel but also with carbamazepine and my goal is to go carbamazepine only and eventually try to be free of drugs completely.

I've said before you seemed manic, but it could be the actual bipolar drugs are causing mania. Withdrawal can present like mania, especially benzo withdrawal or opioid withdrawal. I haven't been free, long term, from drugs since 2010. Interestingly, I had some manic moments then from taking DMAA pre workout supplements.

It is worth being clean from everything for like a year and giving it a shot, but make sure you have a WEEKLY therapist you trust who can tell you if you are losing insight and that you probably should consider going back on meds.

I told you in another post, give carbamazepine a try. Considering it has no major side effects, I don't think it is used enough. My biggest problem has always been aggression, and it works really, really well. Hang in there man.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

I have a bipolar diagnosis, but looking back - I didn't have major mood problems until I got into anabolic steroids around 2011. By 2012, I was on lithium. Then in 2017, I was on seroquel and clonazepam. I was much more aggressive after this time, probably due to the low dose of Seroquel I was taking (200mg or less). A lot of psychiatrists are not familiar with the research that low doses of the drug can actually cause mania. Further, there is no evidence doses less than 400mg helps with bipolar stabilization. With other mood stabilizers, 300mg can help with depression. That's all there is.

The worst thing about Seroquel for me is it caused more compulsive behavior, especially with cocaine and amphetamine. Which led to more benzos. Today, I'm still on Seroquel but also with carbamazepine and my goal is to go carbamazepine only and eventually try to be free of drugs completely.

I've said before you seemed manic, but it could be the actual bipolar drugs are causing mania. Withdrawal can present like mania, especially benzo withdrawal or opioid withdrawal. I haven't been free, long term, from drugs since 2010. Interestingly, I had some manic moments then from taking DMAA pre workout supplements.

It is worth being clean from everything for like a year and giving it a shot, but make sure you have a WEEKLY therapist you trust who can tell you if you are losing insight and that you probably should consider going back on meds.

I told you in another post, give carbamazepine a try. Considering it has no major side effects, I don't think it is used enough. My biggest problem has always been aggression, and it works really, really well. Hang in there man.

Yeah I asked him about that. He was like well I’d rather give you an AP and have me three to choose from. But nah, im already more level and back to baseline more than I was and without it.

And I just dont trust the type of doctor he presents as not really caring what I have to say about if I feel it’s an accurate assessment done in more or less 5 min.

He had nothing to say about that med you suggested when I asked about it. Idk why.

 

[thatmf]

If you have bipolar diaorder or have extensive knowledge about it and treatment, how have you managed/functioned without meds verses with meds. I guess meds just always make me feel worse for some reason. And I really am not so sure I have it. My therapist if 7 years does not seem to think so and when I asked this new psychiatrist that saw me for 5 minutes before telling me I’m manic and would like me to go into the hospital for a bit to get stabilized. 5 minutes!

And there were zero safety concerns and never are. So hospitalization was silly for me. I understand some get so panic that they need it but I function very well. Just my wife gaslit me into thinking I was manic because she would lash out at me after work all the time putting me down for no reason and recently I said no more because it makes me start believing the things she says when she puts me down for example- “your a dumbass for calling roadside assistance and now we have a claim”

And as soon as I started defending myself she says it’s not her and it’s me because I’m manic. Gaslit me. And has been acting like this for years.

Especially when I have been diagnosed and meds helped for adhd but I’d end up abusing them so can’t take 1st line meds and I tell them that upfront nowadays. (Recently started doing that)

Additionally, I tend to take kratom for its stimulating effects which I don’t find to be overpowering as with amphetamine like substances. And I like to before social encounters and he saw me in an induced state ontop of being very anxious about meeting with him because psychs can really fuck you up if they don’t know what they doing or don’t do their due diligence in diagnosing. I feel that too many of them just like to try different meds until they find one that helps them they say it helped so that’s their diagnosis.

I’m cool in that. Probably abandoning this psychiatrist and going back to my GP and ask for Clonidine for hyperactivity.

There are some good psychs out there but few and far between.

If you have the chance to go in as an inpatient, you could kill a few birds with one stone. Get the right meds, rest and recouperate and work out which meds do and don't work for you. It's hard for a psychiatrist you've seen for a few minutes to decide on exactly what medication you should be on. And then it's trial and error every appt or every month or two. And you're just gonna be miserable when switching meds. Not saying you're crazy but if you can get time off work/etc or have a few weeks to spare, an admission would be good (assuming you don't have to pay out of pocket for it?).

But seriously, I'd prefer to go in for a couple of weeks and get the right medication over spending months and months figuring out and the guess work with your psychiatrist.

 

[Madness]

I agree with @thatmf . It took me a very serious mixed-manic episode to get me finally diagnosed. They immediately put me on lithium, and I felt much more stable.

I am very confident I do infact have bipolar 1. In college it started out pretty nice feeling actually.. a couple weeks to a month of needing a couple of hours sleep a week, and feeling the best I've ever felt in my life (although not anywhere near as rational as I usually am).

Any way, it soon developed in to less euphoric mood swings, mostly seasonal but very dramatic shifts on mood. My mania was just out of this world, and something I could not justify as anything other than mania.

My 2 twin first cousins have BP. I also had a pretty bad unchecked concussion where I blacked out for at least 5-10 minutes snowboarding. Didn't know where I was when i woke up until I saw my family like an hour later thankfully.

Anyway, without 400mg lamical, even after missing one nights dose, I can absolutely feel like I am spiraling out of control.

Hope you stay well, don't be afraid of inpatient, they will be respectful if you do the same, doctors largely are there to help, just be as honest as you can with your symptoms and let them know when things don't work. It took me probably a year to find what worked for me.

Much love dude..

 

[Juicewrldfan]

If you have the chance to go in as an inpatient, you could kill a few birds with one stone. Get the right meds, rest and recouperate and work out which meds do and don't work for you. It's hard for a psychiatrist you've seen for a few minutes to decide on exactly what medication you should be on. And then it's trial and error every appt or every month or two. And you're just gonna be miserable when switching meds. Not saying you're crazy but if you can get time off work/etc or have a few weeks to spare, an admission would be good (assuming you don't have to pay out of pocket for it?).

But seriously, I'd prefer to go in for a couple of weeks and get the right medication over spending months and months figuring out and the guess work with your psychiatrist.

Yeah. Just my therapist of 7 years thinks that hospital stays destabilize me more than help me.

I don’t as in and out of them up until over a year ago when I quit psych meds because they just weren’t helpful. Now if I see her Monday and she tells me she wants me to then I’ll consider it again.

I just don’t think she will. I don’t think she thinks I have bipolar but I’m not ruling it out. Trying to keep an open mind. It could be bipolar 2 but I doubt it.

Really think it’s a combination of starting a new med (testosterone max dose) and recently quitting stims. I think that’s why I seemed high energy and manic coupled with anxiety and PTSD and perhaps ADHD which I do carry that diagnosis but wonder if it’s mostly tied into PTSD.

I can’t go inpatient because i start a new job tomorrow and my family kind of depends on it.

 

[Madness]

Really think it’s a combination of starting a new med (testosterone max dose) and recently quitting stims. I think that’s why I seemed high energy and manic coupled with anxiety and PTSD and perhaps ADHD which I do carry that diagnosis but wonder if it’s mostly tied into PTSD.

For what it's worth, testosterone made me feel slightly manic. I could sleep on it though. Legitimate inability to sleep when needed is a BP Hallmark.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

For what it's worth, testosterone made me feel slightly manic. I could sleep on it though. Legitimate inability to sleep when needed is a BP Hallmark.

Yeah I sleep good actually at first it was just 5-6 hours but I slept 8 last night and feel rested. Definitely still felt tired on 5-6 looking back

 

[Madness]

Just to reiterate my above post, when I was in my most dramatic mania, I slept only a couple hours *a week*. Maybe 4 or 5 now that I really take the time to recall. It felt like very few though. I remember actually counting the hours each week because I was afraid something was very wrong with me.

Now not to say bipolar doesn't have variations. But I would look at it like this:

Are your moods heavily effecting your ability to function beyond what is reasonable for you to work on and handle without external intervention?

If so, take the time to find medication that can help ease the symptoms and allow you to achieve the things you know you are capable of achieveing.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Just to reiterate my above post, when I was in my most dramatic mania, I slept only a couple hours *a week*. Maybe 4 or 5 now that I really take the time to recall. It felt like very few though. I remember actually counting the hours each week because I was afraid something was very wrong with me.

Now not to say bipolar doesn't have variations. But I would look at it like this:

Are your moods heavily effecting your ability to function beyond what is reasonable for you to work on and handle without external intervention?

If so, take the time to find medication that can help ease the symptoms and allow you to achieve the things you know you are capable of achieveing.

Thanks man.

My Moods are positive and I reject negative emotions when they have no use as much as possible these days and refocus on things that make my mood positive and consequently positive emotions.

Not to say I don’t have a bad day or two the last two weeks but that was primarily because I relapsed one day on stims. I didn’t binge tho I stopped there which is huge for me. Still want to stay away completely but it was in my face and were mine so it was challenging.

When people say I sound manic I really think it’s just hyperactivity. It’s that I’m goal oriented and living with intent and made alot of necessary changes but I had a life changing event in my family in December that motivated me to do that and woke me up.

I also started TRT which is known to increase confidence and drive.


So all these things together can look like mania I would think. When people say I’m manic it’s not because I’m angry and irritable or anything like that. It’s because I am a social person and I get starved of that so when I get a chance to talk I get anxious like no one is going to want to hear what I have to say so I better get it out now type thing.

So yeah pressured speech I guess would be the symptom but that’s not uncommon with adhd either. The other primary had for is I used to get really concerned I’d forget what I was trying to say in the midst of it.

And I am already more back balanced but yes, I will discuss it more thoroughly Monday with my therapist if 7 years and see what she actually thinks about it. I really doubt she thinks I’m bipolar as she never told me I was or said I need meds.

 

[tokayeahok]

I’m a Dx’d bi-polar and not on any mood stabilizers or anti depressants. well, i do take gabapentin for mood which helps a lot. i’m manic a lot of the times (not severely, and i’m able to luckily push that manic energy into being productive most times - going for a walk, doing household chores, working on art/music) without infringing on anyone else or going on maaaad ramblings of delusions. lol.


exercise has helped me a lot with a strong supplement stack, good healthy food, interpersonal connections that are strong ie family and a few very close friends

that’s just me personally though. i don’t want to come across anti-medication because it is there for a reason and helps a lot of people. this is just what has been working for me.

also was a fentanyl addict for the better part of 7 ish years.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

I’m a Dx’d bi-polar and not on any mood stabilizers or anti depressants. well, i do take gabapentin for mood which helps a lot. i’m manic a lot of the times (not severely, and i’m able to luckily push that manic energy into being productive most times - going for a walk, doing household chores, working on art/music) without infringing on anyone else or going on maaaad ramblings of delusions. lol.


exercise has helped me a lot with a strong supplement stack, good healthy food, interpersonal connections that are strong ie family and a few very close friends

that’s just me personally though. i don’t want to come across anti-medication because it is there for a reason and helps a lot of people. this is just what has been working for me.

also was a fentanyl addict for the better part of 7 ish years.

Exactly, I do not believe all cases require or even benefit from psychiatric intervention. And just psychiatry is to medicine as alchemy is to chemistry to me. It’s archaic to me. Let’s guess and check with your brain chemistry and see if it makes you better or worse. Never anything made me better I’ll tell you that. But that’s just my experience and I’ve been in all kinds of meds. I will say that in Depakote i do remember having less racing.l thoughts but it’s hard on the liver. Risks doesn’t outweigh the benefits.

Tegretol was recommended but I see it is also thought to be hard on organs. I’m cool. What’s the point of I will only live another ten years. I’m cool.

I have a slightly compromised liver and my ast and alt are always elevated and have NAFLD.

I am willing to try TMS though and ketamine I’m fine with but it didn’t do much IV clinic so I doubt spravato would. It is dosed already which is why I considered it if I am ever suicidal again but I really haven’t been since going off psych meds.

The IV clinic I think I’m was under dosing me and maybe she was keeping it for herself because it’s her clinic and it never did anything at all. But it’s contraindicated with recent mania.

 

[Madness]

Everyone reacts differently.

And a whole lot of mental illness exist on a spectrum.

Again, you know yourself better than anyone. However doctors are there to help and there's no shame in asking.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Everyone reacts differently.

And a whole lot of mental illness exist on a spectrum.

Again, you know yourself better than anyone. However doctors are there to help and there's no shame in asking.

I agree completely. And in no way am I saying there’s no place for it. I’m just saying I haven’t had great experience yet with psychiatry. Honestly, has caused me more bad than good but maybe I just haven’t found the right thing.

Still probably been on 10-12 different meds for psychiatry.

I know psychiatry is necessary for certain illnesses and it truly is a spectrum of how severe it is.

I just got a real bad taste in my mouth when I met with that doctor this week I guess and with my girl gaslighting me kinda puts me off psychiatry right now but yeah if my therapists says she thinks I should I will greatly consider it but she has yet to say that so we will see tomorrow.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

Okay all, so I decided to try the medicine. Well, my therapist kinda didn’t leave me a choice. It was that or she was likely forcing me into the hospital but turns out everyone was right. I have been manic because I tried the abilify and only been taking it for a few days and I notice a difference already. Pretty significant difference.

So thank you all for taking the time out for me.

 

[Madness]

@Juicewrldfan - awesome, I love to hear that.

Yes instant relief is always a great feeling. Smart of you to stay open minded about it.

 

[Juicewrldfan]

@Juicewrldfan - awesome, I love to hear that.

Yes instant relief is always a great feeling. Smart of you to stay open minded about it.

Well wasn’t great at first. Took some time to get over and adjust to not being manic. That euphoric state feels like a moderate amphetamine dose and longer and less intense. It was like the perfect amphetamine dose my manic phase was.

But I hear they won’t always be the good kind of mania and mania can damage the brain I guess? Keep hearing that

 

[Madness]

Yeah I too have heard and experienced it getting less euphoric and less predictable in time.