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Carefully Calculated Suicide - A Philosophical Discussion
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RomanJ
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You don't know how lucky you are being born now.I'm 2021y man, that's why... You don't know how it is to live in hidden sight for that long!
Wtf? What voices i talk to? What are you talking about? Nan man i don't think that's cool because i think it's incurable and i have to deal with that two (we all are in some sort of way), knowing that it will never stop and only getting worse. You think this is about love man, well than maybe it is, but it's also about hate, fear, and good shit too, like joy, also bad like sadness, it's about life, otherwise their's nothing. And it's cool to be benevolent, i am two, at least i'm trying to, BUT i wouldn't be so much of a schizo/psycho/bipolar (call the Disease howerver you want) if i weren't also into deep sadism sometimes...
You say things will never stop and only get worse, I think your right in a way because every one of the 8 billion people have to go through a lot of shit to shake away they're 3D lives and habits. BUT when everyone goes through the process the levels of happiness and love on the other side are so nice and we will all get to feel that quite soon I'm guessing.
Welcome to the fourth density planet earth. It's about us coming together and helping each other in whatever way that is necessary.
Hearing voices will be the norm in a few decades.
RomanJ
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Do you really hate me? Because I love you as I can see myself in you as I was 20 years ago.That's benevolence!
I HATE YOU! And i hate your cake!
MydriHaze
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Ok i'll dissect you if you don't mind:
We're going toward Mass Extinction if you didn't know, i think that gaining hapiness and love in this life is some kinda a selfish act, like freedom it tends to intrud the ones of the others, sometime you just kinda love the cross, i mean why not, if this is just life, then it's just my life, so it really doesn't matter really on the 8B people there is... I mean there's people who fight for the sanity of a sick society, they deserve more love and happiness than me, they probably won't win at time though...
Your late,Jeff Benzos is going to accompany Grand Ma Wally Funk into space, i don't think she's gonna handle the peeling off of the rocketship, it's gonna be the heart, i bet my life on it!
Yeah well what you call "hearing voices" (i'm kinda positive that i understand what you mean..) is just an access to the collective inconscient, to god, to Rick, or to whatever you call it... Anyway, it's called the soul, you think you have one soul right? That your unique? Physically you are, mentally two, but WE ARE ONE SOUL, and that's precisely what medecine calls disease, the sentiment of loosing you identity because of it, even though you 1/3 right...
Nooo, but i don't like you either, i mean you just a stranger to me, i'm not gonna lie and tell you that your love declaration been a shock to me... Thanks though
Buuuut, we're going a little bit of topic now like @MsDiz sayed so if you wanna follow this conversation pm me, that's Irony, see?
RomanJ
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Jeff bezos, I'm sure I read recently that he has spent 130 BILLION dollars to launch his fancy rocket into space.
If I had access to 130billion dollars I would make sure It went to the people on the planet who are struggling the most.
The inequality is shite. His ex wife on the other hand balances things out a bit.
RomanJ
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Good for you mate, you've got balls.Ok i'll dissect you if you don't mind:
We're going toward Mass Extinction if you didn't know, i think that gaining hapiness and love in this life is some kinda a selfish act, like freedom it tends to intrud the ones of the others, sometime you just kinda love the cross, i mean why not, if this is just life, then it's just my life, so it really doesn't matter really on the 8B people there is... I mean there's people who fight for the sanity of a sick society, they deserve more love and happiness than me, they probably won't win at time though...
Your late,Jeff Benzos is going to accompany Grand Ma Wally Funk into space, i don't think she's gonna handle the peeling off of the rocketship, it's gonna be the heart, i bet my life on it!
Yeah well what you call "hearing voices" (i'm kinda positive that i understand what you mean..) is just an access to the collective inconscient, to god, to Rick, or to whatever you call it... Anyway, it's called the soul, you think you have one soul right? That your unique? Physically you are, mentally two, but WE ARE ONE SOUL, and that's precisely what medecine calls disease, the sentiment of loosing you identity because of it, even though you 1/3 right...
Nooo, but i don't like you either, i mean you just a stranger to me, i'm not gonna lie and tell you that your love declaration been a shock to me... Thanks though
Buuuut, we're going a little bit of topic now like @MsDiz sayed so if you wanna follow this conversation pm me, that's Irony, see?
MydriHaze
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That was cheap...
psy997
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@RomanJ and @MydriHaze
Is this your first time using a forum? It's basic forum etiquette to not derail threads, which the two of you have brilliantly done by starting and continuing a one-on-one conversation for almost 1.5 pages now.
Take your discussion elsewhere, either to PMs or a dedicated thread. Your irrelevant posting is not welcome in this thread.
MydriHaze
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You just makes things worst, that's why i liked his.her post instead of responding! But i won't do to you that pleasure, ooow no!!
EVERYBODY NOW PLEASE:
Close curtain.
(unless you are carefully calculating a suicide of course...)
RomanJ
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MydriHaze
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Fuck me, a simple bluelighter shut the fuck out of us, can you imagine how that could makes @MsDiz feel... For the sake of the goodwill corporation, i'll continue this conversation, fuck @psy997 and his MOD-complex!
Sooo... where were we?... Ah! :
I'M GONNA KILL MYSLEF!! I HAVE NO PLAN BUT I GOT A LOT OF MEDS AND ALCOHOL, I'M A THREAT TO MYSELF THEREFORE A THREAT TO SOCIETY!!!!
The only thing it's i don't know when exactly, i know where though...
RomanJ
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Fuck me, a simple bluelighter shut the fuck out of us, can you imagine how that could makes @MsDiz feel... For the sake of the goodwill corporation, i'll continue this conversation, fuck @psy997 and his MOD-complex!
Sooo... where were we?... Ah! :
I'M GONNA KILL MYSLEF!! I HAVE NO PLAN BUT I GOT A LOT OF MEDS AND ALCOHOL, I'M A THREAT TO MYSELF THEREFORE A THREAT TO SOCIETY!!!!
The only thing it's i don't know when exactly, i know where though...
Juvenile.finitelifeform
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Continuing living is a choice.
I dont see any issue in someone choosing to take their own life.
Life is a funny thing. We only know one thing and that is life but it doesnt imply we are stuck with only knowing this one thing if that one thing no longer serves our deeper more human aspects of our existence. There is a choice and that is choice is to end all knowing, at least within this physical manifestation and while conscious in a human body.
You have every right to flick the power switch. You are not here as a prisoner. You have a choice. And that is very liberating. Everyday you have vast amounts of choices and decisions to make. Which ones will you take? What happens if you end up at wanting to no longer have choices and make decisions?
Then so be it.
You have to also be able to see things from as many perspectives as possible in order to not get caught out relying solely on intellectual/analytical thinking. You cant explain everything in those modes of thinking and even if you can, it doesnt imply the fallout for all those that maybe dont see things like you did will be any less. It might even make it worse.
You have the draw the line somewhere and most definetly responsibility is needed in how you approach such a decision even when taking your own life. You might be gone but others wont be.
As for carefully planning out your death. It is pretty easy to end a human life. The only barrier is the will to do it. And when it comes to self, the will to destroy self as a conscious being in a human body is the biggest hurdle. Once you are over that hurdle, its smooth sailing.
There are approved and clinically recognized methods of ending your own life. Various euthanasia organizations offer resources on the most peaceful and humane ways to die, as determined by pain and damage done to the body in the process ie mutilation, dismemberment, significant injuries etc. One method I was keen on utilizing in my own personal crisis a few years ago was called "Amitryptaline Cocktail". It is a recognized method of euthanasia and some form of cocktail similiar if not identical to this one, are used today at euthanasia clinics. I wont go into detail but you essentially acquire several medications and then consume them and within 12-24 hours you are dead. One of the medications are benzos to knock you out, and you take enough to ensure the amitryptaline works its magic. This happens all the while when you are asleep so no pain at all. Completely unaware and viola, you never wake up.
I personally chose to live. That was 4 years ago. I went through several months of preperation and much of my daily life involved meditations on never waking up. I had got close to finding the point where I had no attachments to anything anymore and my life was preperation solely for the ritual that would be my death. It was a humbling experience that brought me new perspectives and made me see that along with every option there is also the end of everything that attaches itself to everything we do and really is just around the corner. We like to think it isnt but when you open yourself up to death and you being the defining factor in that happening, it makes you see things differently. I found a lot of peace in that period of time of my life.
That choice is always there. Regardless of how we make it, the difference between us engaging now on this forum and the end, is the difference between a breathing living body and one that is lifeless and can no longer engage. We are either here or we are not. That is our choice to make and it is a big choice at that, lets not play it down.
Life is, well, all of this and all of that. In fact life is everything that you can think of and can experience. It is all there is and there is everything in that. All there ever has been, all there is now and all there ever will be. For all our Western obsessions/clinging with/to life and material things and for all our collective insanity, life is a unique and rare opportunity. We are just these complex evolved apes who somehow became human. This rare evolution propelled us into experiencing life in seemingly infinite ways. Something so trivial seperates us from other animals. And this seperation is what makes us worlds apart, at least in our minds. And therein lies the possibilities, and there are many of them.
Flynnal
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Wrong. They use barbiturates like Nembutal, Seconal. They don't use other drugs because they are dismissed as impractical. Barbs will really fast, and they act like a general anaesthetic, so there will be no pain. That's what Dignitas uses and I am pretty sure that's what they use with Victoria's system here in Australia, but don't quote me on it, no one is allowed to tell us what medications they use, but I bet it's amylobarbitone which is a barbiturate with effects much like that of Nembutal just slower-acting.
Shady's Fox
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So what is this thread, in reality about? in tldr
From the perspective of the self, then it seems like ensuring your ending is euphoric- but anyone who has seen someone OD knows it's nothing pretty and sure doesn't look very glamorous. But from a purely philosophical perspective, nothing truly matters in the grand scheme. It wouldn't have made much of a difference if one dinosaur decided to overdose on opium in todays world. Probably wouldn't have made much of a difference if they all decided to do so collectively before the asteroid hit(or whatever happened, different discussion). The same is true with humans- in the grand scheme I'm not really sure anything "matters" as time will continue on regardless.
life is all about perspective really... you just have to choose the one you want to look through. The opposite of that is to look at life as a miracle and count every little blessing rather than every curse. Much easier said than done, but if humans survived things like slavery it gives me hope that it's possible to maintain a winning perspective through all the pain.
Likewise, there are plenty with things such as survivors guilt from an exact scenario and become suicidal as a result. Some may fear death- innately we all do, it's how we are wired as a species and have made it thus far along the chain of evolution, but it isn't those innate survival instincts that drives someone to suicide. I believe it's largely processed in the frontal cortex, where the brain seemingly ironicly overcomes its survival instincts out of some means of desperate self-preservation(removal from pain). It's usually not so much about not fearing death as it is not having a reason to live, or having a reason to want to die. I think it's a bit of a generalization to assume all who claim they don't fear death are liars, especially considering potential intoxication. I believe people are fickle in general and perhaps in the heat of the moment a statement like that might be entirely true.
The people trying to escape suffering would also probably be high on the list of those likely not to fear death. But as far as suicide being a cowards act- I don't think I said that although perhaps implied it. Regardless, I don't really think the coward part to be true, as a coward probably wouldn't take the final step. But I do think it's a way of escaping one's own responsibilities, particularly in the situation that you mentioned of a trader gone wrong. Not really the best example, as that trader could just take a normal job and live near or below the poverty line like a large percentage of the world. I've heard of almost identical stories except they ran up their credit before exiting the world, leaving their family to take on the financial burden. So it's not clear it's the pain of poverty these people are trying to escape- it could easily be the fall from grace and the embarrassment of doing so. Which, was the point I intended to make... very rarely does one commit suicide without passing on the pain to those closest.
To be fair according to this study, suicide rate is substantially higher for people living in poverty, but imo that has a lot more to do with the bs that come with poverty, so if we are not speaking on OP's situation, then no suicide isn't always hedonistic. Even still, I'd find it hard not to argue that it's passing on the pain maybe with very rare exception(terminally ill).
nznity
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Meh, as you grow older hoy realize that one gets overwhelmed by drugs. You're supposed to experience everything in life ti make it meaningful. When i discovered hxc drugs i thought ID never stop using but after years of beating myself up with em i said enough Is enough. On my deathbed i want to remember all kind of experiences not just my hedonistic days. I've had More pleasurable times without the need of syringes AND those memorias Will be with me foevsss.
